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Forums - Nintendo - Is Activision going to give up on the WiiU?

oniyide on 27 December 2013
S.T.A.G.E. said:
curl-6 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

Its the same damn game. Nintendos the only company forcing them to up-port and down-port. Why cant Nintendo just let them port a game smoothly? The profits must match the investment of the game itself. 

They didn't have to down-port or up-port to bring Black Ops 2 and Ghosts to Wii U. And since Ghosts was made, clearly Black Ops 2 turned a profit on Wii U.


There is NO excuse. Now I am seeing why they might have cut DLC. If the game doesn't meet the specific amount the expected percentage of people who buy DLC are half or less so on the Wii U there technically is no point. You guys have helped me understand the dilema entirely.


the thing is its not even a Wii U thing. Last i checked only 1/3 of people actually buy DLC for any given game. Across the board. So imagine how much would get it for wii U? what some dont want to understand is we have no idea how Ninty runs their online behind close doors, I know they charged crazy fees for games and whatnot back on WiiWare and they didnt let sales and stuff like that. Maybe its still the case, maybe they are just the worst to deal with in terms of online and if only a handful of people will support DLC its not worth it to put it on the store that accounts for less than 1 percent of sales, but naw Acti is evil



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oniyide on 27 December 2013
Cobretti2 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
Mnementh said:
oniyide said:
 

the seeds have already begun to be planted. Outside of Watchdogs i cant think of any next gen multiplat game thats coming to WIi U and even Watchdogs is cross gen

What next gen multiplat games exist so far? All I know are cross-gen games like FIFA or COD.


When last gen consoles lose the majority of the major support the Wii U can kiss the support goodbye. As I told someone before its blindly be obvious Nintendo is going to bite the dust with third party for coming out with a subpar powered console. Its also an underpowered console with no massive following so the third party doesn't even have incentive to create tailor made games for the Wii U. 

Take heed that one of the lead developers of the Elder Scrolls online said the PS4 and Xbox One were not on the list of consoles to get the game. It was meant to be PC only, but when they found out that the consoles were up to snuff as far as power was concerned they were more than happy to make a console port of the game. The Wii U will NOT get anything because its power is not on par with next gen expectation but rather slightly above last gen and its Nintendos fault for not consulting with third parties when they developed the Wii U. Bethesda said it best I think despite the fact that they do make buggy games, but Skyrim was awesome. 


1. Wii had a massive following and yet fuck all was made tailored to the console. The best Wii games were actually PS2/GCN ports liek RE4 and Godfather. After that it was all waggle controls. 

2. They did consult 3rd parties. The problem here was they consulted EA only with their unprecedented support. EA were prasing the console at E3. Then somehting fell apart which we won't argue on why and what as it has been argued to death. 

 

Nintendo will never get the same third party support even if it had more powerful hardware without doing other things. They need to either expand their studios, buy out some 2nd parties and MONEY HAT 3rd parties to develop exclusives to try and bring people to their console to build up a bigger user base of gamers (not casuals). Basically they need to become what Microsoft was when it launched its console and wanted to establish itself in the market (without the huge losses obviously).  They need to start this now and work on building those relationships for next gen with ignoring EA;s input and listed to developers that matter. 

I would argue that they made a LOT of games tailored to the console. Even in the beginning, what were all those dance fitness etc games for?



S.T.A.G.E. on 27 December 2013
oniyide said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
curl-6 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

Its the same damn game. Nintendos the only company forcing them to up-port and down-port. Why cant Nintendo just let them port a game smoothly? The profits must match the investment of the game itself. 

They didn't have to down-port or up-port to bring Black Ops 2 and Ghosts to Wii U. And since Ghosts was made, clearly Black Ops 2 turned a profit on Wii U.


There is NO excuse. Now I am seeing why they might have cut DLC. If the game doesn't meet the specific amount the expected percentage of people who buy DLC are half or less so on the Wii U there technically is no point. You guys have helped me understand the dilema entirely.


the thing is its not even a Wii U thing. Last i checked only 1/3 of people actually buy DLC for any given game. Across the board. So imagine how much would get it for wii U? what some dont want to understand is we have no idea how Ninty runs their online behind close doors, I know they charged crazy fees for games and whatnot back on WiiWare and they didnt let sales and stuff like that. Maybe its still the case, maybe they are just the worst to deal with in terms of online and if only a handful of people will support DLC its not worth it to put it on the store that accounts for less than 1 percent of sales, but naw Acti is evil


Exactly, why would they give the Wii U version DLC if the expectation is low based on sales? If you asked western third party who was the hardest company to crack as far as a partnership it would be Nintendo.



S.T.A.G.E. on 27 December 2013
padib said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
padib said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

When last gen consoles lose the majority of the major support the Wii U can kiss the support goodbye. As I told someone before its blindly be obvious Nintendo is going to bite the dust with third party for coming out with a subpar powered console. Its also an underpowered console with no massive following so the third party doesn't even have incentive to create tailor made games for the Wii U. 

Take heed that one of the lead developers of the Elder Scrolls online said the PS4 and Xbox One were not on the list of consoles to get the game. It was meant to be PC only, but when they found out that the consoles were up to snuff as far as power was concerned they were more than happy to make a console port of the game. The Wii U will NOT get anything because its power is not on par with next gen expectation but rather slightly above last gen and its Nintendos fault for not consulting with third parties when they developed the Wii U. Bethesda said it best I think despite the fact that they do make buggy games, but Skyrim was awesome. 

COD was selling fine on the Wii originally, viper has already explained to you why the Wii versions of COD dwindled release after release, it's nothing of Nintendo's fault. If you want to build a brand on a platform, you gotta work bitch (to quote a famous artist).

Even if Nintendo was on par graphically, if Acti does no work, they get no monyz. Simple. So it actually has nothing to do with Nintendo other than Nintendo's effort in smoothening relationships with 3rd parties is broken. But it has nothing to do with performance.

You've learned a few things in this thread, but they are mostly erroneous.

To further my point:

 

  • The DS is largely weaker than its competition, it still cleans the house.
  • When the U was out and there was no PS4/X1, the U's version of COD did not sell well either.
  • Some devs are at the moment saying things like "we have no audience on Nintendo consoles (laughs)", rather than "Nintendo's consoles aren't strong enough". That alone should make you think twice about your theory. Devs are just not supporting Nintendo consoles because they have not built a market on the platform. That takes effort and that effort was not put into place by 3rd party devs. They were in it for the easy cash. All except Ubisoft.

 


The DS is a completely different story. Third party react differently to consoles and opportunity therin.

That's just one of many points, but even then, that difference that you cite was created by the industry, e.g. it was fabricated. Because intrinsically there's no reason for it to exist.

A good game is a good game no matter the machine it runs on (at a certain point).

Yes, a good game is a good game and third parties know which console is profitable and with Nintendo its the DS. NIntendo never wavered on their handhelds. They did on their consoles and lost third parties as a result. Even when they were on top they had a shakey relationship with them.



S.T.A.G.E. on 27 December 2013
padib said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
padib said:

That's just one of many points, but even then, that difference that you cite was created by the industry, e.g. it was fabricated. Because intrinsically there's no reason for it to exist.

A good game is a good game no matter the machine it runs on (at a certain point).

Yes, a good game is a good game and third parties know which console is profitable and with Nintendo its the DS. NIntendo never wavered on their handhelds. They did on their consoles and lost third parties as a result. Even when they were on top they had a shakey relationship with them.

I honestly, honestly, don't understand your point of view.


Nintendo never dropped the ball with third parties because there werent major overhauls on format (like on consoles), the competition was low and the popularity was always on their side. If Nintendo ever loses this they are screwed, because this is how their dominance worked almost twenty years ago. I am sure you know their history. Nintendo can develop cheap and be extremely profitable and so can third parties. Problem with their competition like Sega and Sony, their games and consoles were more expensive. Problem is that logic only works with consoles. It does not translate to handhelds. No one wants to spend what they would for a console on a handheld.



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Mnementh on 27 December 2013
S.T.A.G.E. said:
Mnementh said:
oniyide said:
 

the seeds have already begun to be planted. Outside of Watchdogs i cant think of any next gen multiplat game thats coming to WIi U and even Watchdogs is cross gen

What next gen multiplat games exist so far? All I know are cross-gen games like FIFA or COD.


When last gen consoles lose the majority of the major support the Wii U can kiss the support goodbye. As I told someone before its blindly be obvious Nintendo is going to bite the dust with third party for coming out with a subpar powered console. Its also an underpowered console with no massive following so the third party doesn't even have incentive to create tailor made games for the Wii U.

Take heed that one of the lead developers of the Elder Scrolls online said the PS4 and Xbox One were not on the list of consoles to get the game. It was meant to be PC only, but when they found out that the consoles were up to snuff as far as power was concerned they were more than happy to make a console port of the game. The Wii U will NOT get anything because its power is not on par with next gen expectation but rather slightly above last gen and its Nintendos fault for not consulting with third parties when they developed the Wii U. Bethesda said it best I think despite the fact that they do make buggy games, but Skyrim was awesome.

I don't understand your post as answer to mine. I didn't say Nintendo would get great or good or even decent 3rd-party-support, as I don't believe they will get such support. I simply asked, which pure next-gen-multiplats are announced at this point. I decode your answer as suggesting Skyrim, but didn't a current gen console already got the game, making it effectively cross-gen?



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025 

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [GTA6]

Mnementh on 27 December 2013
oniyide said:
Mnementh said:
oniyide said:
 

the seeds have already begun to be planted. Outside of Watchdogs i cant think of any next gen multiplat game thats coming to WIi U and even Watchdogs is cross gen

What next gen multiplat games exist so far? All I know are cross-gen games like FIFA or COD.


FF15, KH3, SW Battlefront, Mirror's Edge 2, Fallout MMO, just of the top of my head. you good?

Thanks. All of this seems far away, am I right. Some games get later announcements of a WiiU-version or of features. People claimed that WiiU would NEVER get Watchdogs, no way that could happen. Now it comes. First rumors about Splinter Cell for WiiU were dismissed, because the kiddy-console never would get this games. Looking at your list - Fallout MMO seems really unlikely. FF15 too, Square Enix seems picky with mainline FF on Nintendo-console. Mirror's Edge is EA, that surely will skip WiiU. KH3 on the other hand - let's wait and see. Anyways, nothing of this will probably release in 2013.



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025 

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [GTA6]

curl-6 on 27 December 2013
S.T.A.G.E. said:
curl-6 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

Its the same damn game. Nintendos the only company forcing them to up-port and down-port. Why cant Nintendo just let them port a game smoothly? The profits must match the investment of the game itself. 

They didn't have to down-port or up-port to bring Black Ops 2 and Ghosts to Wii U. And since Ghosts was made, clearly Black Ops 2 turned a profit on Wii U.


There is NO excuse. Now I am seeing why they might have cut DLC. If the game doesn't meet the specific amount the expected percentage of people who buy DLC are half or less so on the Wii U there technically is no point. You guys have helped me understand the dilema entirely.

So now both your points about porting and profits were shot down, you're arguing that because Wii U owners don't buy gimped games, they don't care about the genre?



curl-6 on 27 December 2013
oniyide said:
curl-6 said:
oniyide said:

What sales? Both Cods on WII u flopped. COD did worst and worst as the years went on. Conduit 1 didnt sell as much as it should have and 2 was a straight up flop. GE is the only game released that actual did good. Hell we can go back on GC and you'll see that most 3rd party mulipats FPSs did worst on GC, and im talking compared to Xbox not PS2

You're just proven some peoples point of not even bothering, if you were not going to buy the DLC and from a stats stand point most people DONT why would that stop you from buying the game? It makes no sense. People are mad they dont have the option to buy something that they werent going to buy in the first place? a company should just waste time and resources to make them feel better? With that attitude some wonder why there arent alot of games on the system. Not to mention its the cheapest version but funny how people forget that (at least in the US)

YOu dont know nothing cause you've havent seen it, last time i checked people were innocent before proven guitly. You have NO evidence whatsoever. Its sounds like instead of just admiting what everyone knew for years that games like that simply dont do that well on Ninty platforms compared to the ohter systems, you rather just make up stuff that isnt even true. What was AC 4 excuse for flopping on WIi U again?

- COD3, World at War, Modern Warfare, Black  Ops, Goldeneye 007, all million plus selling FPS games on Wii. You don't cross a million where there is no audience.

- Nintendo gamers are pissed about being offered what they percieve as a sub par product. 

- AC4 was a shitty unoptimised 360 port. Splinter Cell Blacklist was a shitty unoptimised 360 port. Batman Arkham Origins was a shitty unoptimised 360 port. COD Ghosts. COD BO2. AC3. Take a wild guess what Watch Dogs will be.

they USED to cross a million, you keep avoiding the fact that they went down with each installment. Why?

Even if this is true that means they must have bought it elsewhere which means the audience is elsewhere. 

Did you play AC4? I dont think you did, it was patched up. I think you didnt play it and just making excuses for it flopping

- MIssing COD4 in 2007 began the decline, and this was exacerbated by MW1 arriving 2 years late in 2009 in place of MW2, a drop in interest in the Wii in 2011 when software support all but ceased, and the smaller install base and expectations of fair treatment not being met on Wii U.

- Or they could just have skipped it altogether.

- Digital Foundry's analysis found that AC4 had a shitty framerate on Wii U and like almost all Wii U ports did not tke advantage of the extra RAM for better textures and such.



S.T.A.G.E. on 27 December 2013
Mnementh said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
Mnementh said:
oniyide said:
 

the seeds have already begun to be planted. Outside of Watchdogs i cant think of any next gen multiplat game thats coming to WIi U and even Watchdogs is cross gen

What next gen multiplat games exist so far? All I know are cross-gen games like FIFA or COD.


When last gen consoles lose the majority of the major support the Wii U can kiss the support goodbye. As I told someone before its blindly be obvious Nintendo is going to bite the dust with third party for coming out with a subpar powered console. Its also an underpowered console with no massive following so the third party doesn't even have incentive to create tailor made games for the Wii U.

Take heed that one of the lead developers of the Elder Scrolls online said the PS4 and Xbox One were not on the list of consoles to get the game. It was meant to be PC only, but when they found out that the consoles were up to snuff as far as power was concerned they were more than happy to make a console port of the game. The Wii U will NOT get anything because its power is not on par with next gen expectation but rather slightly above last gen and its Nintendos fault for not consulting with third parties when they developed the Wii U. Bethesda said it best I think despite the fact that they do make buggy games, but Skyrim was awesome.

I don't understand your post as answer to mine. I didn't say Nintendo would get great or good or even decent 3rd-party-support, as I don't believe they will get such support. I simply asked, which pure next-gen-multiplats are announced at this point. I decode your answer as suggesting Skyrim, but didn't a current gen console already got the game, making it effectively cross-gen?


I was giving you a single example of whats to come on a larger scale for true next gen games from the horses mouth at Bethesda. Elder Scrolls online isn't a current gen game. I never said a word about Skyrim, I just said Skyrim was the only game I really I liked that wasn't majorly buggy from Bethesda even though though they have plenty of other good games. Elder Scrolls online wasnt even supposed  to be on consoles but because of the power of next gen consoles it is now a possibility. 

First of all the Wii U isn't even getting ports of most of the third party games coming to current gen so that should already be a warning to you.

Witcher 3

The Division

FF XV

Kingdom Hearts 3

Cyberpunk 2077 (Devs said it is most likely coming to next gen even though it isn't listed)

 

Most of the major next gen games showing off the start of next gen are exclusives though.

Those are just a handful of wave of next gen games. Once third parties are no longer dependent upon the sales of the last gen HD Twins the installed bases of the next gen HD Twins would've grown. That is when they will go all out. Wii U is still getting table scraps as it is right now. They wont dumb down the games any longer.

"The time for convincing publishers and developers to support Wii U has long past. The box is out."

Read:

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/199456/