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Forums - Gaming - Console players. A question on preference.

 

Visual fidelity or framerate

I prefer higher framerates 46 51.69%
 
I prefer better visuals 19 21.35%
 
Either way. I'm not picky 24 26.97%
 
Total:89
Norion on 13 June 2023
Spindel said:
Norion said:

It still applies to console. All fighting games are 60 even on console for example since if one was locked to 30 it would be DOA, games in that genre being 60 instead of 30 is so important that it's basically mandatory. And you're right about the adapting part, I was just saying that to show another reason why it objectively matters.

hinch said:

This is good point. One of my family members easily gets motion sickness while playing FPS's. A lot I guess is due to the extremely narrow FOV from most FPS games - at least older ones. Another contributing factor may be higher sensitivity to input lag to movement(s). Where the image displayed is simply too far apart from what you are expecting. Its a bit like using VR with low frames. The rapid movements and motion in conjunction with delayed input/output is bound to cause motion sickness from most people.

FOV is another big deal for first person games. Even when just looking at low FOV footage it can feel a bit yucky to me so there's no way I could play something like an FPS that way. I stick to at least 100.

If there’s one thing that even remotley risks giving you motionsickness it’s high FOV.

BTW used to play original Quake at FOV 120 and until you got used to it it was really wierd

I never go that high cause the distortion effect becomes too much. I go as high as you can go till it becomes too noticeable which is usually 100-110.



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hinch on 13 June 2023
Norion said:
hinch said:

This is good point. One of my family members easily gets motion sickness while playing FPS's. A lot I guess is due to the extremely narrow FOV from most FPS games - at least older ones. Another contributing factor may be higher sensitivity to input lag to movement(s). Where the image displayed is simply too far apart from what you are expecting. Its a bit like using VR with low frames. The rapid movements and motion in conjunction with delayed input/output is bound to cause motion sickness from most people.

FOV is another big deal for first person games. Even when just looking at low FOV footage it can feel a bit yucky to me so there's no way I could play something like an FPS that way. I stick to at least 100.

Yeah can get a bit nausiating when fixed to a small FOV and having to pan the camera to much to see your surroundings. Which is why ultrawides are so nice to use in fps (or otherwise) games.. as you get a lot of information on a screen at once, and you dont have to scale your FOV as much. And why I kind of miss with my old UW monitor. Not so much of an issue on smaller screens and portables but on a large modern TV and monitor its an issue (for me). Adding low fps to that and yeah.. cba with that. 

But yeah 100'ish FOV is the upper limit to what I like to use too. Anymore and you get a sort of fish eye effect which is also bad.



SvennoJ on 13 June 2023
Norion said:
Spindel said:

If there’s one thing that even remotley risks giving you motionsickness it’s high FOV.

BTW used to play original Quake at FOV 120 and until you got used to it it was really wierd

I never go that high cause the distortion effect becomes too much. I go as high as you can go till it becomes too noticeable which is usually 100-110.

80 is about as much as I can stand on a screen. My oldest was playing Minecraft at 120 fov, made me sick just looking at it for a minute.

All the more reason for VR to grow. A natural 110 degree view, minimum locked 60fps, 90 and 120fps games as well. Plus so much easier to aim!

As for Doom, I played the original at 10 to 15 fps with kb+mouse. Worked fine! But bigger screen and steady fps do give a competitive advantage in a LAN setting. We played HL Death match for years at work at the end of the day. Since I was in charge of map processing back then I had the fastest PC with a nice big 21 inch monitor set to 120hz refresh rate. I was dominating lol. It was all software rendering so CPU and RAM speed were the main factors and I needed lots of that for the work I was doing.

Yet for non competitive games, 30fps has always been more than enough. I'm just glad screen tearing is a thing of the past. Thanks to performance modes, the quality modes are at least a locked 30fps now. No more hovering around 27fps with screen tearing like in the ps3/360 days.



Spindel on 13 June 2023
Norion said:
Spindel said:

If there’s one thing that even remotley risks giving you motionsickness it’s high FOV.

BTW used to play original Quake at FOV 120 and until you got used to it it was really wierd

I never go that high cause the distortion effect becomes too much. I go as high as you can go till it becomes too noticeable which is usually 100-110.

I also should have specified that FOV 120 was back in the days, so it was on a 4:3 screen not some fancy 16:9 or 21:9 screen.



zeldaring on 13 June 2023
Norion said:
Cobretti2 said:

We are talking console though, everyone has the same competitive advantage, therefore they are chasing nothing.

The biggest factors will be your TV lag and internet lag in competitive advantage for a console.

PC sure people chase higher FPS and refresh rates as it helps, however a professional skilled player can still easily beat people playing at 60fps/60hz vs a casual playing at 240fps/240hz. Pro gamers adapt to the environment they are given.

It still applies to console. All fighting games are 60 even on console for example since if one was locked to 30 it would be DOA, games in that genre being 60 instead of 30 is so important that it's basically mandatory. And you're right about the adapting part, I was just saying that to show another reason why it objectively matters.

hinch said:

This is good point. One of my family members easily gets motion sickness while playing FPS's. A lot I guess is due to the extremely narrow FOV from most FPS games - at least older ones. Another contributing factor may be higher sensitivity to input lag to movement(s). Where the image displayed is simply too far apart from what you are expecting. Its a bit like using VR with low frames. The rapid movements and motion in conjunction with delayed input/output is bound to cause motion sickness from most people.

FOV is another big deal for first person games. Even when just looking at low FOV footage it can feel a bit yucky to me so there's no way I could play something like an FPS that way. I stick to at least 100.

Aside from competitive, 30fps just feels much worse to play. Playing a 2d platformer at 30fps feels like you are in slow motion and that applies to many games where 60fps has become mandatory. COD, sim racer, 2d platformers, sports games, and fighters would all be DOA at 30fps. COD at 30fps would have never been the franchise it is today at 30fps. it being 60fps made it blow away the competition in smoothness and responsiveness while most FPS in that generation were 30fps.

Last edited by zeldaring - on 13 June 2023

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Spindel on 13 June 2023
zeldaring said:
Norion said:

It still applies to console. All fighting games are 60 even on console for example since if one was locked to 30 it would be DOA, games in that genre being 60 instead of 30 is so important that it's basically mandatory. And you're right about the adapting part, I was just saying that to show another reason why it objectively matters.

hinch said:

This is good point. One of my family members easily gets motion sickness while playing FPS's. A lot I guess is due to the extremely narrow FOV from most FPS games - at least older ones. Another contributing factor may be higher sensitivity to input lag to movement(s). Where the image displayed is simply too far apart from what you are expecting. Its a bit like using VR with low frames. The rapid movements and motion in conjunction with delayed input/output is bound to cause motion sickness from most people.

FOV is another big deal for first person games. Even when just looking at low FOV footage it can feel a bit yucky to me so there's no way I could play something like an FPS that way. I stick to at least 100.

Aside from competitive, 30fps just feels much worse to play. Playing a 2d platformer at 30fps feels like you are in slow motion and that applies to many games where 60fps has become mandatory. COD, sim racer, 2d platformers, sports games, and fighters would all be DOA at 30fps. COD at 30fps would have never been the franchise it is today at 30fps. it being 60fps made it blow away the competition in smoothness and responsiveness while most FPS in that generation were 30fps.

You see you are just making stuff up and only looking at numbers not playing the games.

One of the greatest platformers ever made have single digit frame rates in some sections. That is slow motion. (Mega Man 2, classic example of this is parts of Metal Man stage but present in several places in the game).



zeldaring on 13 June 2023
Spindel said:
zeldaring said:

Aside from competitive, 30fps just feels much worse to play. Playing a 2d platformer at 30fps feels like you are in slow motion and that applies to many games where 60fps has become mandatory. COD, sim racer, 2d platformers, sports games, and fighters would all be DOA at 30fps. COD at 30fps would have never been the franchise it is today at 30fps. it being 60fps made it blow away the competition in smoothness and responsiveness while most FPS in that generation were 30fps.

You see you are just making stuff up and only looking at numbers not playing the games.

One of the greatest platformers ever made have single digit frame rates in some sections. That is slow motion. (Mega Man 2, classic example of this is parts of Metal Man stage but present in several places in the game).

I actually tried playing 2d platformer  and fighter at 30fps it feels like crap, and a massive step backwords. unplayable for me.



Leynos on 13 June 2023



Bite my shiny metal cockpit!

Cobretti2 on 13 June 2023
Leynos said:

That one of those guys who used his index finger and thumb at the same time to use the N64 controller joystick?



 

 

Pemalite on 14 June 2023
zeldaring said:
Norion said:

It still applies to console. All fighting games are 60 even on console for example since if one was locked to 30 it would be DOA, games in that genre being 60 instead of 30 is so important that it's basically mandatory. And you're right about the adapting part, I was just saying that to show another reason why it objectively matters.

hinch said:

This is good point. One of my family members easily gets motion sickness while playing FPS's. A lot I guess is due to the extremely narrow FOV from most FPS games - at least older ones. Another contributing factor may be higher sensitivity to input lag to movement(s). Where the image displayed is simply too far apart from what you are expecting. Its a bit like using VR with low frames. The rapid movements and motion in conjunction with delayed input/output is bound to cause motion sickness from most people.

FOV is another big deal for first person games. Even when just looking at low FOV footage it can feel a bit yucky to me so there's no way I could play something like an FPS that way. I stick to at least 100.

Aside from competitive, 30fps just feels much worse to play. Playing a 2d platformer at 30fps feels like you are in slow motion and that applies to many games where 60fps has become mandatory. COD, sim racer, 2d platformers, sports games, and fighters would all be DOA at 30fps. COD at 30fps would have never been the franchise it is today at 30fps. it being 60fps made it blow away the competition in smoothness and responsiveness while most FPS in that generation were 30fps.

1) Platformers tend to require extremely precise timing, ergo they benefit from higher frame rates.
Lower frame rates isn't "lower motion". - You still cover the same amount of area in the same amount of time.

2) COD is a twitch shooter and requires high frame rates due to the need for precision.

3) Sim Racers tend to require precise movements, hence the need for 60fps.

The thing about framerates though, is that it's just an arbitrary number, you can have games which "handle" extremely poorly at 60fps due to high input lag, frame pacing issues and more.

And more often than not, many 60fps games aren't true 60fps games. - Many assets, animations, models will update at a much lower framerate... This was hilariously evident in Pokemon Violet/Scarlet where Windmills were updating at 2fps verses the 30fps output.

Or even Halo 5 where many character animations would update at 5-10fps verses the 60fps output... It looks cheap and janky.

Some games simply benefit from a 60fps output over other games, it all comes down to how the game is designed, how it handles and what goals the developers are trying to achieve.
It's not the end of the world.




www.youtube.com/@Pemalite