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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Digital Foundry takes on Xenoblade Chronicles 2

eh 720p is fine for me.
sub 480p portable is bad though



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Yikes, look they had to make compromises to get it out in 2017. Still getting it out of course, but it looks like I'll mainly play it in docked mode (just like Zelda, though that was better performance-wise).



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Barkley said:
Miyamotoo said:

Like I wrote, you can bet that 3rd party support for Swtich will be only stronger how times go and much more stronger in 2018. than it was in 2017.

Depends what games you mean by third party support. Demanding western AAA games will not be coming to Switch. New Battlefield or Battlefront, Fallout 5 or TES VI, Mass Effect or Dragon Age, Witcher 4, GTA 6. These big power-hungry games won't be coming to Switch. Doom was a blessing, but even that type of third-party game won't be coming to the Switch in a couple of years. The Switch's power deficit is only going to become a bigger isssue for these AAA western developers with time.

Third party support will definitely be bigger next year compared to this year. Already confirmed for next year: 

- Project Octopath Traveller

- Travis Strikes Back: No More Heroes

- Shin Megami Tensei V

- Mega Man 11

- Valkyria Chronicles 4

- Dragon Quest XI

- Dragon Quest Builders 1 & 2

- Wolfenstein 2

- Hollow Knight

- Inside

- Starlink: Battle for Atlas

And this is probably just the tip of the iceberg. Namco is heavily rumoured to announce a bunch of Switch games very soon. Dragonball Fighter Z, Dark Souls Remastered and Soul Calibur VI all seem likely. 



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Alkibiádēs said:
Barkley said:

Depends what games you mean by third party support. Demanding western AAA games will not be coming to Switch. New Battlefield or Battlefront, Fallout 5 or TES VI, Mass Effect or Dragon Age, Witcher 4, GTA 6. These big power-hungry games won't be coming to Switch. Doom was a blessing, but even that type of third-party game won't be coming to the Switch in a couple of years. The Switch's power deficit is only going to become a bigger isssue for these AAA western developers with time.

Third party support will definitely be bigger next year compared to this year. Already confirmed for next year: 

- Project Octopath Traveller

- Travis Strikes Back: No More Heroes

- Shin Megami Tensei V

- Mega Man 11

- Valkyria Chronicles 4

- Dragon Quest XI

- Dragon Quest Builders 1 & 2

- Wolfenstein 2

- Hollow Knight

- Inside

- Starlink: Battle for Atlas

And this is probably just the tip of the iceberg. Namco is heavily rumoured to announce a bunch of Switch games very soon. Dragonball Fighter Z, Dark Souls Remastered and Soul Calibur VI all seem likely. 

Exactly, I am pretty sure that we actually don't know anything yet about most of 2018. Switch 3rd party games, that majority of games yet need to be announced.

Talking about Dark Souls, last few days Dark Souls 1 Remaster is haveli rumoured from some solid sources, for all current consoles.



Barkley said:

Right but if a first-party developers making an exclusive game can't optimise well then what can be expected from third party's releasing demanding multiplatforms. If a first-party exclusive game can barely run in handheld mode it's not a good indicator for demanding third-party multi-platform releases, optimising for the switch will be a lot lower down their priorities then an exclusive title.

A question that's been brought up before is, will Nintendo allow docked only games that can't run handheld. Or will they just have to miss out on games that simply can't run, or whose developers aren't willing to put the time in to make them run.

Given other first party titles have not suffered from this issue, I suspect Xenoblade 2 was somewhat rushed to make it out in time for the holiday season.

As for demanding third party ports, we already have Doom running at a higher resolution when portable compared to Xenoblade 2.



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Kyuu said:
Oh wow.. that's kinda terrible.

I wonder what that means for Monster Hunter World... If even a first party developer is struggling with optimizing a game that has been in development for three years specifically for the Switch, what can Capcom do when their game is designed for PS4 as the lead platform?

Honestly, they should forget about porting Monster Hunter World and start working asap on Monster Hunter World 2 or Monster Hunter 5 instead of wasting their time on a port that people will ultimately complain about.

I don't think XC2 is a particularly useful reference point for 3rd party developers. Many of its issues extend beyond what makes sense (e.g. the resolution sometimes dropping almost twice as much as what the handheld GPU downclock should justify), and it having been pushed out too early is a reasonable explanation for them.

Doom would be a better example given it's an actual 3rd party port, and seemingly a pretty well handled one. There's a limit to how broadly we can apply any single game here simply because they're all balanced differently, but Doom has highlighted the difficulty many less flexible titles are likley to face.



2018 will definitely be a bigger year for 3rd party support. If the games flop... that may be the end. We definitely aren't there yet. If we keep buying quality 3rd party games, they'll keep coming... and my wallet will stay empty.



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curl-6 said:
Barkley said:

Right but if a first-party developers making an exclusive game can't optimise well then what can be expected from third party's releasing demanding multiplatforms. If a first-party exclusive game can barely run in handheld mode it's not a good indicator for demanding third-party multi-platform releases, optimising for the switch will be a lot lower down their priorities then an exclusive title.

A question that's been brought up before is, will Nintendo allow docked only games that can't run handheld. Or will they just have to miss out on games that simply can't run, or whose developers aren't willing to put the time in to make them run.

Given other first party titles have not suffered from this issue, I suspect Xenoblade 2 was somewhat rushed to make it out in time for the holiday season.

As for demanding third party ports, we already have Doom running at a higher resolution when portable compared to Xenoblade 2.

I'm not sure if 3.5. years of development necessarily counts as rushing. It could also be related to Monolith Soft adapting to the Switch's hardware even though specs-wise, the Switch is not that much more powerful than the Wii U. Docked-wise, its pretty good, its just the portable mode that suffers the most. Hopefully they'll patch it when they are able to optimize the game.



Peh said:
StuOhQ said:
I'm okay with docked mode as is. A patch needs to be released pronto for portable, though. There are moments when it looks okay, and moments when it looks awful. It never looks anywhere close to BotW, and that was built with Wii U in mind.

The low resolution only occurs in battle when there is tooooo much going on. Not that it makes the game unplayable.

Besides, hardly have time to look at the screen's action anyway. I'm staring at my arts build up, the top right branch for combo, the enemies bar for any changes such as topple, ect, my blades cooldown for switching, ect. All while glancing at my character to make sure I cancel attacks at correct time ot build up special faster. Then when doing specials its quick time event time. There is no time to appreciate or not what else is going on on screen. The image posted showing like 10 knockdown texts, I would probably not even notice. For as boring and pointless combat starts the game at, it gets to a super intense micro managing where you are looking at 20 things at once to optimize your battle.

And having just recently gotten Mythra, I'm wondering if a new aspect will start being added to battle as well. So far only used this "forsight" in two cutscenes, but I'm wondering if we get some sort of abilities like the Monado had in future telling.



Barkley said:
Miyamotoo said:

Who said they can't optimise game well!? There is difference between something is not done and something cant be done. Again this is just one example, one game that's not optimised well don't proves nothing, again look at Zelda BotW game that looks better and has all those real time effects and physics and runs at 650-720p. I expecting definitely some performance and graphic patch later because it definitely looks like games is not optimised at all for handheld mode.

Evre game will run in portable and docked mode and in portable mode games will run at lower resolution compared to docked mode, like we saw until now.

"Can't" was a bad choice of words, "Didn't" was the better choice. Again if a first-party developers doesn't bother, why would most third party developers?

Zelda BotW was also a nintendo exclusive game that was in development for 6+ years? But the point I'm making isn't discounted by other examples anyway. I'm just saying if all first-party developers can't be bothered or can't get a game to run well in handheld mode, then you shouldn't expect all third-party developers to do it as well. But it was obvious from the get-go the Switch wasn't a device friendly to third-party developers making multi-platform games. The support it's getting currently from western third party's (Doom, Skyrim, Wolfenstein 2) will be dropped quickly.

Allowing docked-only games would perhaps gain a little more western third-party support for a little bit longer as it wouldn't require as much effort.

Not that the support of third-party's is needed for the Switch's success.

You make Zelda sound like the exception when its Xenobalde that is the exceptiong.

Look at Zelda, Mario, Splatoon, Mario Kart, ect and tell me what you notice for handheld mode? They are all great handheld optimizations. It's ONLY Xenoblade that isn't great.

I have played in handheld at times and it looks great to me. It's a little drop from docked sure, but its on a small screen and looks 100x better than any 3DS game anyway.