I'm not saying your experience is a lie, I'm saying your generalisation is a lie. You have a real-life factual first-hand experience and I never refuted that, I said that the generalisation that NHS is terrible for anything more complex than a "head cold and flu shot" is a lie...You honestly can't believe that, I don't know how you could believe that, if this was true, the NHS wouldn't even exist, it would collapse overnight. Can you not even see how extreme that example is? Can you not see why I take issue with it?

And I'll say again, millions of people simply cannot afford private, so they'd much rather NHS issues fixed. You can afford private. Aside from your extreme criticism, you speak from a position of privilege. You was told you have to wait 6 months so you said "fuck that" and went private...Cause the option is still there...To millions though, the option of going private is simply not an option for financial reasons...And for millions of people, they have positive experiences with the NHS.

So I ask again, why is having a public system but also the option of private, a bad thing? 

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I had a body brace too, at that age they tend to monitor, some cases won't require treatment at all and the rate of growth tends to be slow, body braces will usually fix the majority of cases that require treatment, I was just really unlucky and fuck all worked, Lol. The odds are very much in your kids favour though. I actually started off in one hospital for the brace and then got moved to a different one about an hour away from home

Your daughter will hopefully be fine, like I said, the odds are in her favour, I was REALLY unlucky.

Over a decade of voting for less migration policies but no one gets what they voted for. Fanciful people on the left seeing no problems with this and have no solutions to offer, just follow Angela Merkel's "we can do this" nonsense without actually telling us how we can actually do it. (even though I am not really sure if these people actually mean what they say or just being partisan, Biden's "right wing" border policy was endorsed by the same people who lectured us on open borders for 10 years now). 

Take housing for example, we need millions of new homes to keep up with the current demand without accounting for the ridiculously high net migration. Let's look at Labour solution, 1.5 million new homes by 2029, so 300k homes every year. Simply not enough. But if you realise the pressing need for much higher numbers for new homes and you can't build them or force anyone to build them, then you have to acknowledge the consequences of this in the context of accommodating over 500k migrants a year.

Hey, the left is in power now, by all means, tax the rich and solve the issue your way and show us how "we can do it". The 300k target a year is the same one the Tories' set out but never achieved, net migration for 2022 and 2023 was over 700k per year, simply any narrative about Labour's housing plans solving any issues is a total lie because the numbers don't add up. Don't get me wrong, much better than what we had under the tories but still totally disingenuous. With how expensive housing is bankrupting the young and depriving them the chance of living a decent life no matter how higher the wages go, the dismissive attitude towards these concerns is incredibly selfish.  

Couple this measly target of new homes with Labour's plans to move illegal migrants from high end hotels and barges to rented houses around the country paid for by the government (aka tax money), and soon enough, the locals looking for rent will have more competition from the government that's trying to house illegal migrants, as if renting right now isn't a nightmare, soon you'll add 50k illegal migrants a year to the competition (without accounting for the ones already housed in hotels). 

Any rhetoric to accommodate massive number of migrants that isn't coupled with clear plans on how those migrants will be provided with housing and NHS services is a fanciful "we can do this" attitude that is detached from the struggles of the improvised communities around the country, and a slap in the face for any discussion based on numbers and stats, aka facts. I would love for Labour to prove me wrong, but they're not going based on what they told us so far. 

I do believe what I said, because that was 100% my first hand experience.

And yes, we didn't want to risk my daughter's health because a 6 month wait is part of the system.  Seems like a flawed system.

Having both systems just means one or both aren't working as intended. 

My point is the public system, in the US, is being sold as a silver bullet....  and I disagree firmly.  My experience says otherwise.  Trading one problem for another, expense with limited access to specialists.  

The NHS would not exist if it was terrible for anything more complex than a head cold and flu shot and I don't really understand why you can't understand why I take issue with that statement. For your situation, there is my situation, for my situation, there's another persons situation, the extreme generalisation doesn't help anything. You waited 6 months to see a specialist, I waited a week for my surgery. I'm not saying my situation matches everyone's, I'm not saying the NHS is perfect, I admit it has problems, I take issue with extreme generalisations of the situation one way or another.

The NHS is a lot more than "specialists" as well. So what is your solution? That we fix the issues that the NHS has or we rip up the NHS and force private healthcare on everyone, thus screwing over millions of low-income families? I can say with upmost certainty that my family would not have been able to afford my surgeries and many others wouldn't. Both systems can exist side-by-side, I never said private shouldn't be an option, but a lot of NHS current problems are due to Tories being neglectful bastards, their failures reflect on the country and the NHS.

I believe in posting my opinion formed from my experience.  And I was not impressed.  I'm not going to back off my experience.  

As for the fix.  I'm a chemist.  No idea how to fix healthcare.  That isn't my wheelhouse.  The US system isn't as bad, in my experience, as people make it out to be.  That was my point.  

After living in Europe I have personally concluded American's are whiny children who have zero idea how well they have it.  

I have no doubt that it's not that bad for people who can afford it. Did you not claim that you're very wealthy in another thread? Do you not think that maybe you're speaking at this from a position of privilege and struggling to understand why poor plebs like myself, love the NHS system and don't want it to go anywhere? Why poor people in America dislike America's system? I feel a lack of sympathy of peoples situations from yourself when we talk about this. You keep ignoring my point that millions simply cannot afford private healthcare and then call those people whiny.

Consumption taxes are inherently regressive taxes. That means they fall more heavily on those who are poorer than those who are richer, because the poor spend a higher percentage of their income on goods than the rich. I support a more progressive tax system (aka one which falls more heavily on the rich) because it only makes sense to ask the ones who have a greater ability to provide assistance to provide that assistance. Your arguments surrounding simplifying the tax system aren't arguments against progressive taxes, they are arguments against bad tax code. 

There are similar issues, and subsequent movements among the population, in several countries right now. Canada is also seeing a rise in anti-immigrant sentiment, the same goes here in Sweden. The biggest issue in threads and conversation like this, by far in my opinion, is the polarized nature of the discussion. It's either full-blood Commies or outright Nazis, one way or the other, causing all the issues, at least that's what we're told. Angry, often misguided, people cause problems and start riots, and their behavior and actions are used as the basis to dismiss any valid concern and argument that happens to be tied to the same root cause. More and more definitions, opinions, and qualities are squeezed under huge ideological umbrellas that house a whole host of issues and subjects. If you make a statement or argument that is counter to just a single one of those housed under one of said umbrellas; you're categorically lumped into the same corner as everything and everyone else under there. In addition, you're assumed to be against everything and everyone under the opposite/other umbrella of terms, subjects, and definitions.

Around these parts, there are two main stories about immigration:

1: Migrants are nothing but trouble, will never contribute anything, and should not be allowed.

2: Migrants are the only thing standing between us and certain doom by low birth rates and low interest in lower-tier jobs of a critical nature and importance.

Regardless of what is presented, most people have a considerably more sober view on things. I've rarely come across anyone who subscribes to either of the above notions, but it does generate clicks to perpetuate the stereotypes (and with news and entertainment now being fully merged into one dysfunctional pot, it's the go-to strategy for remaining relevant).
Immigration has more or less always been a thing, but what has not always been a thing is mass-immigration on the scale some countries are seeing today. Even the most kind-hearted and well-meaning individual would be hard pressed to solve some of the undeniable practical, ethical, and economic issues that stem from rapid demographic changes. Most developed nations have societies and systems where long-term organic development has lead to:

A: Predicable population growth and demographic spread.
B: Predictable and manageable levels of education.
C: Predictable housing markets and locales for vendors and trade.
D: Predictable health-care functions with decent coverage.
E: Predictable cultural responses to anything from social policy to global events.

So, if there is a massive influx of people from widely different cultures, no matter how well-meaning and hopeful they are themselves, problems will arise.

A: Contrary to birthing rates here, it's still common to have 5-6 children or more in many cultures, this creates challenges with integration and education for busy mothers who also likely live under strict religious or patriarchal rules and internal laws. By extension, language training lags behind due to parents still speaking their native language at home, with the children. This also excludes them from helping with homework, enjoying local culture like music and TV, books etc.

B: In some nations, such as Somalia, literacy rates are hovering right around 35-45%, with big discrepancies between generations. Both Somalia and Afghanistan populate the bottom 10 nations on earth in literacy rates, just as examples. This further pushes wedges between parent and child, as the children are much more likely to adapt through the educational system. There are also religious objections to some of the curriculum, as well as insistence that children be divided into boy and girl classes, for instance (swimming lessons are a hot topic in this regard). Women who arrive are often monolingual, have never or barely gone to school, and lack any form of relevant work experience, even in their 40s and 50s.

C: Housing markets are imploding and prices soaring. The available units are, like the rest of society, organically adapted to a culture with smaller family constellations, leading to further issues for families with many children. Finding somewhere to live with 1-2 children, and finding somewhere with 4 children or more, is vastly different. All this leads to heavy segregation; sufficiently large units at an affordable price are invariably found in rough neighborhoods - further exasperating the issues under point A and B.

D: Diseases and medical issues long since eradicated are re-appearing. All with the added complications of large swaths of demographics either not trusting the systems, are unable to afford or make full use of them, or simply lack understanding of them (requiring interpreters and other solutions, often making their children assume these roles unfairly), or a combination of all. During the COVID pandemic, the spread was much higher among immigrants, the combination of living in insufficiently sized living spaces, mistrust of authority, lack of communication, and cultural tendency to congregate in places of prayer spurred the issue on fiercely. From within these areas themselves, the increased spread was wholly blamed on authorities and various forms of systemic racism. We also saw similar issues in the US, when believers flocked to churches to pray COVID away, inevitably leading to more spread (the blood of Jesus Christ did, in fact, not protect them).

E: Conflicts from different parts of the world are being brought into nations that has no connection with them. There was recently a huge melee in a park here between supporters of and opposition to the Eritrean regime. This all leads to lack of understanding, like placing Armenian and Azerbaijani refugees in the same house (as a quick example), as well as social unrest in certain areas - with their roots in foreign concerns. People from cultures built around clan structures are also finding it hard settling in institutional societies with a strong state and/or municipal/regional sector that can overrule the familiar structure in issues revolving around children, work, education and conflicts. They have a natural (and from their perspective; reasonable and well-founded) distrust for state and officials, coming from areas with immense level of corruption. There are also huge, obvious issues with honor culture and highly misogynist, homophobic, and overall intolerant views within many cultures.

I myself am an immigrant, if only from the neighboring country, but it's easier for me since I come from a place so similar in most respects. Even without cultural and religious differences, the sheer logistics of having 1-3% population increases annually are insurmountable for most countries. I've had a hard time finding somewhere to live during my 11 years here, in spite of decent income and contacts, and no need for extra space (no kids). Immigration in various forms is something both needed and desirable, by many metrics, but the very real issues that arise from sudden and large demographic changes have to be taken seriously. I will never condone rioting though, I don't see its purpose in a modern, civilized society.

Cultures develop in increments, not in leaps and bounds. If we go to other parts of the world and bomb them to hell, with the purported goal of "converting" them to our ways of living, we should expect failure (ask the Taliban what their democratic process looks like). Expecting the process to go buttery-smooth when the same people try to fit into our ways by coming here of their own accord in large numbers is equally void of logic. Things take time, and just about the only thing we've succeeded in doing is stoking the embers of issues we either solved or were on the verge of solving back into full-on flames (pertaining to women's rights, economical equality, sexual acceptance, functioning justice system etc.).

I consider myself on the liberal-left ends of the spectrum, so for me, clans and enclaves - much like a hostile state, represent a hurdle in our right to be ourselves in expression, opinion, and endeavor. What scares me the most right now, is how both left and right-wing voters all over are increasingly prone to authoritarian notions, in order to solve what they respectively see as the main issues. I fear for the existence of liberalism, which is probably the single-most impactful political and social mechanic for development in the past few centuries.

Most employers offer insurance.  My insurance premiums are similar to most any full time jobs in the US.  $400 a month for a family plan and first 6 to 10k is out of pocket.  Which sounds expensive but bear in mind taxes are way lower and housing (outside the coasts) are far cheaper.  Financially I think it is a wash.  Salaries are also higher in the States, based on median.  

Point being I think it is unfair to look at the US as medical being expensive while not looking at total financial burden.  

And I wasn't born affluent nor did my first job out of school pay well.  Healthcare can be a burden in the States but high taxes and expensive houses in Europe is also a burden.  So it is a wash.  Except east and west coast, those places are stupid expensive and I would never live there.  

Edit 

And I'm surprised you diagree that Americans are whiney as crap.  I mean the average conservative is convinced our country is terrible and close to complete failure.  It isn't and the US is actually one of the better places on the planet to live.  

Heck want to talk about 1st world problems?  We are debating which books should be allowed in libraries.

Hopefully some day the conservative party wakes up because they are currently baffling.  

Exactly. Well said. That's why I think it's important to discuss this without saying they are out right nazis cause they obviously are not, you see the ones that get interviewed or just from videos and they are everyday working class people of all ages, in some videos it's teens doing the rioting which is usually the case for any riot. They are so obviously made up majourly of working class people who were misinformed by Far Right people. The demonisation is only going to make things worse, perhaps even have these people embrace the far right label. 

I've seen many independent interviews (and MSM ones too) where people at the protests all say they don't want to be called alt tight or far right. Holding signs saying they aren't far right but no-one listens since the media and Government has made reality once again, and now they are alt right thugs.