By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Sales Discussion - Switch Tops 98M, PS5 Outsells Xbox Series - Global Hardware Nov 28 to Dec 4

IcaroRibeiro said:
Dulfite said:

If y'all are right and Switch 2 doesn't come out until 2024 or 2025, that means I will have owned the device for 7-8 years (I always buy at launch), a device that is basically just a more compact Wii U power-wise, and I also owned a Wii U at launch. By 2025 I will have been playing on basically the same level of power games since late 2012, or 13 years. For Nintendo faithful like me, who buy even their most unsuccessful devices, this is a stupidly long wait for a true leap forward. I don't want more games on this level, I want the next level. We aren't going to get better visuals, bigger maps with more detail, faster/no loading times, improved resolution/frame rate, other tech related enhancements, or any other big leap until a successor console comes out.

I know for the vast majority, that didn't own a Wii U, that this wait hasn't been that long. As far as most are concerned, the Switch was a big leap over the Wii, but I was one of the suckers playing Wii U for years and am now one of the ones having to deal with an extremely prolonged period of the same level of games. Switch games look and mostly play no different than Wii U games to me. I'm tired of this gen. I want the next one.

In meantime you can get a PS5 or a Xbox, they offer the leap you are looking for. Nintendo seems committed to always have hardware that are substantially less powerful compared to others manufacturers. Even when Switch sequel finally launch I'm sure they won't go with the most powerful chipset available in the market, they will do something like Steam Deck level of power even in 2025 

Unfortunately (or fortunately depending on how you see it) Nintendo hardcore fans doesn't seem to be as tech savvy as hardcore Playstation and Xbox fans and in my opinion casuals aren't tech savvy regardless of what is their main platform. Along with this major third parties publishers have been ignoring Nintendo for more than two decades now, Nintendo have no reason to develop a more powerful device thinking about how third parties could boost hardware sales 

That Nintendo is *always* having hardware that is substantial less powerful is simply not true, they were going the power route with N64 and Gamecube. Didn't do much for them back then.

And the tech savvy thing is not true at least for me. As a programmer I am pretty tech savvy I would say. But in entertainment I don't count polygons and look for impressive tech, I look to be entertained. And Nintendo seems to be willing to deliver just that. I am not saying that games with more advanced tech are worse, many aren't. But a surprising amount of AAA games just get more and more boring in safe formulas while advancing visuals. I prefer many indies or japanese games over that, that offer often more creativity. That is not a hard rule, I just simply looking for creativity and fun my entertainment. And at the moment Switch is offering just that, despite the technological gap.



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [peak year] [+], [1], [2], [3], [4]

Around the Network
Dulfite said:

If y'all are right and Switch 2 doesn't come out until 2024 or 2025, that means I will have owned the device for 7-8 years (I always buy at launch), a device that is basically just a more compact Wii U power-wise, and I also owned a Wii U at launch. By 2025 I will have been playing on basically the same level of power games since late 2012, or 13 years. For Nintendo faithful like me, who buy even their most unsuccessful devices, this is a stupidly long wait for a true leap forward. I don't want more games on this level, I want the next level. We aren't going to get better visuals, bigger maps with more detail, faster/no loading times, improved resolution/frame rate, other tech related enhancements, or any other big leap until a successor console comes out.

I know for the vast majority, that didn't own a Wii U, that this wait hasn't been that long. As far as most are concerned, the Switch was a big leap over the Wii, but I was one of the suckers playing Wii U for years and am now one of the ones having to deal with an extremely prolonged period of the same level of games. Switch games look and mostly play no different than Wii U games to me. I'm tired of this gen. I want the next one.

I'm also one of the "Nintendo faithful" who got a Wii U, and personally I don't want Switch replaced any time soon.

When I drop the kind of money I did on getting a Switch, I want at least 6 years out of it. It also feels to me like it still has unfulfilled potential games wise, and that it could become my top platform of all time given the chance.

2023 would be fine by me though, I think by 2024 or 2025 I'd be getting pretty antsy too.

Also, not to be nitpicky, but Switch is not two generations behind, as it is not on the same level as PS3 or 360, and is also more capable than Wii U. You wouldn't have seen games like Witcher 3, Luigi's Mansion 3, World War Z, Dying Light, etc on those platforms.



Mnementh said:

That Nintendo is *always* having hardware that is substantial less powerful is simply not true, they were going the power route with N64 and Gamecube. Didn't do much for them back then.

And the tech savvy thing is not true at least for me. As a programmer I am pretty tech savvy I would say. But in entertainment I don't count polygons and look for impressive tech, I look to be entertained. And Nintendo seems to be willing to deliver just that. I am not saying that games with more advanced tech are worse, many aren't. But a surprising amount of AAA games just get more and more boring in safe formulas while advancing visuals. I prefer many indies or japanese games over that, that offer often more creativity. That is not a hard rule, I just simply looking for creativity and fun my entertainment. And at the moment Switch is offering just that, despite the technological gap.

Correction, they also did the power route during NES and SNES days and worked very well for them. Nintendo only abandoned this strategy because Playstation happened and Sony destroyed them two generations in row, Nintendo then recognized they can't play Sony's game any further and, unlike Microsoft, Nintendo is a company that survives solely on gaming and as such need to dedicated all their strength in being a true market force instead of just being in the shadow of Sony with slim profits margins for another 30 years

When I say *always* I meant from this moment onwards, and based on Nintendo approach and strategy it's just nothing changing 

I'm also a programmer and I'm tech savvy when it comes to science, but I'm not tech savvy when it comes to gaming hardware and of course I meant tech savvy when it comes to gaming. PC gamers are the ones most concerned with technical specs of games, while Nintendo fans are the least concerned with it. I need to make here an important distinct, the majority os console owners are fans of neither brand and a fan of a brand can easily buy a hardware of another brand just to have more gaming offerings. However when it comes to fandom is easy to spot what MS and Playstation fans discuss on gaming boards, they are far more interested in technical details of their hardware and how this can affect gaming performance than a Nintendo fan and even fight about that to claim which hardware have better performance when in reality differences in MS and Playstation hardware in past few years has been, overall, negligible. 

I also understand what you mean when AAA production is boring and repetitive down the line, but I'm not sure if this leads to buying a Switch. I mean... Playstation still getting almost every JP third party and mid sized and indies are plentiful in PS Stores. Switch imo has only two significant offerings that Playstation lacks: Portability and Nintendo first party. If you really like portability and Nintendo games, then you have reason to buy a Switch. 

Looking from other perspective though, if you don't care for Sony exclusives other AAA games either western or JP (because Square, Capcom and even Konami games have a very big production value lately) then you have no reason to get a Playstation, a Switch is basically everything you need 



IcaroRibeiro said:
Mnementh said:

That Nintendo is *always* having hardware that is substantial less powerful is simply not true, they were going the power route with N64 and Gamecube. Didn't do much for them back then.

And the tech savvy thing is not true at least for me. As a programmer I am pretty tech savvy I would say. But in entertainment I don't count polygons and look for impressive tech, I look to be entertained. And Nintendo seems to be willing to deliver just that. I am not saying that games with more advanced tech are worse, many aren't. But a surprising amount of AAA games just get more and more boring in safe formulas while advancing visuals. I prefer many indies or japanese games over that, that offer often more creativity. That is not a hard rule, I just simply looking for creativity and fun my entertainment. And at the moment Switch is offering just that, despite the technological gap.

Correction, they also did the power route during NES and SNES days and worked very well for them. Nintendo only abandoned this strategy because Playstation happened and Sony destroyed them two generations in row, Nintendo then recognized they can't play Sony's game any further and, unlike Microsoft, Nintendo is a company that survives solely on gaming and as such need to dedicated all their strength in being a true market force instead of just being in the shadow of Sony with slim profits margins for another 30 years

When I say *always* I meant from this moment onwards, and based on Nintendo approach and strategy it's just nothing changing 

I'm also a programmer and I'm tech savvy when it comes to science, but I'm not tech savvy when it comes to gaming hardware and of course I meant tech savvy when it comes to gaming. PC gamers are the ones most concerned with technical specs of games, while Nintendo fans are the least concerned with it. I need to make here an important distinct, the majority os console owners are fans of neither brand and a fan of a brand can easily buy a hardware of another brand just to have more gaming offerings. However when it comes to fandom is easy to spot what MS and Playstation fans discuss on gaming boards, they are far more interested in technical details of their hardware and how this can affect gaming performance than a Nintendo fan and even fight about that to claim which hardware have better performance when in reality differences in MS and Playstation hardware in past few years has been, overall, negligible. 

I also understand what you mean when AAA production is boring and repetitive down the line, but I'm not sure if this leads to buying a Switch. I mean... Playstation still getting almost every JP third party and mid sized and indies are plentiful in PS Stores. Switch imo has only two significant offerings that Playstation lacks: Portability and Nintendo first party. If you really like portability and Nintendo games, then you have reason to buy a Switch. 

Looking from other perspective though, if you don't care for Sony exclusives other AAA games either western or JP (because Square, Capcom and even Konami games have a very big production value lately) then you have no reason to get a Playstation, a Switch is basically everything you need 

I fully agree with all you said here. I just want to add, that I don't dislike all AAA games, I just look for different things than just technical achievements. If an AAA games offers this, I will enjoy it.



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [peak year] [+], [1], [2], [3], [4]

Mnementh said:
IcaroRibeiro said:

Correction, they also did the power route during NES and SNES days and worked very well for them. Nintendo only abandoned this strategy because Playstation happened and Sony destroyed them two generations in row, Nintendo then recognized they can't play Sony's game any further and, unlike Microsoft, Nintendo is a company that survives solely on gaming and as such need to dedicated all their strength in being a true market force instead of just being in the shadow of Sony with slim profits margins for another 30 years

When I say *always* I meant from this moment onwards, and based on Nintendo approach and strategy it's just nothing changing 

I'm also a programmer and I'm tech savvy when it comes to science, but I'm not tech savvy when it comes to gaming hardware and of course I meant tech savvy when it comes to gaming. PC gamers are the ones most concerned with technical specs of games, while Nintendo fans are the least concerned with it. I need to make here an important distinct, the majority os console owners are fans of neither brand and a fan of a brand can easily buy a hardware of another brand just to have more gaming offerings. However when it comes to fandom is easy to spot what MS and Playstation fans discuss on gaming boards, they are far more interested in technical details of their hardware and how this can affect gaming performance than a Nintendo fan and even fight about that to claim which hardware have better performance when in reality differences in MS and Playstation hardware in past few years has been, overall, negligible. 

I also understand what you mean when AAA production is boring and repetitive down the line, but I'm not sure if this leads to buying a Switch. I mean... Playstation still getting almost every JP third party and mid sized and indies are plentiful in PS Stores. Switch imo has only two significant offerings that Playstation lacks: Portability and Nintendo first party. If you really like portability and Nintendo games, then you have reason to buy a Switch. 

Looking from other perspective though, if you don't care for Sony exclusives other AAA games either western or JP (because Square, Capcom and even Konami games have a very big production value lately) then you have no reason to get a Playstation, a Switch is basically everything you need 

I fully agree with all you said here. I just want to add, that I don't dislike all AAA games, I just look for different things than just technical achievements. If an AAA games offers this, I will enjoy it.

Yup, I understand this. Graphics are nice but you can't survive with technical archievements alone with an unentertaining gameplay, but I agree AAA can offer great gameplay, for instance RE Evil 2 remake has a very good gameplay and while the graphics are great I think almost everyone agrees the smart puzzles, the atmosphere and the story (that unlocks different paths in the game depending on which character you are playing) is what really make the game stands out



Around the Network
IcaroRibeiro said:

I understand you want Nintendo games to go forward instead of reusing gameplay mechanics capped by 2011 technology level, but the truth is you wishes won't materialize. The only way for Nintendo to release Switch 2 in 2023 was Switch peak to happen in 2018 and Switch to sell at best 70 million lifetime, a success but far from enough to yield a bigger lifecycle. It didn't happen so Nintendo kept making software for Switch. 

I don't really get this at all, I tend to see people throwing sentences akin to this, but honestly, most gameplay mechanics have been capped for years, I don't see much games that execute something with the gameplay detail of the original Dead Rising for example, and that is a 2006 game, like there is a Crysis 1, or Half Life here and there, a Breath of the Wild, but that is a very small percentage of games where one could say that. Just a really silly (for the lack of using a stronger word) thought to me.



IcaroRibeiro said:

I understand you want Nintendo games to go forward instead of reusing gameplay mechanics capped by 2011 technology level

Echoing ARandomGamer, I have yet to really see any meaningful gameplay advances on any platform that seems like it couldn't be done on the circa 2005 Xbox 360. Gameplay has barely evolved at all since the mid 7th generation, the games have just gotten prettier.

Last edited by curl-6 - on 19 December 2021

curl-6 said:
trunkswd said:

It is almost 100% going to surpass the PS4 next year and even if sales start to drop off fast it will have no problem outselling the PS4 by the time Nintendo stops selling it.

With its current trajectory that certainly looks like the likely outcome, but there's a lot of alarming rumblings about a new Switch in 2022. Killing Switch so soon would be beyond stupid, but Nintendo has been incredibly stupid before.

There were a lot of rumblings about the "Switch Pro" too, which clearly never happened.  Nintendo hasn't even hinted about a Switch Successor, so I seriously doubt anything releasing in 2022.  I went back as far as the Gamecube, and couldn't find an instance of Nintendo launching a home console without having publicly spoken about it over a year prior to release.  And actually over 2 years prior in almost all cases.

Gamecube

First announced:  "At Nintendo's press conference in May 1999, the console was first publicly announced as "Project Dolphin", the successor to the Nintendo 64"

Launched: September 14, 2001

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  2 years 4 months

Wii

First announced:  "Iwata first unveiled some details of Nintendo's new home console at E3 (May) 2004 under the codename "Revolution" 

Launched:  November 19, 2006

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  2 years 6 months

Wii U

Rumors:  Public rumors surrounding the console began to appear in 2010, with speculation of an upcoming revision of the Wii scheduled for 2011 known as the "Wii HD"

First Announced:  "On April 25, 2011, Nintendo released an official statement announcing a system to succeed the Wii to be released during 2012"

Launched: November 18, 2012

Rumors to Launch Window Gap:   2 years+

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  1 years 7 months

Switch:

First Announced:  "The first public news of about the Switch's hardware happened alongside the announcement of Nintendo and DeNA's partnership on March 17, 2015. At this stage, Nintendo referred to the console under the codename "NX" and described it as a "brand new concept"

Launched:  March 3, 2017

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  2 years 



Mandalore76 said:
curl-6 said:

With its current trajectory that certainly looks like the likely outcome, but there's a lot of alarming rumblings about a new Switch in 2022. Killing Switch so soon would be beyond stupid, but Nintendo has been incredibly stupid before.

There were a lot of rumblings about the "Switch Pro" too, which clearly never happened.  Nintendo hasn't even hinted about a Switch Successor, so I seriously doubt anything releasing in 2022.  I went back as far as the Gamecube, and couldn't find an instance of Nintendo launching a home console without having publicly spoken about it over a year prior to release.  And actually over 2 years prior in almost all cases.

Gamecube

First announced:  "At Nintendo's press conference in May 1999, the console was first publicly announced as "Project Dolphin", the successor to the Nintendo 64"

Launched: September 14, 2001

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  2 years 4 months

Wii

First announced:  "Iwata first unveiled some details of Nintendo's new home console at E3 (May) 2004 under the codename "Revolution" 

Launched:  November 19, 2006

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  2 years 6 months

Wii U

Rumors:  Public rumors surrounding the console began to appear in 2010, with speculation of an upcoming revision of the Wii scheduled for 2011 known as the "Wii HD"

First Announced:  "On April 25, 2011, Nintendo released an official statement announcing a system to succeed the Wii to be released during 2012"

Launched: November 18, 2012

Rumors to Launch Window Gap:   2 years+

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  1 years 7 months

Switch:

First Announced:  "The first public news of about the Switch's hardware happened alongside the announcement of Nintendo and DeNA's partnership on March 17, 2015. At this stage, Nintendo referred to the console under the codename "NX" and described it as a "brand new concept"

Launched:  March 3, 2017

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  2 years 

GBA

announced-September 1, 1999

released-March 21, 2001

gap-18 months

DS

announced-November 13, 2003

released-November 21, 2004

gap-12 months

3DS

announced-March 23, 2010

released-February 26, 2011

gap-11 months



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

Mandalore76 said:
curl-6 said:

With its current trajectory that certainly looks like the likely outcome, but there's a lot of alarming rumblings about a new Switch in 2022. Killing Switch so soon would be beyond stupid, but Nintendo has been incredibly stupid before.

There were a lot of rumblings about the "Switch Pro" too, which clearly never happened.  Nintendo hasn't even hinted about a Switch Successor, so I seriously doubt anything releasing in 2022.  I went back as far as the Gamecube, and couldn't find an instance of Nintendo launching a home console without having publicly spoken about it over a year prior to release.  And actually over 2 years prior in almost all cases.

Gamecube

First announced:  "At Nintendo's press conference in May 1999, the console was first publicly announced as "Project Dolphin", the successor to the Nintendo 64"

Launched: September 14, 2001

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  2 years 4 months

Wii

First announced:  "Iwata first unveiled some details of Nintendo's new home console at E3 (May) 2004 under the codename "Revolution" 

Launched:  November 19, 2006

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  2 years 6 months

Wii U

Rumors:  Public rumors surrounding the console began to appear in 2010, with speculation of an upcoming revision of the Wii scheduled for 2011 known as the "Wii HD"

First Announced:  "On April 25, 2011, Nintendo released an official statement announcing a system to succeed the Wii to be released during 2012"

Launched: November 18, 2012

Rumors to Launch Window Gap:   2 years+

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  1 years 7 months

Switch:

First Announced:  "The first public news of about the Switch's hardware happened alongside the announcement of Nintendo and DeNA's partnership on March 17, 2015. At this stage, Nintendo referred to the console under the codename "NX" and described it as a "brand new concept"

Launched:  March 3, 2017

Announcement to Launch Window Gap:  2 years 

There are people, even entire websites/writers, that seem to think new iterations of current consoles = a new console. It makes no sense, and their misinformation causes confusion in consumers and fans.

No one looking historically and thinking rationally thinks there will be a new Nintendo console on 2022. The Pro, or some other Switch iteration? Sure. Very likely. And sadly there are people out there that can't distinguish between Switch Pro and Switch 2.