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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Gluttons For Punishment

LegitHyperbole said:
G2ThaUNiT said:

If you wanna take a look at how insane the Last Wish raid in particular is, here's a quick rundown video. The guy quickly goes over all the Mechanics and Encounters. There's like 20 mechanics to this raid lol. The final boss is INSANE when it comes to mechanics. So much so that this guy actually made a separate video on how to defeat her properly. He only includes the cheese way to defeat her in the first video, but that obviously wasn't an option when the raid first released. 

And no, there are no waypoints or objective lists. Your fireteam has to figure everything out on their own no matter how many times y'all wipe trying to figure out the mechanics. Although waypoints are for the most part self explanatory since the raids are mostly linear.

Wow. That's quite a bit more complex than I was expecting, no wonder it took ya'll so long, I'm surprised it wasn't longer. Lots of wipeable conditions too outside of simply wiping from dying and no healer, tank or buffing class which is mind boggling. It's a raid with all DPS. 

It definitely was, which is why only two teams managed to beat Last Wish on day one of the raid's launch. The world's first team got a commemorative world's first belt with each members gamertag engraved.

The following 4 raids after Last Wish were much easier to figure out mechanics-wise, which the Destiny community was pretty critical about. You had teams beating the new raids in like 6 hours or less even. 

BUT, apparently the most recent raid, Salvation's Edge, has taken the crown as the hardest raid in the franchise. Only one team beat it within the first 24 hours of release. Datto, probably the biggest Destiny content creator, said the raid was so hard, he thought about quitting everything had to be run perfectly. Every second counted and not a single mistake could be made by anyone at any time during the raid.

I personally haven't played Destiny 2 since early 2021, and probably never will play again at this point, but it's awesome to see Bungie's releasing genuinely tough but satisfying raids again.

Last edited by G2ThaUNiT - on 09 July 2024

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LegitHyperbole said:

The only video I had of Bloodbornes hardest boss, I beat the boss but saved the wrong video. I can't remember how long this took but I remember spending a full Sunday attempting to simply look for a window to attack and figure out a strategy for getting some hits in. The boss is difficult because your health bar gets halfed as soon as you enter the arena and until you find a way to dodge into him he is extremely hard to punish or even get an attack on without getting hit yourself or sent home. 

Good memories, that version of the boss was indeed a massive pain in the but. You also had one giant with the balls and chains that was quite difficult. Amygdala in the cursed dungeon also was pretty hard because the Arena was much smaller. Among the harder bosses I fought in my gaming career (Bloodborne was my first Souls game).

I really hope Fromsoft and Sony will make a sequel.



Please excuse my (probally) poor grammar

Using high level charmed mobs in Everquest's Gates of Discord.

They were very effective, fully buffed, sped up, dealing massive damage. Problem is charm is a random duration spell drawing a ton of agro. It could last for 10 minutes, it could last for 10 seconds. Without a group paying utmost attention to act as soon as the spell broke (without warning) I would suffer one hit death. Enchanters don't have much health nor armor, most things could 1 hit kill me.

Yet the reward made it worth the continued risk. Without the help of charmed mobs the group would face wipe outs much more often.



The other high risk high reward strategy was chain stunning mobs. Several people pulling mobs from across the zone to get caught in a chain stun field, repeating the same 3 different stun spells at the right frequency. Then wizards, magicians and druids could unleash there are of effect spells to kill groups of 30+ with the same resources as killing a couple.

But there was always the risk of some mobs randomly resisting one of the stun spells, which is where the warrior taunt came in and druid's snares to prevent them from jumping me, interrupting the chain of stun spells, which would free the whole crowd with the expected group wipe out following.



Back in the day when death had real consequences, risk of losing all your gear (if you couldn't retrieve your body in time, either lost or unable to get there again) and your experience, de-leveling you, losing access to spells and abilities. Even with 'full recovery' you could still easily lose hours of progress from death. Max resurrection by a high level cleric gave you 90% of experience loss back. Die a lot like an Enchanter and that 10% adds up.



Maybe having lived through that Souls games have never given me much satisfaction for beating bosses. That thrill is still back in Everquest. Now bosses just feel like annoying obstacles with nothing but a feeling of time wasted when finally getting past them.



Qwark said:
LegitHyperbole said:

The only video I had of Bloodbornes hardest boss, I beat the boss but saved the wrong video. I can't remember how long this took but I remember spending a full Sunday attempting to simply look for a window to attack and figure out a strategy for getting some hits in. The boss is difficult because your health bar gets halfed as soon as you enter the arena and until you find a way to dodge into him he is extremely hard to punish or even get an attack on without getting hit yourself or sent home. 

Good memories, that version of the boss was indeed a massive pain in the but. You also had one giant with the balls and chains that was quite difficult. Amygdala in the cursed dungeon also was pretty hard because the Arena was much smaller. Among the harder bosses I fought in my gaming career (Bloodborne was my first Souls game).

I really hope Fromsoft and Sony will make a sequel.

It's such a pity he's stuck so deep in the chalice dungeons and only the few conpletionists will have fought him but cool at the same time, something for the effort. Bloodborne was my first too, I never even thought I'd get to past the first boss to be able to level up let alone get that deep in. 



SvennoJ said:

Using high level charmed mobs in Everquest's Gates of Discord.

They were very effective, fully buffed, sped up, dealing massive damage. Problem is charm is a random duration spell drawing a ton of agro. It could last for 10 minutes, it could last for 10 seconds. Without a group paying utmost attention to act as soon as the spell broke (without warning) I would suffer one hit death. Enchanters don't have much health nor armor, most things could 1 hit kill me.

Yet the reward made it worth the continued risk. Without the help of charmed mobs the group would face wipe outs much more often.



The other high risk high reward strategy was chain stunning mobs. Several people pulling mobs from across the zone to get caught in a chain stun field, repeating the same 3 different stun spells at the right frequency. Then wizards, magicians and druids could unleash there are of effect spells to kill groups of 30+ with the same resources as killing a couple.

But there was always the risk of some mobs randomly resisting one of the stun spells, which is where the warrior taunt came in and druid's snares to prevent them from jumping me, interrupting the chain of stun spells, which would free the whole crowd with the expected group wipe out following.



Back in the day when death had real consequences, risk of losing all your gear (if you couldn't retrieve your body in time, either lost or unable to get there again) and your experience, de-leveling you, losing access to spells and abilities. Even with 'full recovery' you could still easily lose hours of progress from death. Max resurrection by a high level cleric gave you 90% of experience loss back. Die a lot like an Enchanter and that 10% adds up.



Maybe having lived through that Souls games have never given me much satisfaction for beating bosses. That thrill is still back in Everquest. Now bosses just feel like annoying obstacles with nothing but a feeling of time wasted when finally getting past them.

I have no context for everquest but have you considered you may be depressed? Lol, I joke but seriously, if the boss isn't giving you satisfaction then why? Surely some bosses along the way have got your blood pumping? ... surely. 



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LegitHyperbole said:

I have no context for everquest but have you considered you may be depressed? Lol, I joke but seriously, if the boss isn't giving you satisfaction then why? Surely some bosses along the way have got your blood pumping? ... surely. 

That's why I don't play Souls games anymore.

My best time in Dark Souls was being lost in the Depths, slowly (with many deaths) mapping out where I was (I fell down to a bonfire halfway) and finding my way out eventually. That gave immense satisfaction.

Same as sparring with a tower knight for half an hour, on a sliver of health, dodging between pillars to avoid attacks and finally managing to come out on top. That was just in the starter area.

The bosses however did nothing for me. Annoyingly big, hard to keep overview, just waiting for windows to strike. Nothing like climbing bosses in SotC, that got my blood pumping, and just as much in the remake.

Also VR can do the trick. RE7 on madhouse difficulty was very satisfying. RE8 had great blood pumping boss fights as well (apart from the annoying Heisenberg one).

Yet generally bosses are mostly boring obstacles with set patterns, following a script. Plus I enjoy the environment a lot more than the fight mechanics.


As for Everquest, playing as an Enchanter gave me overview. No direct involvement in combat, yet a crucial roll in crowd control, preparing and maintaining the group. Enchanters play a strategic roll, operating from a distance. Which is also what I loved to do in TotK, puff shrooms and muddle buds. Stay out of view, direct the battle from a distance.



Only slightly on topic - but I just ate a Trinidad Scorpion Pepper that was bigger than usual and had blister-like bumps on it - as though it couldn’t stand its own heat. Anyway, first reaction, it tastes like a jalapeño and has a similar texture, but it hits at least as hard as a ghost pepper - perhaps more so, but peaks and subsides a lot quicker than habaneros. Sweat rolling down my face.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Chrkeller said:

I like a challenge but not punishing. No boss in Souls ever took me more than 6 tries. Sekiro wore me out, Butterfly took like 18 tries. The flaw in sekiro is having to clear out enemies near a boss to retry. Souls is better because you can speed run to the fog wall.

That really insane. godskin due and black blade only took you 6 tries. if you are that good you will master sekiro easily. I just read that elden ring already has more then 6 billions deaths per stats. I personally found sekiro slightly harder but it wasn't a night and day difference. 



zeldaring said:
Chrkeller said:

I like a challenge but not punishing. No boss in Souls ever took me more than 6 tries. Sekiro wore me out, Butterfly took like 18 tries. The flaw in sekiro is having to clear out enemies near a boss to retry. Souls is better because you can speed run to the fog wall.

That really insane. godskin due and black blade only took you 6 tries. if you are that good you will master sekiro easily. I just read that elden ring already has more then 6 billions deaths per stats. I personally found sekiro slightly harder but it wasn't a night and day difference. 

Elden, I thought was fairly easy, to be clear I did use the ashen spirit clone.  The spirit by itself was a wrecking machine.  



Chrkeller said:
zeldaring said:

That really insane. godskin due and black blade only took you 6 tries. if you are that good you will master sekiro easily. I just read that elden ring already has more then 6 billions deaths per stats. I personally found sekiro slightly harder but it wasn't a night and day difference. 

Elden, I thought was fairly easy, to be clear I did use the ashen spirit clone.  The spirit by itself was a wrecking machine.  

Oh i never used the spirit  of ashes or help for bosses and i found it to be near sekiro hard. So you are not really looking for a challenge and more about the level design?