What the hell are you talking about? Not at all.

now you are just talking nonsense willpower is mesurable and is a real aspect of a person's personality and is in no way in conflict with athisim.

I'm sorry snakenobi, but you're coming across as an arrogant self-righteous prick. So I'm going to stop talking to you.

That analogue is flawed

You got willpower purely out of your survival instinct. On average humans prefer to go against the odds and die trying than just give up and shoot themselves. Even shooting yourself requires immense amount of willpower.

Snakenobi, your arguments are filled what are called logical fallacies...

Just to point out a few, straw man arguments:

when you are putting all atheists into 1 bandwagon pretending all agree with what you're arguing against. In this case you're forgetting that apart from 'i don't believe in the existence of a god' there's nothing else you can unite all atheists in.
As an example, the Buddhists you so much seem to praise ARE atheists too. I think this is enough to show how you're straw manning your 'opponent'.

Also we have appeal to authority:

When you're presenting the claim that most scientists agree with your view (specially without presenting any evidence of this claim just to make it worse). You're using the credibility that science has to try and justify your point, saying 'well... most scientists agree with me, so... you're clearly wrong'. Again this could be a more acceptable point if you actually presented some sort of proof for that claim, which you do not.

Ad hominem fallacy:

When you're presenting the argument that atheism is somewhat showing a weakness or be detrimental to the happiness of a person. The fact that a position can or will hurt a person, physically, psychologically or in any other form, has no bearing on weather that position is true or false. Again, all an atheist is defined by stands as 'I do not believe a god exists', so no matter how bad you think the person feels after professing this belief, it says nothing about the truth and justification to hold such belief.

I think these examples are enough for now, but I will finish off with an advice. Chose your battles well. From what I could see you really have no real disagreement with atheists in large. Probably you'll have more productive struggle if you'll actually engage some religious people who intend to impose their beliefs on the rest of society by the form of legislation.

1 last food for thought... do you think a person will live a more meaningful life if they believe this is the only change they get to enjoy it or if they think this is just the 'test run' before the 'real life' begins. Or that this is simply one of many tries we get since after we die we reincarnate again over and over again (buddhism)?

cheers and have fun

I don't believe in a god for the simple fact that there is no measurable evidence for his/her existence and I'm against the idea of organised religion in general. An organised religion suggests a set of defined beliefs that a significant group should all unquestioningly believe in. It typically leads to some form of hierachial organisation which in turn leads to people gaining control and influence over the masses via unproven and often illogical beliefs.

Spirituality should be completely individual and should be down to the individual to discover. Not forced upon you in a group or when you are a child.

As for this whole pantheism thing, I don't see your point. You can admire the natural world, see its beauty and be humbled by its awesome power, but why worship it like a deity? Why does an atheist need to call themselves a pantheist or vice versa? Why limit yourself to a set of ideals and philosophies set by others?

call it what you want

Science is about the pursuit of knowledge. If that helps humanity, so be it.

Buddhism does indeed have no God, which makes it a lot more sensible than the large majority of religions, and I would not disrespect anyone who chooses to follow Buddhism.

I suppose the bit that gets me is the vegetarianism. I'd rather eat meat, then wait until I am reincarnated as a vegetarian animal, I suppose.

Also, I would love a link for that, because it seems far more logical that most scientists are either atheist/agnostic or Christian.

People are awesome, crazy things. Life is exciting and at times unbelievable. You don't need a belief in any higher power or purpose to experience those things. I can't understand the claim that atheists should find life worthless, if anything atheists are the ones that should beyond all realise the brevity of life and as such try and experience it to the fullest.

I was hoping I wouldn't have anything to do with this thread (considering it's obvious snake made this thread just to argue for the sake of argument), but I just wanted to say: You know that goes both ways, right?