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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Is it FAIR for sony to win this generation?

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padib said:
Sprash said:
padib said:
They won because Nintendo and MS screwed up (and it showed even before the PS4 released, at least for Nintendo), and they got it right this gen.

So, what be your guess if Nintendo and MS didn't screwed up?

It's a very interesting question. It would be the first time all 3 were somewhat established and didn't screw up in the same gen.

It would be something like last gen, but Nintendo would win and Sony would beat MS, mostly thanks to Europe and Japan.

Maybe 100m Nintendo, 90m PS, 70m MS.


100 million for Nintendo would require a whole lot more than just not screwing up lol.



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I think PlayStation fans have been used to the number one spot so if it makes the fans happier, why not? I have always gone for the one that is not at the top simply because I like the underdog and you can find some really nice gems.



spemanig said:
naruball said:

I see this posted all the time and I always laugh. What makes you think Sony wouldn't be winning if the other two didn't fuck up? Some arguments would be much appreciated.

Microsoft gained so much steam with the 360 last generation and Nintendo's brand is as powerful, if not more, than Playstation's. I don't remember any bullish claims that the PS4 would be on top of the "720" before the PR disaster of 2013 happened. Xbox was on par until that day happened and it wasn't. If the reveal of the XBO showed the XBO as it is now, from both a marketing and product perspective, I don't understand how any right minded individual could think the XBO wouldn't be on top of the PS4. Many of the PS4's sales game from people who switched platforms because of that PR disaster, people who wouldn't have switched if if did not happen. The XBO has had a more compelling line up of AAA exclusive titles each year since launch than the PS4. That's something even Sony themselves has admitted. Would it be close, like it was last gen? Obviously, but the 360 didn't need Japan to lead most of the generation prior, and the XBO sure as hell wouldn't have needed it this gen.

As for Nintendo, I think people have been blinded by just how often they have fucked up in the last 20 years, because they don't seem to be able to even comprehend what not fucking up means. Even ignoring the fact that they won last generation handily, on both the home and handheld fronts, Nintendo has the most powerful IP in the industry. The last time they did everything right was with the SNES, and they won. Even if they did the bare minimum and simply made as standard console that only made the necessary consessions to compete, releasing 1 year early with that kind of graphically on par product, having third party support, having standardized modern features, and not having a massive and crippling software drought literally every year since its launch, it would have been just as fierce of competition to the PS4 and XBO as the SNES was to the Genesis years ago.

EDIT: This is off topic though. They didn't do everything right. No point discussing what didn't happen.

Hm. Let's see.

No, Nintendo's brand is by no means more powerful. Playstation consoles, even at their worst, even when Sony managed to fuck up majorly and produce a crazy expensive console without many exclusives at first, still sold incredibly well. Can't say the same thing about N64, Gamecube, or WiiU. Even the Wii did incredibly well for a few years and horribly the last two(?) before WiiU even launched. Just like Guitar Hero or some of many other cool things that the masses like for a while. Kinect is the perfect example (huge spike in sales when it launched and when ps3 was beating xb360 easily, and completely abandoned after xb1 launched). Casuals were singing its praises, until they weren't. There was no way Wiiu would do well unless it had an innovation/gimmick or whatever people want to call it. 

Xbox360 was not on par with ps3. Far from it. It had America and the UK, but it was doing badly in Japan (huge market) and less good in the rest of the world, and especially in Europe. It took Sony to fuck up for xb360 to sell as many consoles as a ps console did. Why are you focuing so much on other companies fucking up this generation and ignore Sony's major mistakes last generation?

"The XBO has had a more compelling line up of AAA exclusive titles each year since launch than the PS4. That's something even Sony themselves has admitted"

I'm gonna need a source for that ;) Because there's a huge difference between "we need to do better in terms of 1st party games" and "xb1 and/or WiiU has better 1st party support".

"Even if they did the bare minimum and simply made as standard console that only made the necessary consessions to compete, releasing 1 year early with that kind of graphically on par product, having third party support, having standardized modern features, and not having a massive and crippling software drought literally every year since its launch, it would have been just as fierce of competition to the PS4 and XBO as the SNES was to the Genesis years ago."

I couldn't disagree more. There's a reason most 3rd party developers don't bother with Ninty. Ninty fans buy mostly Ninty games. Sony fans don't support Sony games nearly as much. Wiiu did have some support from 3rd party developers and they seemed pretty enthusiastic about the console. Then wiiu owners didn't buy enough copies of their games, while fully supporting Ninty games, and they saw no point even bothering with ports. What else did you exactly expect from them to do? Keep losing money?

As long as Ninty does not come up with a new innovative idea or a game that can have a massive following (see GTA, Fallout, Skyrim, not Splatoon), there's no way a Ninty console will do well. I can see fans coming up with a new excuse when NX doesn't do well (or just blame marketing again), but at some point they're gonna have to accept that Ninty may have some legendary IPs but most people don't care enough for them to buy a Ninty console to play them.

 



Teeqoz said:
chakkra said:
Teeqoz said:
There's no such thing as "fair" when it comes to a situation like this. Neither of the companies "deserve" or "don't deserve" their position, wether it's 3rd, 2nd or 1st, it's just how it is.

 

I totally disagree with you there.  If any product provides the best value for the money to consumers, then I feel that product "deserves" to sell more, therefore "winning".  That way the other companies will step up their game for the next time, and in the end the real winners will be us consumers.


What defines which product "provides best value for the money to consumers"?

Well, that is a good question since, as others have already said, that is highly subjective because value is different to each individual. 

Now, that being said, there are some things that I think can be looked at in a more objective manner. For example, we could argue for years about which console has the best games and we will probably never get to an agreement, and that is because "quality" is highly subjective.  But there is one thing we cannot argue about: and that is QUANTITY.  No one can deny that the PS4 has more games nowadays and it will have more games when everything is said and done.  

And we know that quantity doesnt guarantee quality, but there is one thing that it is almost 100% guaranteed to come with it, and that is VARIETY. I dont think anyone can deny that the PS4 has a more varied library of games.

Like, for example, how would you sell the Wii U to an Sports fan?  How would you convince an FPS lover to get a Wii U when it doesnt have any of the big guns in that genre? sure, it has Splatoon (which looks amazing btw)  but can that really be considered enough to attract an FPS lover?

And let's not forget that when it comes to multiplats, the PS4 will have (almost a 100% of the times) the best looking versions of said games, even if its just a tad bit.

So yes, I truly feel that this round should go to Sony.  That way the others will be encouraged to come back more aggresive next time. And the real Winners will be us consumers.



AlfredoTurkey said:
Sprash said:

Can microsoft pull a ps3 this generation or is it really lost for them to catch up?

Where is the NX going to be? catching up to the xbox one or even the ps4 or won't it not even come close to the xbox one by the end?


Microsoft can easily catch up and pass PS4 in the US. World wide is a losing cause though. I think they'd be better served focusing on the US from now on and forget Japan all together. 

Nintendo's next console is a hard one to gauge because it's going to be mid generation. Anything can happen with that console. Either way, I'm all in day one because well... Nintendo.

That's an exaggeration, they'd have to change their entire sales momentum, which would require a lot more distributed game releases, which is not easy for Microsoft. Only Nintendo has that number of IPs and even they can't develop them on time and have a stable schedule. As last year showed, beating the PS4 for 2/12 months isn't going to cut it, it has to outsell it consistently, which it has never done for more than 3 months at a time.



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Well Sony has pretty much stomped 3/4 generations they have been in. So it is well deserved.



TheBlackNaruto said:
AlfredoTurkey said:


Microsoft can easily catch up and pass PS4 in the US. World wide is a losing cause though. I think they'd be better served focusing on the US from now on and forget Japan all together. 

Nintendo's next console is a hard one to gauge because it's going to be mid generation. Anything can happen with that console. Either way, I'm all in day one because well... Nintendo.

While anything can happen what makes you think it would be easy? I mean if it was that easy wouldn't they have already done it?


I said it COULD do it easily. I don't think it WILL happen easily. Microsoft would have to knock it out of the park in some way if it happened but it's possible.



I think people have the feeling that PS is stronger than what it is, but I don´t think they would be winning this generation if the other 2 didn't fucked it up so bad in certain key things. The next time they have a real competition since the beginning like last gen, we'll see.



Goodnightmoon said:
I think people have the feeling that PS is stronger than what it is, but I don´t think they would be winning this generation if the other 2 didn't fucked it up so bad in certain key things. The next time they have a real competition since the beginning like last gen, we'll see.

It's the opposite for xbox too tbh. I've had casuals tell me they chose xb because it had better ports. Apparently the 360 was burnt into their heads during a completely different generation.



I think Sony definitely deserves to win this generation, after all they created the most capable console, in a tidy package, made the most improvements compared to last generation overall and laid the groundwork for that to happen, the competition really didn't, in fact they took the opposite approach.

As far as games goes Sony have better supported their machine internally compared to Microsoft, Nintendo have released more games than either, though their machine has been on the market for about a year longer than Sony or Microsoft's so that should be the case at this point, though Sony has more AAA and other kinds of exclusives coming in the future too, with plenty more to be announced by the 1st party studios.

Sony have put in the work creating a solid brand in past generations, building an industry leading network of studios. They aren't resting on their success either, despite the fact that they've been outselling the competition substantially.
PS4 really has something for every kind of game and it's that variety that is why Sony continue to be the market leader.

Despite what fans of Xbox claim Microsoft's support for Xbox One has been woeful at best and definitely pails in comparison to PS4, with MS leaving massive chunks of time without a single exclusive, that hasn't been true of Sony or Nintendo, not to the degree that Microsoft has let things continue.
Xbox Fans really should be demanding more.

Even if Microsoft hadn't tried DRM or made mistakes in making XBox One a media box first PS4 still would have been a more capable machine, with more games (that's been true since PS4's launch). MS always would have tried to bundle in Kinect, fool gamers into thinking it was necessary to the system's functionality.

As it stands PS4 has more AAA games already and more on the horizon, more new IP, more AA and Indie titles. Sony are continuing to build their studio network, developing relations with Studios outside of Playstation.
Sony are doing the most work.

I constantly see this whole thing of "Businesses can't care for their customers", which makes no sense, since the more you actually consider what kinds of products your target market wants and the more you actually genuinely do care about seeing their needs are met, the more likely people will actually buy your products.
Caring for customers and wanting profit actually aren't opposing things, they go hand in hand, the more you try to give your target market what you think they want, rather than appealing to their needs the worse you will do in the market, it's just a logical fact.