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Forums - Sales Discussion - The Road to 160m+ for Nintendo Switch

Shtinamin_ said:

Ok, so ill just reword my statement. I predict total shipment (sold in the eyes of Nintendo) of 138M by end of November and 141M by the end of March.

Don't need to get so anal about it.

I am not. Just for third or forth time you are getting out a data that isn't correct or logical in what ? 2 weeks or something like that .. If you are talking about shipments then yes, I can agree. But I mentioned before that about sold units, and you are writing after that 135M till november .. which is totally wrong according to the current data we have.

Last edited by XtremeBG - on 16 December 2023

My sales comparison threads:

Ultimate Showdowns: JP 2023 / JP 2024 / 2024 / 2023 / 20222021

Lifetime Showdown / Historical Showdown / YOY Charts / 140M+ Club Chart / Quantity of Games

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Shtinamin_ said:
XtremeBG said:

I don't know where you are getting this wrong number .. We are talking about sold units, not shipped here. So according to VGChartz, with the month of November Switch is at 132.9M now. With December I think it will get to 135/136M at max. So how did you came up with that 135.16M is out of my mind ..

Are you trying to count the 2 weeks of Japan's december ? Because if that's the case, those are 170K both, which will get the Swtich to 133.1M not 135..

Also I guarantee you that the 2024 year for the Switch won't be 1M per month .. it will be far less than that, somewhere around 600k monthly. So by march the best what it can reach is 138M.

In the latest Nintendo earning report, https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2023/231107e.pdf , at page 9 there's a table labeled "Consolidated sales units, number of new titles, and sales units forecast" and the first section is regarding Hardware. At the 3rd column it has another label above it saying "Sales Units in Ten Thousands" and the 3rd column is labeled "Life-to-date Sept '23". Nintendo gives the total of 13,426. 132.46M sold. Nintendo labels them as sold. (Yes, Nintendo and all gaming companies label the shipped as sold and that because it is. Stores have already "bought" the consoles).
So we have 132.46M sold by the end of September according the the Nintendo 6 months Earnings Report. From September I added the VGChartz estimates from October (0.87 +132.46=133.33), November (1.66+133.33=134.99) and Japan's 2 weeks of December (171,831+134.99= 135.16M) to reach 135.16M.

VGChartz estimates are very accurate (example at the end of the September WW estimate post the total of sold matched Nintendo's reports, when aligned with Nintendo's June report). By the end of December VGChartz estimate will match Nintendo's earning report (aligned with September's report).

I don't disagree with your shipped numbers but never mixup shipped and sold numbers when you calculate. That's a wrong method. Either calculate only shipped numbers or only sold numbers. The two can't be mixed up! It's a bit like comparing profit with net gain. The two are not the same thing and therefore can't be compared.



Fight-the-Streets said:

I don't disagree with your shipped numbers but never mixup shipped and sold numbers when you calculate. That's a wrong method. Either calculate only shipped numbers or only sold numbers. The two can't be mixed up! It's a bit like comparing profit with net gain. The two are not the same thing and therefore can't be compared.

The only way shipped and sold numbers would differ is in:

A) In Transit, but there is no indication how long a unit would be or if a platform holder would report an In Transit unit as shipped. But if so In Transit would hit balance sheet not P&L. At quarterly reports we do not see an In Transit number balance sheet number reported as far as I'm aware, it certainly would not account in Inventory. Therefore must assume revenue & cost of goods sold aligns with shipments.

B) Consignment Stock, in the case Nintendo has consignment stock agreements with retailers a.k.a stock at retailers are owned by Nintendo until retailer sells to end consumer. This again would be on the balance sheet not P&L. As far as I'm aware there is no consignment stock accounted for on Quarterly reports.

Nintendo reports Revenue, Cost of Good Sold and unit shipped every quarter. These 3 numbers are tied to the hip. You cannot report unit shipped that are not accounted in Revenue or Cost of Goods Sold or visa versa. Therefore the reported numbers are sold from Nintendo's perspective.

Last edited by Tober - on 16 December 2023

Shtinamin_ said:
javi741 said:

The Wii Mini kept on selling til 2017, so the Wii had an 11 year shelf life

Perdón, yes the PSP sold for 7 years and 5 days (Its 8th year, 5 days into it). PSP sold worldwide in Dec 12th 2004 with the PS Vita selling worldwide in Dec 17th 2011. Does that still make the whole argument invalid?

Yes those are all the times of discontinuation.
WiiU sold a measely 1 units in 2023, I gotta give it to little guy for holding out so long :)
I was specifying that consoles sell past their discontinuation notice, consoles sell past the release of their successor. The Switch is pushing the boundaries for Nintendo on what a console can do, and they will continue to do so.

XtremeBG said:

Wii was officially discontinued in 2013. There were some leftovers as many other consoles 1-2 years after that, which is why we have numbers till 2015 here on VGCharts. But if we don't have numbers after 2015 then it's not counting. Also XB1 sold units till 2022 however it stopped production in 2020. It's the same.

Wii U sold 1 unit this year, this does not make it's market life till 2023.

I have to give to the little guy for standing strong in 2023. But yes the WiiU sold for 5 years (4 years & 7 months).

Garrus said:

it doesn't matter if it hits 160million, it won't mean what people think anyways, it happened over a longer period of time, it is a sign of failure, not success

sure if it sold 160 million in 6 or 7 years that would be the best selling of all time, but if it hits is after 8 or 9 years all that means is that Nintendo made us suffer for a long time

as I've said before, we got half the Zelda titles, no Star Fox, no Mario Kart, no Donkey Kong, i'm ready for the next console, it is torture to use the Switch 1

So if I am understanding correctly, if a console sells over a longer period of time it is deemed as a failure?
So the PS2 is a failure?
+158M is a failure? I see +158M as an absolute win. It doesn't matter how long a console lasts on the market, because win it has stopped producing (we can cap the total), but after production finishes the console still has to sell those last produced products. The final number, and shelf life is when the last console is sold.
Your argument is invalid.

The only console to sell faster than the Switch is the DS. The DS reached 151M in its 8th year (7 years & 4 months).
The PS2 took it 11 years (10 years & 2 months) to sell 150M, so by your standard and I quote
"it doesn't matter if it hits 160million, it won't mean what people think anyways, it happened over a longer period of time, it is a sign of failure, not success

sure if it sold 160 million in 6 or 7 years that would be the best selling of all time, but if it hits is after 8 or 9 years all that means is that [Sony] made us suffer for a long time."
You said it not me.

If its been torturous for you to be gaming with the Switch then stop using the Switch, sell it and don't worry about Nintendo anymore, you obviously think they failed, so why would you want the next console (that will do the same thing, sell for too long).

XtremeBG said:

Either way the original post was that he was wrong about the Wii being on shelve live for 10 years, cuz this means 2016. 2013 is it's 7th year. Even if we agree on 2017, this is not 10 but 11 years.

Im not counting the Wii Mini for there weren't any reliable places to quote, nor was it included in Nintendo's reports.
The Wii sold from Nov 19, 2006 and stopped selling until March 2016
160427e.pdf (nintendo.co.jp)

(I may have been using wrong lingo so i'll try to use better wording)
Thats 10 years (more specifically, 9 years and 4 months, which is its 10th year).
The Wii had a lifespan of 9 years and 4 months, its 10th year.
If we include the fact that no units were shipped in Jan-Mar '16, then the Wii lifespan was 9 years 1 month and 12 days (still in its 10th year)

The Wii ended production in Oct 24th 2013, its life cycle is 6 years and 11 moths (its 7th year). If we include the RVL-101 (non-compatible with GCN) that was discontinued on May 2014, its life cycle is now 7 years and 6 months (its 8th year).

This really isn't complicated. The rate of sales matter, how many are sold per month and how many sold per year. That is what this website tracks. It is on the front page. It is what almost all the articles posted are about. It underpins the gaming business. It is what market share is all about.

If I sell two different systems, both 5 million per year, 10 million total for both, after 10 years I've sold 100 million consoles. 50 million each.

If you sell a console 8 million per year. After 10 years you've sold 80 million. You've sold the most of one console model, 80 million total, but you've sold less in total versus your competitor's two systems. Your rate of sales was lower. This is basic math, basic business sense, and what this website is all about. Why do you come here to read about how many have sold in the last month if you don't care about time.

Basic stuff.

The DS sold at a faster rate than the Switch. The 3DS was already being sold at this point in the lifespan of the Switch. Who cares what the total number is if the Switch needs to stay until the 8th year to equal what the DS did in 6. It took 33 percent longer time to get there.

"Your argument is invalid" made me laugh so hard.

It's time to move on. I've been waiting 12 years for an upgrade to Nintendo's hardware. Let's hope the Switch 2 outsells the Switch 1, not in total, but every month, and per every calendar year. That is what success will look like, not "how long do we have to wait until the Switch 3 goes on sale."

Last edited by Garrus - on 12 January 2024

Exactly. Why you are making it hard on yourself to calculate the shipment numbers which we don't have data for (after their last earnings report) when you (and everyone else) can just use and talk and calculate on the Sold data which we have every month here on VGChartz. It's way more easy to just look at the sold. Why bother with shipments ..



My sales comparison threads:

Ultimate Showdowns: JP 2023 / JP 2024 / 2024 / 2023 / 20222021

Lifetime Showdown / Historical Showdown / YOY Charts / 140M+ Club Chart / Quantity of Games

Around the Network

I don't know if there is any Pokéfan here but the lastest DLC of Pokémon Scarlet/Violet is full of references and nods to the Black/White games.

The last generation of Pokémon followed this game release schedule: Sword/Shield (Main game) - 2019, Isle of Armor and Crown Tundra (DLCs) - 2020, Brilliant Diamond/Shining Pearl (remake of a previous game) - end of 2021, Pokémon Legends Arceus - beginning of 2022.

If the Pokémon Company follows the same patterns on this current generation, we will see a new Pokémon game in the next year. It would be something like this: Pokémon Scarlet/Violet (Main game) - 2022, The Teal Mask and The Indigo Disk (DLCs) - 2023, something related to the Black/White games - 2024.

We don't know if it would be a remake of Black/White, a sequel of Black 2/White 2 and/or a Legends game based on Unova. My point is, this new game can help extend a little Switch's lifespan and its sales, so it might help the Switch to get to the 150+ million territory.

To conclude, a little side note:
1) Black/White was released in 2010 in Japan to the DS and the 3DS was released one year later. DS's sales increased during Black/White release
2) Black 2/White 2, was released in 2012 to the DS, with the 3DS already in the market. DS's sales didn't increase during Black 2/White 2 release

Last edited by CourageTCD - on 17 December 2023

CourageTCD said:

I don't know if there is any Pokéfan here but the lastest DLC of Pokémon Scarlet/Violet is full of references and nods to the Black/White games.

The last generation of Pokémon followed this game release schedule: Sword/Shield (Main game) - 2019, Isle of Armor and Crown Tundra (DLCs) - 2020, Brilliant Diamond/Shining Pearl (remake of a previous game) - end of 2021, Pokémon Legends Arceus - beginning of 2022.

If the Pokémon Company follows the same patterns on this current generation, we will see a new Pokémon game in the next year. It would be something like this: Pokémon Scarlet/Violet (Main game) - 2022, The Teal Mask and The Indigo Disk (DLCs) - 2023, something related to the Black/White games - 2024.

We don't know if it would be a remake of Black/White, a sequel of Black 2/White 2 and/or a Legends game based on Unova. My point is, this new game can help extend a little Switch's lifespan and its sales, so it might help the Switch to get to the 150+ million territory.

To conclude, a little side note:
1) Black/White was released in 2010 in Japan to the DS and the 3DS was released one year later. DS's sales increased during Black/White release
2) Black 2/White 2, was released in 2012 to the DS, with the 3DS already in the market. DS's sales didn't increase during Black 2/White 2 release

Yeah 150 is a lock, like mentioned earlier. Switch should surpass 140 million by March 31st, still with no successor announced or likely to even release until later that year (2024). That means Switch will be the only platform from Nintendo on the market for the next two quarter (April 2024-June 2024 quarter and July 2024 to Sept 2024). I can see those quarters combining for 4 million bringing Switch up to about 145 million by Sept 2024. Even with Switch 2 sometime that holiday (2024), I think Switch simply has too much steam to not sell another 5 million (reaching 150 million). But if Switch gets another tentpole release from Pokemon then reaching the high 150s should be well within reach, what will be interesting is when it releases. It should be from the Legends team but will Nintendo launch Switch 2 with a 3D Mario competing with a Pokemon game that same holiday? I'm beginning to think maybe that Pokemon game releases in January 2025 like Legends Arceus to be out of the way of Switch 2 release in November or October. Switch would get a major release helping momentum in 2025. 



Last edited by XtremeBG - on 29 March 2024

My sales comparison threads:

Ultimate Showdowns: JP 2023 / JP 2024 / 2024 / 2023 / 20222021

Lifetime Showdown / Historical Showdown / YOY Charts / 140M+ Club Chart / Quantity of Games

By my calculations, I think Switch just about gets it done assuming a 3DS-style replacement cycle:

FY2023: 141.5m (16m [13.74m (Q1-Q3) + 2.26m (Q4)])
FY2024: 152.0m (10.5m (-35%))
FY2025: 157.5m (5.5m (-48%))
FY2026: 159.5m (2m (-64%))
FINAL   : 160.0m (0.5m)

This is assuming September 2024 release date for Switch 2, minor price cuts (lets say OLED gets dropped to $250-300 and base switch is axed), and one more big release (ie pokemon) for switch in 2025

I'd put the likely range at about 150-160m rn, depending on post-replacement support. Worst case, if we see a DS or PS4 style replacement, I'd say we'd be looking at about 148m-150m as a floor, with 165m as a high end assuming worse sales for the Switch 2 and aggressive price cuts for the OG switch

Last edited by CheddarPlease - on 11 February 2024

So now we have a more reliable source Eurogamer saying Switch 2 is a Q1 2025 release, which imo could play a big role in pushing the Switch past PS2 sales, now the Switch has a possibility of 1 more Holiday quarter to sell and possibly another holiday title to keep in relevant, maybe a new Pokemon remake or gen. We have to remember the DS still had a huge 8M unit holiday quarter in the quarter just before 3DS launched.