Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Rumor: Xbox "Lockhart" specs leaked, is $300

goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

Yup, that’s a beautiful narrative that will last until Sony makes a PS5 Pro. Even when Xbox One support stops you all ready have a backup narrative for Xbox being held back in that you will solely blame Lockhart. 

Guess we have to have gameplay comparisons to prove you wrong. This speculation is far too easy to feed off of.  

There's not much to speculate if this new Lockhart news is real. It would be like MS releasing the 1X version 4 years to early and the 4Tflops Series S will be their actual next gen console. Maybe 12Flops is a bit crazy, but I would be seriously disappointed if they would officially announce the ps5 and it will be 4Tflops. I would much rather have seen 2 "normal" next gen consoles at 9TFlops and the 4k pro versions a couple years later.  

Lol is this post ironic or did you just give me a sample of said narrative? Ideally the Series X is the base and everything scales down. It’s quite simple, why would they go through all this trouble of advertising the thing if it won’t have its potential tapped?  But I’m sure you got your pre selected responses ready for that question. 



 

 

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Azzanation said:
Alot of people are underestimating the price of the Series X. Id expect something like $599 and $699.
This is where the $299 Series S looks attractive, be something like half the price of the Series X.

They would be insane to sell it that high after the last console to sell at $600 didn't sell very well and had to have a price cut after 7 months. Especially since the cost to build for Series X is estimated at $460-$510, consumers will feel ripped off when they read articles about that and realize they bought a console with $90 mark-up on it. I think MS will be smart and aim for $500. 

Last edited by shikamaru317 - on 10 March 2020

Azzanation said:
Alot of people are underestimating the price of the Series X. Id expect something like $599 and $699.
This is where the $299 Series S looks attractive, be something like half the price of the Series X.

Not gonna happen.

goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

Yup, that’s a beautiful narrative that will last until Sony makes a PS5 Pro. Even when Xbox One support stops you all ready have a backup narrative for Xbox being held back in that you will solely blame Lockhart. 

Guess we have to have gameplay comparisons to prove you wrong. This speculation is far too easy to feed off of.  

There's not much to speculate if this new Lockhart news is real. It would be like MS releasing the 1X version 4 years to early and the 4Tflops Series S will be their actual next gen console. Maybe 12Flops is a bit crazy, but I would be seriously disappointed if they would officially announce the ps5 and it will be 4Tflops. I would much rather have seen 2 "normal" next gen consoles at 9TFlops and the 4k pro versions a couple years later.  

Completely wrong. It would be like a weaker xbox one releasing in 2013, limited to 540p and costing less.



sales2099 said:
goopy20 said:

There's not much to speculate if this new Lockhart news is real. It would be like MS releasing the 1X version 4 years to early and the 4Tflops Series S will be their actual next gen console. Maybe 12Flops is a bit crazy, but I would be seriously disappointed if they would officially announce the ps5 and it will be 4Tflops. I would much rather have seen 2 "normal" next gen consoles at 9TFlops and the 4k pro versions a couple years later.  

Lol is this post ironic or did you just give me a sample of said narrative? Ideally the Series X is the base and everything scales down. It’s quite simple, why would they go through all this trouble of advertising the thing if it won’t have its potential tapped?  But I’m sure you got your pre selected responses ready for that question. 

I haven't seen any advertising from MS, so who knows which console they'll put more focus on. All I know is that if the Series X would be the base platform, all of MS's exclusives would push it to the max at 30fps/1440p. On Series S, those games would run at like 540p.

In the end MS will just look at which console sells the most and run with that as the base platform. If that turns out to be Series S they will likely aim for parity and we get the exact same games running at 1080p on Series S vs native 4k on Series X. Imo that would be a serious waste of resources and ps5 games that do target 1440p will no doubt look a lot better, defeating the whole purpose of Series X being the most expensive and most powerful console.



goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

Lol is this post ironic or did you just give me a sample of said narrative? Ideally the Series X is the base and everything scales down. It’s quite simple, why would they go through all this trouble of advertising the thing if it won’t have its potential tapped?  But I’m sure you got your pre selected responses ready for that question. 

I haven't seen any advertising from MS, so who knows which console they'll put more focus on. All I know is that if the Series X would be the base platform, all of MS's exclusives would push it to the max at 30fps/1440p. On Series S, those games would run at like 540p.

In the end MS will just look at which console sells the most and run with that as the base platform. If that turns out to be Series S they will likely aim for parity and we get the exact same games running at 1080p on Series S vs native 4k on Series X. Imo that would be a serious waste of resources and ps5 games that do target 1440p will no doubt look a lot better, defeating the whole purpose of Series X being the most expensive and most powerful console.

Whew, good thing you have zero insight into what goes on at MS. Your last sentence proves yourself wrong...all that R&D wastes if they don’t plan to make anything of it. 



 

 

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sales2099 said:
goopy20 said:

I haven't seen any advertising from MS, so who knows which console they'll put more focus on. All I know is that if the Series X would be the base platform, all of MS's exclusives would push it to the max at 30fps/1440p. On Series S, those games would run at like 540p.

In the end MS will just look at which console sells the most and run with that as the base platform. If that turns out to be Series S they will likely aim for parity and we get the exact same games running at 1080p on Series S vs native 4k on Series X. Imo that would be a serious waste of resources and ps5 games that do target 1440p will no doubt look a lot better, defeating the whole purpose of Series X being the most expensive and most powerful console.

Whew, good thing you have zero insight into what goes on at MS. Your last sentence proves yourself wrong...all that R&D wastes if they don’t plan to make anything of it. 

We're not going to have another thread with you two taking over and bickering back-and-forth. At this point, y'all need not reply to one another again. Give it 30 days. I'll lift the ban after that to see if things can resume under better circumstances, but for now, avoid contacting each other. This goes for you as well @goopy20

Also, don't reply to this post asking for info. You can PM me for anything further, but it should be obvious enough why the decision was made.



                                                                                                             

goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

Lol is this post ironic or did you just give me a sample of said narrative? Ideally the Series X is the base and everything scales down. It’s quite simple, why would they go through all this trouble of advertising the thing if it won’t have its potential tapped?  But I’m sure you got your pre selected responses ready for that question. 

I haven't seen any advertising from MS, so who knows which console they'll put more focus on. All I know is that if the Series X would be the base platform, all of MS's exclusives would push it to the max at 30fps/1440p. On Series S, those games would run at like 540p.

In the end MS will just look at which console sells the most and run with that as the base platform. If that turns out to be Series S they will likely aim for parity and we get the exact same games running at 1080p on Series S vs native 4k on Series X. Imo that would be a serious waste of resources and ps5 games that do target 1440p will no doubt look a lot better, defeating the whole purpose of Series X being the most expensive and most powerful console.

In your scenario, a Series X game doing 1440p/30 fps would be 540p/30 fps on Series S. That would be a very demanding game with high fidelity graphics, that same product would probably be around 1080p on PS5, assuming current rumors are accurate.

It seems like the obvious solution is simply lowering some visual settings to boost resolution on a Series S version. Whether that be lighting, shadows, draw distance, etc. Hence, the same solutions we've used on PC games for decades.

I think you assume AAA games on a 9TF PS5 might have a focus on 1440p-4K/30 fps. I mean it seems highly unlikely Sony will make 1080p games on PS5. So if the next Horizon:ZD and God of War are 1440p/30 fps, its very likely the Series S could handle those same visuals at 900p-1080p.

Again, my comment assumes rumored specs are true.



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Nu-13 said:
Azzanation said:
Alot of people are underestimating the price of the Series X. Id expect something like $599 and $699.
This is where the $299 Series S looks attractive, be something like half the price of the Series X.

Not gonna happen.

The specs of the Series X say otherwise. Its a premium product and i predict the console to be way higher than what many assume here. It will cost more than the XB1X easily.

This is why MS are releasing 2 products instead of one because they know the Series X will be too much for the majority. If its $499 or $549 they wouldn't bother making a Series S so early in my opinion.



The clue is in the name 'Series'. Strongly implies there's going to be more than one, concurrent.



Azzanation said:
Nu-13 said:

Not gonna happen.

The specs of the Series X say otherwise. Its a premium product and i predict the console to be way higher than what many assume here. It will cost more than the XB1X easily.

This is why MS are releasing 2 products instead of one because they know the Series X will be too much for the majority. If its $499 or $549 they wouldn't bother making a Series S so early in my opinion.

Could be. MS may think SNY will shoot for $399 again with a single SKU, and won't dare go over $499, meaning if they create a premium XB for $599, that they will be guaranteed to have the most powerful console. It would also allow them to announce it really early and feel confident proclaiming it'll be the most powerful console next gen, which is exactly what they've done.

This would also allow them to more legitimately launch a weaker $299-$399 base version, simply for those who can't afford the premium edition. At the same time, this allows them to try and play "monkey in the middle" with PS5. To try and keep sales away from PS5 as much as possible. Take the non dedicated PS fans away at the cheaper and more expensive end of the spectrum. Don't even bother with Pro if it's still on the market, get Lockhart, it's next gen!

While a $299 and $499 next gen XB would also probably work with a $399 PS5, it leaves the door open to PS5 potentially being $499 as well and being the most powerful console by some margin. MS at that point wouldn't really be able to drop the price of the XBSX because it makes Lockhart less and less worth it. SNY could even subsidize PS5 a bit and make the XBSX price drop useless in comparison, while also making PS5 more and more appealing compared to Lockhart. Dropping the price of Lockhart is not going to happen for quite a while either.

MS likely realizes that price can convince many people, if the hardware is deemed worthy enough by the masses. They also seem to realize that premium items sell well enough in general if they are clearly "the" premium product. They no doubt understand that the PS brand is extremely strong and that going head to head with PS5 at the same price would still be an uphill battle, even with somewhat stronger specs.

This type of approach will also either force SNY to "cheap out" somewhat on PS5 to keep the price right in the middle, possibly closer to Lockhart to make PS5 seem like a value deal, or heavily subsidize PS5 early on to offer amazing performance for the price, or launch two consoles of their own. SNY could try and market PS5 at $499, even if it's a clear value at that price, and hope they can make Lockhart look like a lost cause in consumers eyes. That could backfire though. This is also why Lockhart priced around $299 makes sense, because at $399, a 9TF-10TF PS5 at $499 would seem like a steal of a deal, with XBSX only being slightly more powerful for another $100 more. Lockhart wouldn't be as useful at $399 from a marketing perspective here, even though from a dev perspective it would be more worthy.

Lockhart can't be any cheaper than $299 if it's going to play 1080p/60 high settings for the entirety of the gen, so the only way to make a big enough gap is to make XBSX quite expensive. The closer together the two XB prices were, the easier it would be for PS5 to counteract. Mind you, $299 and $599 for a next gen console has never been attempted before and is a gamble in itself. There's no guarantee it would work, or work well for that matter, but at least it wouldn't seem like they're playing SNY's game on SNY's terms.

PS3 at $499 and $599 was not smart and just asking for trouble. XBS consoles at $299 and $599 would be risky, or "bold", but has more thought behind it. Whether it would work or not, we'll see?