By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics Discussion - A French teacher beheaded, chaos ensues, EU warns Turkey of sanctions

And they wonder why islam will never get the recognition of it's teachings, cause you have idiots giving it a bad name. It says in the quran something along the line of to kill one person is like killing a thousand , and that peace is the way. But it seems like a lot of these protestors against macron and not condemning the killing seem to be of poor people or of low iq. And these people in foreign countires, they should fk off home to their own state before thinking about causing damage to others.



Around the Network
Ka-pi96 said:
Eagle367 said:
The actual problem is that Macron called Islam "a religion in crisis" and he wanted to "reform" Islam. Who is he to tell all the Muslims what their religion is and that he is capable enough to "reform" out religion. He is an idiot. All Muslims would have backed him if he just talked against the terrorists but no, he chose to attack the religion and blame it, not the terrorists. The only Muslims he made happy are the terrorists who can use his statements for their brainwashing and propaganda. Also the attack in Nice has been confirmed to be done by far right extremists, not Muslim extremists so make a correction to the thread mate.

Well that changes things a bit.

Based solely on the things quoted in the OP, he never said anything wrong at all. And the people claiming it's attack on freedom of religion are either lying out of their asses or don't know what words mean.

If he's talking negatively about Islam as a whole though, I can get why people would be angry about that.

Although religion really should change. It needs to be less important and take a back seat for many many people. Believe whatever you want, but leave other people to live their life how they want, even if it's now how you believe you should live your life. And that's true of every religion, not just Islam.

Yup he attacked Islam as a whole the idiot did. And regarding your last statement, it's not religion but rather people that should change since they do these things even their own religions are against. There is no compulsion in religion according too islamic doctrine but some Muslims still try to force people to convert or mistreat people of other faith. I believe most religions are like that. So the people need to be tolerant. Everyone should be able to choose which religion or not they follow without prejudice.



Just a guy who doesn't want to be bored. Also

Eagle367 said:
JWeinCom said:

Who would you consider to be leaders in the Islamic community, and how did they react to the beheading? Legitimately asking.

Islam doesn't have a central organized thing like the papacy. It's very decentralized so there are more so local leaders than global leaders of the entire Muslim community ( not islamic community). But a lot of scholars have condemned these sorts of acts hundreds upon thousands of times. Any legitimate scholar of Islam condemns these acts.

That's a no true Scotsman fallacy. You can't just discount anyone who doesn't condemn it as not representative of Islam.

I don't know if I buy that these people are merely a fringe group. There are currently 16 Islamic countries where blasphemy can be punished by imprisonment or death. I'm not saying all of them would necessarily endorse beheading for drawing Muhammed, but that's a big chunk of the Muslim world where it would be illegal, and it's not surprising that kind of backdrop can foster extremism.



Eagle367 said:
Immersiveunreality said:

A lot of young boys are in a weaker mental state, growing up and hormones do that.

Religion can be misused to radicalize, it is important to recognize that and not see it as an attack on how you practice religion.

At this point i just feel sorry for the teacher.

If Macron said what you said, I don't think anyone would have any problems with Macron. But Macron spewed some nonsense about the religion he doesn't understand and reforming the religion he doesn't follow. Also you can use ethnicity, nationalism, even economic theory like Capitalism and communism to get the same effect as misrepresenting religion. 

Yeah a lot of European leaders should try to use their words more carefully as this mostly sets people up against the people of islam that have no part in this problem.

Europe has a problem with integrating culture within another culture and it can create very conservative social bubbles that are often walled off from the existing also conservative bubbles and that has a good chance of creating that ancient old us vs them mentality.

It creates racism and xenophobia and it creates anger that can be used as a tool to radicalize and at the root this is mostly a political issue.



Eagle367 said:
LurkerJ said:

Oh, how dare he expresses his opinion. For anyone who can be brainwashed because of Macron's statements, well....  of all the reasons why these braindead farts are so susceptible to brainwashing, Macron's statement is the absolute least prominent.

You gotta ask what killed their ability to critically think in the first place, think religious upbringing had to do anything with it? yeah... 

Again, if those statements can be used on Moderate Muslims to turn them into extremists, then I gotta say, it looks like Islam is a religion in crisis indeed. 

Careful your hate and bias is showing. And the point is when the youth are mentally, financially, socially and physically in a bad place, they can be swayed by anything. Most Muslims, and by most I mean 99.99%, will not do these things. They aren't moderate Muslims, they are just Muslims. And most Muslims aren't affected. But statements like Macron's help the terrorists with those fragile ones. It's strange that you people agree with the terrorists and most Muslims don't side with that narrative. So you are literally telling 99.999% of Muslims what their religion should be and you and are alienating the sorts of Muslims you people would ideally want. Or do you have a problem with Muslims who don't think Islam is bloodshed and violence? It's so counterproductive in every sense. 

"Careful your hate and bias is showing."

I don't need to be careful, I hate all religions equally. I have been open about it. I wish you were as honest with yourself about all Islamic teachings. As muslims or Christians who don't think their religion is violent have read less and thought less critically about their religions than I have.

There is no moderate Islam, but there are, fortunately, moderate Muslims who willingly choose to omit the teachings of Islam that do not fit the 21st century, which is somewhat useful, this is how Christianity was "reformed" and the west got to progress morally and socially after all. 



Around the Network

people are talking like cristianity wasn't this bad three centuries ago...
islam needs to be reformed, just as christianity has.



JWeinCom said:
Eagle367 said:

Islam doesn't have a central organized thing like the papacy. It's very decentralized so there are more so local leaders than global leaders of the entire Muslim community ( not islamic community). But a lot of scholars have condemned these sorts of acts hundreds upon thousands of times. Any legitimate scholar of Islam condemns these acts.

That's a no true Scotsman fallacy. You can't just discount anyone who doesn't condemn it as not representative of Islam.

I don't know if I buy that these people are merely a fringe group. There are currently 16 Islamic countries where blasphemy can be punished by imprisonment or death. I'm not saying all of them would necessarily endorse beheading for drawing Muhammed, but that's a big chunk of the Muslim world where it would be illegal, and it's not surprising that kind of backdrop can foster extremism.

Bold: that's what many fail to realize. Because yeah fine, even if you prove it to everyone that Islam doesn't literally tell you to behead your teacher because he conducted a freedom of expression class, you can't dismiss the countless phrases & teachings in Islamic literature that normalizes violent behavior against the other, whether the other is an infidel, a gay, a blasphemian, or even a Muslim with of a different sect. That kind of backdrop can definitely foster extremism. 



TheBraveGallade said:
people are talking like cristianity wasn't this bad three centuries ago...
islam needs to be reformed, just as christianity has.

People are talking like christianity isn't still bad...

The difference is most states secularised and limited the influence of it.



LurkerJ said:
JWeinCom said:

That's a no true Scotsman fallacy. You can't just discount anyone who doesn't condemn it as not representative of Islam.

I don't know if I buy that these people are merely a fringe group. There are currently 16 Islamic countries where blasphemy can be punished by imprisonment or death. I'm not saying all of them would necessarily endorse beheading for drawing Muhammed, but that's a big chunk of the Muslim world where it would be illegal, and it's not surprising that kind of backdrop can foster extremism.

Bold: that's what many fail to realize. Because yeah fine, even if you prove it to everyone that Islam doesn't literally tell you to behead your teacher because he conducted a freedom of expression class, you can't dismiss the countless phrases & teachings in Islamic literature that normalizes violent behavior against the other, whether the other is an infidel, a gay, a blasphemian, or even a Muslim with of a different sect. That kind of backdrop can definitely foster extremism. 

Wasn't really my point.

The Torah and to a lesser extent the New Testament of the Bible contain absolutely horrific teachings as well. I.e. stone to death unruly children, slavery is ok, women being treated as property, etc. 

The difference with Islam is that, due to a variety of factors (not the least of which is Western intervention) Islam is endorsed by states in a way that Christianity and Judaism, really are not. In states where challenging Islam is illegal and potentially dangerous, extremism can grow unfettered, and can be exported to the rest of the world.



Eagle367 said:
Immersiveunreality said:

A lot of young boys are in a weaker mental state, growing up and hormones do that.

Religion can be misused to radicalize, it is important to recognize that and not see it as an attack on how you practice religion.

At this point i just feel sorry for the teacher.

If Macron said what you said, I don't think anyone would have any problems with Macron. But Macron spewed some nonsense about the religion he doesn't understand and reforming the religion he doesn't follow. Also you can use ethnicity, nationalism, even economic theory like Capitalism and communism to get the same effect as misrepresenting religion. 

The religion needs reforming in the west at the very least. Sharia Law is not compatible with modern western civilization. Don’t get me started on women’s rights within it. People make fun of Jesus all the time but make fun of Islam and you risk getting your head chopped off. Radical minority or not this is the modern era not the dark ages. You don’t decapitate people in a modern society because someone made fun of your prophet. 

The French PM was right to condemn the attack for what it was. The crime was done with religious motivations plain and simple, being a radical minority aside.  

Last edited by sales2099 - on 01 November 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles.