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I used to say switch, but damn no have not played every n64 game



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With an extra Zelda and an extra Metroid, it might become as good as the GameCube in my book. Still would place the SNES ahead, though.



 

 

 

 

 

It's hard to say too because Switch and Wii benefitted a lot from being able to borrow games from their predecessors.

Imagine the GameCube got to launch with say ... Zelda: Majora's Mask and Perfect Dark. Probably would have had a bit of a different product cycle, certainly a stronger start.

Modern systems are harder to gauge because so much of the content, even major content is from previous platforms (this is true of the PS5/XSX too).

SNES usually wins these polls, but N64 should have topped the SNES. 

Last edited by Soundwave - on 29 November 2022

Soundwave said:

It's hard to say too because Switch and Wii benefitted a lot from being able to borrow games from their predecessors.

Imagine the GameCube got to launch with say ... Zelda: Majora's Mask and Perfect Dark. Probably would have had a bit of a different product cycle, certainly a stronger start.

Modern systems are harder to gauge because so much of the content, even major content is from previous platforms (this is true of the PS5/XSX too).

SNES usually wins these polls, but N64 should have topped the SNES. 

GC did have prior games though, Animal Crossing was a port of the N64 game not released outside of Japan and the Zelda games on N64 were released on GC as well as the whole RE mainline series old games on newer platforms have been a thing for ages, even if you removed prior content from Switch it would still top N64 and GC for example look at RPGs on the Switch an area in the library long criticized on prior platforms only the SNES really compares another point is look at the launch year even without BOTW and MK8 NS still had SMO, XBC2, Splatoon 2, Mario+Rabbids, and FE Warriors.

N64 launched with SM64 one of the greatest games of all time and had various games that fall into that boat that still didn't help it as at the end of the day if we're comparing platforms appeal is one thing but objectives certainly can't be overlooked.



The Wii U, but that wasn't exactly difficult.



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Soundwave said:

It's hard to say too because Switch and Wii benefitted a lot from being able to borrow games from their predecessors.

Imagine the GameCube got to launch with say ... Zelda: Majora's Mask and Perfect Dark. Probably would have had a bit of a different product cycle, certainly a stronger start.

Modern systems are harder to gauge because so much of the content, even major content is from previous platforms (this is true of the PS5/XSX too).

SNES usually wins these polls, but N64 should have topped the SNES. 

I think the SNES tops polls because of greater volume and diversity of games. While Mario 64 was a big leap in graphics and tech, it felt mainly like an impressive demonstration of the future of 3D. The game itself was desolate game compared to Super Mario World or Super Mario Bros 3. The controls (mainly thanks to the camera) felt janky and unpolished, like the game feel like a very unpolished experience. The overall experience felt much slower than earlier Mario games. Another reason the SNES generally wins is that while the N64 did add new experiences, it felt like it took away even more; this is in contrast to the SNES that only felt like it was building on the NES. This is also the deal with Wii and pet of why it felt like a renaissance: way more volume, and it brought back all of the old missing experiences on top of adding in new ones, and new spins on existing ones (like motion golf games, such as Tiger Woods).


The thing about Wii and Switch is that while they did get a lot of ports, they also improved the experiences a lot of the time. Resident Evil 4 got the IR aiming on the Wii which turns a kind of clunk combat on PS2/GC into a smooth and infinitely more satisfying experience—that said, there’s something to be said about survival and horror and clunky controls, it adds a bit to the fear factor—but I found that was mostly true for the early RE games and not so much for Code Veronica and later. And just the option of putting games on portable really increases their usability; particularly if you commute, work in an office, or just like to lay in the hammock or other relaxing area and play video games as an alternative to reading a book. Apart from that, Switch’s Mario Kart 8 has a drastic improvement on multiplayer over the Wii U by moving it from 4 player split screen into a 12 player game where everyone has their own full screen which brings the game to a whole new level. And multiplayer (specifically local multiplayer) is ~95% of the fun with Mario Kart: especially for those who have clocked 400+ hours in.

But different people are going to have different experiences. Art is subjective.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Wyrdness said:
Soundwave said:

It's hard to say too because Switch and Wii benefitted a lot from being able to borrow games from their predecessors.

Imagine the GameCube got to launch with say ... Zelda: Majora's Mask and Perfect Dark. Probably would have had a bit of a different product cycle, certainly a stronger start.

Modern systems are harder to gauge because so much of the content, even major content is from previous platforms (this is true of the PS5/XSX too).

SNES usually wins these polls, but N64 should have topped the SNES. 

GC did have prior games though, Animal Crossing was a port of the N64 game not released outside of Japan and the Zelda games on N64 were released on GC as well as the whole RE mainline series old games on newer platforms have been a thing for ages, even if you removed prior content from Switch it would still top N64 and GC for example look at RPGs on the Switch an area in the library long criticized on prior platforms only the SNES really compares another point is look at the launch year even without BOTW and MK8 NS still had SMO, XBC2, Splatoon 2, Mario+Rabbids, and FE Warriors.

N64 launched with SM64 one of the greatest games of all time and had various games that fall into that boat that still didn't help it as at the end of the day if we're comparing platforms appeal is one thing but objectives certainly can't be overlooked.

Animal Crossing was effectively a new IP for the GameCube as the N64 game was never released in the West and even the Japanese game came out late in the N64's life cycle. So yeah, GameCube got a little benefit there, but it wasn't exactly a system seller at that time (2002). The GameCube was also almost a year old by the time it came out so it didn't even really help it in that crucial launch window period. 

Majora's Mask ... now that could have possibly impacted the GCN's fortunes early quite a bit, that's one of the greatest games ever made arguably and Perfect Dark would have been the best FPS (or one of them). 

N64 is just an anomaly in that I think it's a system that was legitimately popular (early N64 sales destroyed the Playstation's sales rate and N64 was THE hottest gift to get for 1996 other than the Tickle Me Elmo mega-craze), but it was crippled by one stupid design decision on Nintendo's part (to not accommodate CDs, especially when you could still have had a cartridge slot too). The fact that the N64 still sold the same as the SNES in North America and Europe despite having little 3rd party support and like a library only 1/4 the size of the SNES is pretty telling. If they had the 3rd party support they should have had (Final Fantasy exclusive, things like MGS, Resident Evil, Metal Gear Solid at worst multiplat) ... it would probably be the greatest Nintendo system. 

The library it should have had would have been unbelievable.



I would say by now Switch has surpassed GameCube and 3DS as my fave Nintendo platform.

I have issues with the Switch, both at launch and now. But the sheer library of Nintendo and third-party games is staggering. Yeah, the eShop is full of bad and mediocre games. But there is quality as well. If I didn't have a PS4 and now a PS5, I would be playing way more third-party games on the Switch. I cannot say the same for a lot of Nintendo platforms. It just shows that even when the specs are weak, third parties will deliver the games if there's money to be made.



Lifetime Sales Predictions 

Switch: 144 million (was 73, then 96, then 113 million, then 125 million)

PS5: 105 million Xbox Series S/X: 60 million

PS4: 120 mil (was 100 then 130 million, then 122 million) Xbox One: 51 mil (was 50 then 55 mil)

3DS: 75.5 mil (was 73, then 77 million)

"Let go your earthly tether, enter the void, empty and become wind." - Guru Laghima

Soundwave said:

Animal Crossing was effectively a new IP for the GameCube

N64 is just an anomaly in that I think it's a system that was legitimately popular (early N64 sales destroyed the Playstation's sales rate and N64 was THE hottest gift to get for 1996 other than the Tickle Me Elmo mega-craze), but it was crippled by one stupid design decision on Nintendo's part (to not accommodate CDs, especially when you could still have had a cartridge slot too).

Animal Crossing - brilliant and original game that fundamentally began a paradigm shift in how games can be viewed. While it wasn’t the first casual game, there were a few browser games by that point that did well (A game called Earth2025 and its sister game Utopia we’re doing freemium casual gaming in the 1990s) it was the first major casual game, and the one that got the new formula talked about. Animal Crossing didn’t encourage binge play, rather it encouraged short bursts at least once a day, and probably multiple times. My personal experience with that game was a living world where friends would come over and literally spend days playing the game, it was really addictive. But the series was a sleeper hit because while the fans knew it was special, it was relatively small, and its destiny was to grow bigger and bigger as a series until fifth iteration hit the Switch and becoming the #1 best selling game for a single dedicated gaming system (aside from Wii Sports).

I agree, the CDs would have made a gigantic difference on the N64. Many of the genres the Nintendo systems lost, like being THE place for RPGs and 2D platformers would have been there still. Although, Nintendo’s problems with third parties were deeper than the cartridges, I can’t help but think the CDs would have made the difference and would have made any wounds a lot easier to overcome. One of the major issues was most RPGs couldn’t run on cartridge without massive expenses and sacrifices to the audio and visuals, and that’s why almost all of them went to PlayStation. I also agree that N64 kind of felt like a fad. It was my #1 console for about 6 months or so, and then it was Playstation, and a lot of that happened around the holidays of 97 through Spring of 98 with key games like FF7 and Resident Evil 2—and I think a lot of Nintendo fans experienced a very similar thing (There were earlier games too, Resident Evil 1, Tomb Raider, Twisted Metal, Crash Bandicoot, and Wipeout come to mind). But, in Europe, at least, Sony ads touted how the PlayStation had X00 games on it, meanwhile Nintendo was like “We got TWO new games this month, NBA Hangtime AND F1 Pole Position 64! So, I think if Nintendo could have the quantity, then it would have been a different story. Not just the quantity, but price-wise the N64 games were kind of insane, from around 35% more to more than triple the price of Playstation games—that is also a side effect of cartridges vs. CDs. So, to date, I still feel that cartridges were Nintendo’s alltime biggest mistake, and the harm it did during the N64 generation is still healing at the end of 2022. Two major products Nintendo could have had on their consoles as possible exclusives are Final Fantasy and Grand Theft Auto—GTA was made by a “second party”/Dream Team studio, DMA (before it was Rockstar North), who was very close with Nintendo until the stresses of the N64 era. We also might have never lost Rare. But all three of those companies had other issues with Nintendo that went deeper (particularly DMA). Yamauchi was very insulting to Square and didn’t think Rare was worth the 200-300 million to buy. DMA, I’m not sure that was Yamauchi, but Nintendo was overly controlling of their vision, wanted them to make RPGs to fill in the gap on the N64, not vehicle games (Body Harvest, GTA, Space Station Silicon Valley), and that resulted in GTA getting pulled to windows and eventually PSX, and development on Body Harvest and Space Station for N64 was nightmarish.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Soundwave said:

It's hard to say too because Switch and Wii benefitted a lot from being able to borrow games from their predecessors.

Imagine the GameCube got to launch with say ... Zelda: Majora's Mask and Perfect Dark. Probably would have had a bit of a different product cycle, certainly a stronger start.

Modern systems are harder to gauge because so much of the content, even major content is from previous platforms (this is true of the PS5/XSX too).

SNES usually wins these polls, but N64 should have topped the SNES. 

As someone who already had a Gamecube when I got a Wii and a Wii U when I got a Switch, and didn't double up on any of the recycled content, both Wii and Switch had more than enough to stand on their own two feet.

You could strip out every Wii U game from the Switch and it would still have an incredibly strong library; Mario Odyssey, Metroid Dread, Splatoon 2 and 3, Xenoblade 2 and 3, Smash Ultimate, Monster Hunter Rise, Astral Chain, Bayonetta 3, Luigi's Mansion 3, Witcher 3, Doom 2016 and Eternal, Ori and the Blind Forest/Will of the Wisps, Nier Automata, It Takes Two, Hellblade, Kirby and the Forgotten Land, Mario + Rabbids Kingdom Battle and Sparks of Hope, the list goes on and on.

Last edited by curl-6 - on 29 November 2022

Bet with Liquidlaser: I say PS5 and Xbox Series will sell more than 56 million combined by the end of 2023. (And over 130 million lifetime)