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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Bloomberg: Multiple Devs Saying Nintendo Asking For 4K Switch Games

Who gives a fuck about AMD. Why are we dragging that into a discussion about Switch Pro.

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Developer FDG (makers of Monster Boy for Switch/PS4/XB1) tweeted a hint that a more powerful Switch is coming. When they announced the Monster Boy would be getting a free 4K patch for the PS5/XSX if you own the PS4/XB1 version, one of their fans replied "Damn, I have the Switch version. Looks like I have to track down a copy of the PS4 version" ... to which the developer directly replied

"Who knows? Maybe Switch also has next-gen hardware in the oven?" with an eyeglass emoji.

So if this will be a 4K upscaling model, can I benefit from the higher resolution with a 1080p TV, in the same way I use Nvidia Dynamic Super Resolution on my PC? I guess
not right?

RolStoppable said:
4k-ready doesn't mean the same thing as 4k games. It wouldn't be surprising if the next Switch revision could upscale games to 4k, so it would make sense for developers to include texture data more suitable for 4k resolution in their games instead of learning only later about it and having to patch their games. Nintendo telling developers in advance will result in more 4k-ready games by the time the Switch revision launches and that totally makes sense from a business perspective.

In any case, people shouldn't jump the gun and think of a Switch Pro because of this news piece. When people read "Pro", they think of the PS4 Pro and the kind of upgrade it constituted over the regular PS4, but Nintendo isn't taking that direction, hence the term "4k-ready".

Relevant sidenote: The Switch version of GRID Autosport has an optional texture pack for download, specifically for people who play the game on a TV. The original console versions of GRID Autosport ran at 720p which is the same resolution as Switch in handheld mode. But on a TV the Switch version runs at 1080p, so the texture pack makes the cars look more detailed than they would be otherwise. That's the kind of thing you should expect when you read 4k-ready.

Nvidia's sucess with DLSS is the main factor pointing towards this. with DLSS 2.0 and tensor cores, they could upscale to 4k from 1080p while looking almost as good as native 4k.

The interesting thing is that this would be a leg up nintendo is going to have against the xbox series s and the ps5, as they can't use this tech as its purely Nvidia and they use AMD

BlackBeauty said:

Why you lie like that tho? You can’t be serious and sit there and say that those even come close to DLSS 2.0.

That Radeon Image Sharpening and DirectML are the competitors to DLSS? It's because they are.
So no. Not lying. Bold claim from someone who cannot provide evidence for anything.

BlackBeauty said:

Not only that Microsoft Direct ML is worse and actually require more power to run whereas DLSS free up performance. There’s nothing in the works from amd that can do the same.

Clearly you don't know what DirectML is and what it does.
It does not require more power than DLSS.

In-fact... DirectML leverages WinML and can interface with nVidia's Tensor cores to do the *exact* same thing essentially... It's just hardware agnostic, thus AMD GPU's take a performance penalty.

See here:

BlackBeauty said:

As for arm. The most most powerful super computers/server farm on the planet runs on arm. Most already the made the switch. It’s not just “mobile”. Arm processors are just way more efficient. Quite literally the future of computing.

You are confusing things here.

* Super computer is not a consumer commodity product.
* Super computers rely on parallel processing and not serial processing, so thousands of energy efficient and "slower" CPU cores are useful rather then fewer higher performing ones.

In the top 10 Super Computers of the world... Only a single Super computer is ARM powered. (Again... More slower cores. And not yet operational.)

And yet 4 Super computers are x86, 1 is custom but has commonality with DEC Alpha, 3 are Power PC and 1 is both PowerPC and x86.

And again... If we were to take enough 486 CPU's and string them together somehow, you could have the fastest "Super Computer in the world". - It doesn't mean a single CPU is actually any good however.

BlackBeauty said:

And The switch is a console. That is actually a hint to where arm is going. It’s NOT about Nintendo in “mobile” or arm in “mobile”. It’s about arm closing the power gap FAST in commercial use/computing. 

Ouya was an ARM powered console.

3DS was also a console. Being called a "handheld" doesn't change the fact it's a console.

ARM is still a light year behind an AMD Epyc 64-core CPU.
ARM is still a light year behind an 8-core, 16-thread Ryzen.

Those are the real facts here.

TheBraveGallade said:

Yeah he's making no sense, image sharpening takes up power while DLSS actually frees it up, comparativly, and also literally every graphics card has shapening tools, including nvidia. DLSS is a whole different ball game, that worked like crap early on but not its maturing, especially with the help of the speciallzed tensor cores.

If you lower the resolution manually apply something liks Morphological AA and use Radeon Image Sharpening you can get results similar to a higher resolution output image. It also free's up resources.
However that is generally not how it's used, but it is how it *could* be used.
And Radeon Image Sharpning actually has more to it than you think... Here is some empirical evidence for you to chomp on:

Again... I have listed DLSS competitor, Aka. DirectML. Please don't ignore my post and take it outside of it's intended context.

TheBraveGallade said:

and lol, outside of servers, apple's devices run on arm, albiet heavily customized, and the ipad pro's caught up to the xbox one S TWO whole YEARS ago in graphics performance, and apple literally JUSt announced that they are going to transition to thier own ARM based chips for macs. sure the price point is different but the point still stands, and with apple applyign boosters to ARM, the power disparity is getting lower fast and it will always have an advantage in power consumption.

The iPad Pro matching or exceeding the Xbox One's garbage x86 processor isn't a testament to ARM's success.

Nor is the iPad Pro's CPU a commodity product that can be picked up and used by anyone, Apple is propriety.

Plus... AMD's Jaguar was AMD's *absolute worst* CPU at a time when AMD wasn't making good CPU's, it was the FX era remember? Ryzen is in an entirely different field from Jaguar, it's wider, smarter and clocked higher.

Apple's ARM efforts are literally the best ARM cores in the industry, but even the ARM based Mac's are seeing performance losses with the move... And Apple never used the fastest x86 processors to start with. Food for thought.

Last edited by Pemalite - on 11 September 2020

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RolStoppable said:
TheBraveGallade said:

Nvidia's sucess with DLSS is the main factor pointing towards this. with DLSS 2.0 and tensor cores, they could upscale to 4k from 1080p while looking almost as good as native 4k.

The interesting thing is that this would be a leg up nintendo is going to have against the xbox series s and the ps5, as they can't use this tech as its purely Nvidia and they use AMD

DLSS has taken on the form of a secret sauce, but as far as I know, it's dependent on cloud computing and each individual game getting the special treatment of making it look good. There's a reason why DLSS is always shown off with Control.

The first version of DLSS needed to be trained per game but 2.0 doesn't which is why there is already gonna be a big uptick in games that have it in late 2020. Watch Dogs Legion, Cyberpunk, and COD Cold War are all gonna support it so quite soon most big games should have it.

4K upscaling doesn't require the developer to do anything, Nintendo wouldn't be briefing developers on that.

If it's DLSS, then yes the developer has to have actual 4K assets for it to work and that would require Nintendo to have to brief developers. 

So if they are briefing developers it's likely either a native resolution solution or Nvidia is providing them a chip with at least Turing level Tensor cores.

Last edited by Soundwave - on 10 September 2020

FromDK said:
Roma said:
they will call it Switch Home as it won't be swichable like the lite but stationery. That's my prediction

Yes.. with same power as the future switch 2

You really believe there is going to be a switch 2 so soon? It's not going to be able to run 4k games natively not even the switch 2 will be able to do that and still be at an affordable price plus portable 

    R.I.P Mr Iwata :'(

I'm starting to wonder if "Switch 2" will even be a thing. They could just upgrade the system every 3-4 years until streaming takes over. They may never want to go down to 0 userbase and start from scratch again. 

This isn't surprising when you consider Nintendo always releases an upgraded handheld. It was the XL for the 3DS and DSi for the DS. 4K Switch would be similar to those and Switch games will be compatible to both. I also assume this is being done to keep pace with the new systems and not fall too far behind.

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