I am not saying anything about Sony devs using UE, I am saying you expect them to have the same tech which is incorrect.  We have no clue how Sony Devs solve the same problems that Epic addressed in their demo or even if Sony devs thought up the same techniques.  The only thing the PS5 has that Sony has promoted is the SSD.  For all you know this was the main focus of Sony devs not a new lighting engine or even the Nanite system.

We have no clue if Sony devs were even looking in the same direction as Epic engineers as development doesn't work that way.  Your main statement stated that Sony devs will have Lumen and Nanite tech but we have no clue what they will have or even if they will have something equivalent.  It may be something totally different, new or nothing at all.  UE5 is not a PS5 game engine, its a PS5, PC, Xbox, Mobile game engine and Epic has probably been working on its system way before there was a PS5 in development.  Its not like SSDs have not been on the market way before the PS5 and its not like the roadmap for PC SSD tech already shows some really fast drives will be coming out before the PS5.

As I stated, I highly doubt Epic shared what they were doing with UE5 because they would love to sell the engine to Sony Devs just as much as they do with MS.

The reason it doesn't make sense to you is that you probably never developed code on that type of level before.  All engine developers are not the same and how they tackle a problem also may be totally different.  Sony SSD is not needed for UE5, especially for Lumen and Nanite.  

As far as Sony SSD, what does that have to do with the 2 technologies Epic shared with their demo.  What makes you believe Epic and Sony were working in parallel on engine development.  You guys are way to hung up on the SSD.  I am saying Lumen and Nanite are Epic's tech,there is absolutely no guarantee that those same technology or even equivalent will be with any graphics engine Sony make.  Sony Devs could be making something totally different that tackle the same problem or they may use existing tech and not do anything on the order of Lumen and Nanite.  You really have no clue until we see their First party games.

The reason Cerny did not show anything is pretty easy, they probably do not have anything ready to show.  Believing that Sony will magically have the same tech as Epic seems crazy to me.  Epic showed what their engine can do, the PS5 just happens to be the hardware showed.  None of that means Sony is developing the exact same tech or even the same design.

Then you misunderstood. When the other user and I said "nanite like" and "lumen like" we are talking about doing similar solution to similar problem not that it will be the same solution.

Sony included RTX parts on the chip, audio tempest, I/O and SSD among other unique or special features on their console compared to PS4. So they were already thinking about the problems that Nanite and Lumen are trying to solve. To claim they are only thinking about SSD would be wrong.

No my claim is that they will have "lumen and nanite like" tech.

PS5 have been in development for like 5 years, even the BC part of the system was in the work for over a year (see Cerny presentation) so probably longer than the time UE5 have been in development. And from the time Sony set a roadmap to the features on the console they as well would be looking for engines and being focused on their console instead of the whole market you can be sure it will take more on the issues Sony see than what UE5 will since it also have to worry about other systems.

PCs haven't used the SSD as baseline even though it exists there for over a decade.

Considering MS recent bought team already had access to some of the UE5 features Sony also had. But sure Sony won't use the same as they don't need. Why use multiplatform tool to develop to a single closed system?

Sony practically designed the whole ps5 around their SSD. Epic shows that their Unreal 5 engine's main feature is specifically designed with next gen SSD's in mind, yet you expect Sony's first party developers to not do the same thing with their own engines? That doesn't make sense.

Sony's been talking for ages about what their SSD is supposed to do; "to create richer scenes with more objects, more refined objects and more detailed textures than are seen on current-gen consoles". The Unreal 5 demo was just the first time we got to see what that means in practice. The only thing that surprises me is that Cerny didn't show something similar in that deep dive GDC stream. 

You have no ideal how long Epic has been working on Lumen or Nanite.  These are just tech advances that they could have been working on for years but could not realize their tech until consoles caught up with PC like CPU, GPU and memory.  I am telling you there is absolutely no guarantee that Sony devs are doing anything close to either tech.  Those are specific tech Epic has been making for their engine, Sony could be making something totally different, nothing at all or something similar.  To expect to see the same thing Epic has done means you do not know how the development process works.  This is why ever engine does not always have the same or equivalent tech especially a brand new engine.

PS5 may have been in development for 5 years but when was finished hardware available.  Engine development takes years to complete and test and it also need finished hardware to do it with.  Its probably the main reason you did not see any RT in Epic UE5 demo since they only had complete hardware for so long.

Its as if you believe UE5 was in development based on PS5 roadmap and I am saying UE5 would exist if there were no PS5 or even XSX because the PC already have all the hardware components that both consoles have.  Other engines have started to take advantage of SSd just so what makes you believe it wasn't on Epic roadmap.  If anything Epic explained to Sony and MS that an SSD should be a baseline storage unit for your new console.

The reason it doesn't make sense to you is that you probably never developed code on that type of level before.  All engine developers are not the same and how they tackle a problem also may be totally different.  Sony SSD is not needed for UE5, especially for Lumen and Nanite.  

As far as Sony SSD, what does that have to do with the 2 technologies Epic shared with their demo.  What makes you believe Epic and Sony were working in parallel on engine development.  You guys are way to hung up on the SSD.  I am saying Lumen and Nanite are Epic's tech,there is absolutely no guarantee that those same technology or even equivalent will be with any graphics engine Sony make.  Sony Devs could be making something totally different that tackle the same problem or they may use existing tech and not do anything on the order of Lumen and Nanite.  You really have no clue until we see their First party games.

The reason Cerny did not show anything is pretty easy, they probably do not have anything ready to show.  Believing that Sony will magically have the same tech as Epic seems crazy to me.  Epic showed what their engine can do, the PS5 just happens to be the hardware showed.  None of that means Sony is developing the exact same tech or even the same design.

Because Epic has told us so. 

"The Unreal Engine 5 demo on PlayStation 5 was the culmination of years of discussions between Sony and Epic on future graphics and storage architectures."

They've been talking about it for years, and you think Sony forgot to bring its own developers in the loop? The whole demo was to showcase what's possible through the dramatic increase in storage bandwith. They didn't touch on ray tracing, new physics or whatnot, SSD was the whole center of the demo. 

And you know for how long Epic is working on UE5?

When you can show me in my reply where I made such a statement you let me know.  I stated you have no clue how long they have been working on those 2 engine pieces.

Just look at the spoilers CGI have been giving us for over 2 years and you'll see that Nanite and lumen is the type of stuff the market was moving torwards for quite some time.

I have and from what CGI is saying their is tech that Epic is not even doing as of their showing.  Do you not understand the concept that in development who knows what the Devs are concentrating on or how they come to a particular solution.  No engine designer make the same choices, if you want and example look at Carmack and Sweeny development over the years with ID tech and Epics engine.

PS5 is based on PC architeture and have a baseline and roadmap, if the engine depended on the HW being finished and devkits available them games would also depend on it so consoles would release without any games at all.

You do know that the PC could have been the baseline for UE5, just because you see a demo running on the PS5 does not mean Epic waited to start Lumen and Nanite development for that piece of hardware.  

You are claiming I have no idea about gaming development but it seems you have even less idea of it.

I will admit I do not do game development but I do development on an enterprise level.  What I do know is that just because one developer came to one solution to a problem does not mean other developers will.  

I never said UE5 was developed due to PS5 roadmap, I said Sony engines was developed with the roadmap in mind, you keep mixing and misquoting me to try and invalidate my posts just to avoid admitting you were wrong on your understanding of the "lumen like and nanite like" techs being on Sony engines.

This is what I am talking about, you have no clue what Sony devs have been developing or even if they are developing the same tech. There is no guarantee that Sony devs will have anything remotely similar.

Sony heard from plenty of devs that they wanted SSD but knew it wasn't possible, this was talked by Cerny and some devs as well.

We keep going back to the SSD but that has nothing to do with Sony doing the same thing as Epic.  Epic tackled two issues one way, we have no clue how Sony devs tackled the same issue or even if they did anything at all similar.  They could have a totally different solution that does absolutely nothing like Lumen or Nanite.  They may or may not have a global illumination solution but do something totally different.  This concept just seems to escape you.

Because Epic has told us so. 

"The Unreal Engine 5 demo on PlayStation 5 was the culmination of years of discussions between Sony and Epic on future graphics and storage architectures."

They've been talking about it for years, and you think Sony forgot to bring its own developers in the loop? The whole demo was to showcase what's possible through the dramatic increase in storage bandwith. They didn't touch on ray tracing, new physics or whatnot, SSD was the whole center of the demo. 

Because Epic has told us so. 

"The Unreal Engine 5 demo on PlayStation 5 was the culmination of years of discussions between Sony and Epic on future graphics and storage architectures."

They've been talking about it for years, and you think Sony forgot to bring its own developers in the loop? The whole demo was to showcase what's possible through the dramatic increase in storage bandwith. They didn't touch on ray tracing, new physics or whatnot, SSD was the whole center of the demo. 

NO, I just do not believe Epic told Sony engineers how they were going to develop UE5.  I highly doubt they shared source code or that Epic told them anything about how Lumen and Nanite work.  Why would they, they are an engine seller so why would they just give Sony their tech so they can then develop something similar and give it away to other Sony studios. You can give 2 people the same problem and how they come to a solution can be totally different.  I use to teach a developer class for the one of the companies I use to work for.  You would probably be surprised how many different solutions we would get for a given problem.  Most times no one solution was the same and some were so radically different, I wondered what they were thinking.