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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Nvidia employee acknowledges Tegra 239 SoC rumored to be powering Switch 2

Manlytears said:

Using Ampere based GPU, also Cortex A-78!?
This shit will be expensive, not looking like Ninty stuff.

Yeah but Switch 2 it at least two years out, so will be a lot cheaper by the time they are actually manufacturing the systems. They don't need to buy very many of these just to build prototypes and early devkits.



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Soundwave said:

I think this will launch with Zelda: TotK next May and it is a successor hardware, but Nintendo won't be migrating from the current Switch ecosystem any time soon. It'll just get the same Nintendo Switch games from Nintendo but in 4K maybe with some added effects (ray tracing or better lighting).

They likely ordered development on this chip years ago, like 2019 if not sooner, so it's simply finished or close to finished.

It'll be $399.99 minimum too I think, since I don't think the OG Switch is going anywhere, this will initially just be more like an additive model so it won't have the responsibility of having to carry an entire product line at first.

Probably a bunch of 3rd party exclusives though like Street Fighter VI and RE4 Remake and FF7 Remake I can see being announced for it.

The way you speak of this all. You seem almost sure Nintendo will pull off a Sega Saturn type of announcement cuz I really doubt Nintendo would've drop a date for the Next Zelda while we would still have to hear any announcement for the Switch successor. 

It still makes plenty more sense for them to get another year out of the present ecosystem, until the end of 2023. The last wave of the MK8 DX DLC Pack seems indicative of that



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Mar1217 said:
Soundwave said:

I think this will launch with Zelda: TotK next May and it is a successor hardware, but Nintendo won't be migrating from the current Switch ecosystem any time soon. It'll just get the same Nintendo Switch games from Nintendo but in 4K maybe with some added effects (ray tracing or better lighting).

They likely ordered development on this chip years ago, like 2019 if not sooner, so it's simply finished or close to finished.

It'll be $399.99 minimum too I think, since I don't think the OG Switch is going anywhere, this will initially just be more like an additive model so it won't have the responsibility of having to carry an entire product line at first.

Probably a bunch of 3rd party exclusives though like Street Fighter VI and RE4 Remake and FF7 Remake I can see being announced for it.

The way you speak of this all. You seem almost sure Nintendo will pull off a Sega Saturn type of announcement cuz I really doubt Nintendo would've drop a date for the Next Zelda while we would still have to hear any announcement for the Switch successor. 

It still makes plenty more sense for them to get another year out of the present ecosystem, until the end of 2023. The last wave of the MK8 DX DLC Pack seems indicative of that

haha people still thinking a Switch is coming out in 2023. Yeah I've seen several people say Switch 2 will launch with Zelda and its just like what are these people smoking haha Switch is still the dominant system on the market today and a year from today Switch and PS5 will probably be closely competing in HW sales. It's just absurd to think the Switch 2 will be out in a year or so, let alone in 8 months.

To put this into perspective, next year Switch will probably sell right around what PS4 did in its best years (18m+)...so no a new Switch is not coming out in 2023 or anywhere near 2023.

Switch 2 will launch no sooner than holiday 2024. Whether they launch in Holiday 2024 or Spring 2025 (which are probably the mostly likely dates as I don't see them pushing it out to holiday 2025) will probably depend on how Switch is selling in early 2024 and how holiday 2023 goes as well. In early 2024 they'll probably make a decision on if Switch can have a strong final holiday in 2024 or if they think a new system should takeover for that holiday season. Only way a Spring 2024 launch happens is if Switch hits the fabled "cliff" in 2023, which isn't gonna happen. After the new Zelda they could easily launch several big games along with $50 price cuts (sometimes people seem to forget there have been zero price cuts in 5.5 years!) in late 2023 / early 2024 if sales did slow down more than gradually at any point.

I don't expect Nintendo will even announce the next system until Spring 2024. Any talk of Switch 2 coming out in, or even been announced in 2023 is way too soon.



Paatar said:
Soundwave said:

I think this will launch with Zelda: TotK next May and it is a successor hardware, but Nintendo won't be migrating from the current Switch ecosystem any time soon. It'll just get the same Nintendo Switch games from Nintendo but in 4K maybe with some added effects (ray tracing or better lighting).

They likely ordered development on this chip years ago, like 2019 if not sooner, so it's simply finished or close to finished.

It'll be $399.99 minimum too I think, since I don't think the OG Switch is going anywhere, this will initially just be more like an additive model so it won't have the responsibility of having to carry an entire product line at first.

Probably a bunch of 3rd party exclusives though like Street Fighter VI and RE4 Remake and FF7 Remake I can see being announced for it.

Too soon for the Switch 2. They’ll most likely launch a Switch pro with Zelda as a definitive last iteration of the console kind of the like the 2DS XL’s. 

Metroid Prime 4 will probably be the cross Gen launch title in addition to Mario Kart 9. Switch 2 probably won’t hit the shelves until 2024, or early 2025. 

Not too soon at all. The Switch is currently in its 6th year while new hardware launches about every 5 years on average.  

Switch Pro? Another one? That already manifested in 2021 as the Switch OLED.



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Paatar said:
Soundwave said:

I think this will launch with Zelda: TotK next May and it is a successor hardware, but Nintendo won't be migrating from the current Switch ecosystem any time soon. It'll just get the same Nintendo Switch games from Nintendo but in 4K maybe with some added effects (ray tracing or better lighting).

They likely ordered development on this chip years ago, like 2019 if not sooner, so it's simply finished or close to finished.

It'll be $399.99 minimum too I think, since I don't think the OG Switch is going anywhere, this will initially just be more like an additive model so it won't have the responsibility of having to carry an entire product line at first.

Probably a bunch of 3rd party exclusives though like Street Fighter VI and RE4 Remake and FF7 Remake I can see being announced for it.

Too soon for the Switch 2. They’ll most likely launch a Switch pro with Zelda as a definitive last iteration of the console kind of the like the 2DS XL’s. 

Metroid Prime 4 will probably be the cross Gen launch title in addition to Mario Kart 9. Switch 2 probably won’t hit the shelves until 2024, or early 2025. 

Maybe this is why we are getting practically no footage of either of them



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Soundwave said:

I think this will launch with Zelda: TotK next May and it is a successor hardware, but Nintendo won't be migrating from the current Switch ecosystem any time soon. It'll just get the same Nintendo Switch games from Nintendo but in 4K maybe with some added effects (ray tracing or better lighting).

They likely ordered development on this chip years ago, like 2019 if not sooner, so it's simply finished or close to finished.

It'll be $399.99 minimum too I think, since I don't think the OG Switch is going anywhere, this will initially just be more like an additive model so it won't have the responsibility of having to carry an entire product line at first.

Probably a bunch of 3rd party exclusives though like Street Fighter VI and RE4 Remake and FF7 Remake I can see being announced for it.

I think a lot of the reason for the pushback on your highly probable suggestion is that many don’t understand production timelines.

I also strongly agree that Nintendo won’t kill the Switch before the launch of Switch 2.



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Soundwave said:
Paatar said:

Too soon for the Switch 2. They’ll most likely launch a Switch pro with Zelda as a definitive last iteration of the console kind of the like the 2DS XL’s. 

Metroid Prime 4 will probably be the cross Gen launch title in addition to Mario Kart 9. Switch 2 probably won’t hit the shelves until 2024, or early 2025. 

Ordering new hardware isn't like going into a drive through and just picking out a hamburger and fries. It takes years of development, Nintendo likely greenlit development on this chip with Nvidia in 2019 if not sooner than that even. And that makes perfect sense, if you're sitting in 2019, you're presuming a 6 year product cycle and have no idea that COVID is coming or a chip shortage is happening, you would assume 2023 would be the time you need a new chip because that's exactly the same time frame even the successful DS and Wii needed new hardware. 

So it just happens to be ready probably by now, and there likely is no benefit to Nintendo to just sit on the hardware. They may even be under a contractual agreeement that they have to ship XYZ number of units because Nvidia is expecting to be paid per unit some level or royalty fee beginning in 2023. Nvidia doesn't work for free and certainly isn't supplying several years of R&D to Nintendo in a "just pay me when you feel like it" fashion. 

I don't think Switch-Super Switch will be a traditional console transition in that I don't think one hardware is going to just suddenly stop. I can even see Mario Kart 9 being cross-gen, you'll just get it in 4K maybe with some ray tracing turned on for Super Switch (Switch 2). The Switch userbase is too big for Nintendo to want to go back to something with only 10-20-30 million users for a while. They'll likely just have a very, very long cross gen period and let 3rd parties make exclusives if they want, but I suspect all major Switch titles for a long while will still work on the OG Switch. Which really isn't that different from what Sony and MS are doing, it's almost 2 years into the PS5/XSX product cycle and there's virtually no exclusives. It even looks like GTAVI may be cross gen. 



I never stated anything about the ‘ordering of new hardware’. I know it’s not like ordering a ‘hamburger and fries’

dont know where the hell that came from dude. Yikes. Also not debating on when the chip was green lit. We got MK8 DLC till the end of 23. Splatoon 3 is getting 2 years of free updates, so potentially that could be a launch title. But everything points to the Switch being their primary focus for the next two years. You’re arguing based on rumors and speculation and arguing points that I never even mentioned just to be argumentative. Take it down a notch. 

Last edited by Paatar - 3 days ago

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gtotheunit91 said:
Chrkeller said:

I've watched a few videos, DLSS looks amazing, cool tech. Given I'm not a tech person, if this is true (which is may not be), what does this mean for backwards compatability?

Games will just look and run better :) 

Only if they are patched/built with the technology in mind.

Soundwave said:

Ordering new hardware isn't like going into a drive through and just picking out a hamburger and fries. It takes years of development, Nintendo likely greenlit development on this chip with Nvidia in 2019 if not sooner than that even. And that makes perfect sense, if you're sitting in 2019, you're presuming a 6 year product cycle and have no idea that COVID is coming or a chip shortage is happening, you would assume 2023 would be the time you need a new chip because that's exactly the same time frame even the successful DS and Wii needed new hardware. 

So it just happens to be ready probably by now, and there likely is no benefit to Nintendo to just sit on the hardware. They may even be under a contractual agreeement that they have to ship XYZ number of units because Nvidia is expecting to be paid per unit some level or royalty fee beginning in 2023. Nvidia doesn't work for free and certainly isn't supplying several years of R&D to Nintendo in a "just pay me when you feel like it" fashion. 

I don't think Switch-Super Switch will be a traditional console transition in that I don't think one hardware is going to just suddenly stop. I can even see Mario Kart 9 being cross-gen, you'll just get it in 4K maybe with some ray tracing turned on for Super Switch (Switch 2). The Switch userbase is too big for Nintendo to want to go back to something with only 10-20-30 million users for a while. They'll likely just have a very, very long cross gen period and let 3rd parties make exclusives if they want, but I suspect all major Switch titles for a long while will still work on the OG Switch. Which really isn't that different from what Sony and MS are doing, it's almost 2 years into the PS5/XSX product cycle and there's virtually no exclusives. It even looks like GTAVI may be cross gen. 

Lot's of assumptions there.
The current Switch -is- using parts picked off a menu order. Everything is stock standard.
Nintendo literally did zero development in conjunction with any chip manufacturers.

Where Nintendo invested their time is on the form factor itself and the software stacks.

gtotheunit91 said:

And considering Nvidia is making millions off the Switch by selling almost 10 year old chips, I have no doubt they're beyond happy lol.

What has been consistent is getting a Switch revision every other year. 2017-launch Switch. 2019-Switch Lite. 2021-Switch OLED. With that consistent kind of releases, I wouldn't be surprised if we do get another hardware revision in 2023. Before this rumor, I was kind of expecting a Switch Lite OLED in 2023

It was probably the best business decision for both.

Tegra X1 is Archaic and is built at an old and out dated 16nm process, there isn't a lot of competition on that node (But that is changing as 32nm and older are being depreciated by TSMC) so all pandemic long Nintendo managed to avoid part shortages for the most part. - They still occurred, just not as significantly.

Chrkeller said:

For sure I could see a revision...  I just don't think it will be the 4k DSLL 60 fps Pro some people are expecting.  

It won't be. The display will still be your limitation. 1080P max... 720P more likely.

Jumpin said:

I think a lot of the reason for the pushback on your highly probable suggestion is that many don’t understand production timelines.

I also strongly agree that Nintendo won’t kill the Switch before the launch of Switch 2.

The chip crunch pushed the production timelines out for all chip designers and manufacturers.

For example, nVidia just cancelled Tegra Atlan and is now working towards Tegra Thor.



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Pemalite said:
gtotheunit91 said:

Games will just look and run better :) 

Only if they are patched/built with the technology in mind.

Soundwave said:

Ordering new hardware isn't like going into a drive through and just picking out a hamburger and fries. It takes years of development, Nintendo likely greenlit development on this chip with Nvidia in 2019 if not sooner than that even. And that makes perfect sense, if you're sitting in 2019, you're presuming a 6 year product cycle and have no idea that COVID is coming or a chip shortage is happening, you would assume 2023 would be the time you need a new chip because that's exactly the same time frame even the successful DS and Wii needed new hardware. 

So it just happens to be ready probably by now, and there likely is no benefit to Nintendo to just sit on the hardware. They may even be under a contractual agreeement that they have to ship XYZ number of units because Nvidia is expecting to be paid per unit some level or royalty fee beginning in 2023. Nvidia doesn't work for free and certainly isn't supplying several years of R&D to Nintendo in a "just pay me when you feel like it" fashion. 

I don't think Switch-Super Switch will be a traditional console transition in that I don't think one hardware is going to just suddenly stop. I can even see Mario Kart 9 being cross-gen, you'll just get it in 4K maybe with some ray tracing turned on for Super Switch (Switch 2). The Switch userbase is too big for Nintendo to want to go back to something with only 10-20-30 million users for a while. They'll likely just have a very, very long cross gen period and let 3rd parties make exclusives if they want, but I suspect all major Switch titles for a long while will still work on the OG Switch. Which really isn't that different from what Sony and MS are doing, it's almost 2 years into the PS5/XSX product cycle and there's virtually no exclusives. It even looks like GTAVI may be cross gen. 

Lot's of assumptions there.
The current Switch -is- using parts picked off a menu order. Everything is stock standard.
Nintendo literally did zero development in conjunction with any chip manufacturers.

Where Nintendo invested their time is on the form factor itself and the software stacks.

gtotheunit91 said:

And considering Nvidia is making millions off the Switch by selling almost 10 year old chips, I have no doubt they're beyond happy lol.

What has been consistent is getting a Switch revision every other year. 2017-launch Switch. 2019-Switch Lite. 2021-Switch OLED. With that consistent kind of releases, I wouldn't be surprised if we do get another hardware revision in 2023. Before this rumor, I was kind of expecting a Switch Lite OLED in 2023

It was probably the best business decision for both.

Tegra X1 is Archaic and is built at an old and out dated 16nm process, there isn't a lot of competition on that node (But that is changing as 32nm and older are being depreciated by TSMC) so all pandemic long Nintendo managed to avoid part shortages for the most part. - They still occurred, just not as significantly.

Chrkeller said:

For sure I could see a revision...  I just don't think it will be the 4k DSLL 60 fps Pro some people are expecting.  

It won't be. The display will still be your limitation. 1080P max... 720P more likely.

Jumpin said:

I think a lot of the reason for the pushback on your highly probable suggestion is that many don’t understand production timelines.

I also strongly agree that Nintendo won’t kill the Switch before the launch of Switch 2.

In 2015/16 yes, Tegra X1 was an off the shelf get for Nintendo and was attractively priced because Nvidia was desperate to recoup costs on it. They bet hard that the Tegra line was big for consumer electronic products and in tons of devices like tablets and what not, and largely that vision failed. Nintendo got the chip likely for a steal of a price as a result, otherwise they likely would've wanted a custom chip design where they have input into the chip design. 

The thing is with a Switch successor, this was likely never going to work again, the Tegra chip line isn't some ubiquitous product line that Nvidia makes, they make a few for self driving cars but that is probably for Nvidia right now a small market. There isn't a "Tegra X4" or something for Nintendo to just pick off a shelf and put into a game console because Nvidia basically stopped making traditional successors to the Tegra X1 after the Tegra Parker in 2017 as there wasn't wide enough to demand from other vendors for the Tegra chips. There are Tegra Orin boards but those are for smart cars with a lot of components for A.I. learning, not really suitable for a game system. 

The Tegra T239 or "Drake" likely is being made for Nintendo expressly. The codename NVN2 also pretty heavily hints at that as NVN is Nvidia's codename for the current Nintendo Switch. And I'd say if the chip is finished (with the way leaks are coming out on it, I'd say it's either imminent or close to completion) then it's not a wild proposition to say Nintendo is likely on the hook to pay up for it soon. The way console manufacturing/component fees go there could also be a guaranteed royalty fee on top of that too. 

It's quite possible the situation here is Nintendo ordered development of Tegra Drake around 2018 or 2019. 3-4 years sounds about dead on for the amount of time a new chip architecture in the Tegra line would need, so this chip starting to show up in leaks as we've gone on in 2022 would make sense. Now whether Nintendo needs the chip at this point is kind of irrelevant, they're probably going to be on the hook for paying for it and even possibly on the hook for per unit royalty fees (companies like AMD, Nvidia often get a per unit cut and a minimum order guarantee in exchange for giving the vendor a better per unit price). If that's the case I think Nintendo just goes ahead and releases it but will keep their Switch software lineup cross-gen for several more years, just letting the newer system have 4K DLSS-ed versions of those games. 

Last edited by Soundwave - 3 days ago

shikamaru317 said:
Leynos said:

I would not count.on 4K happening. More likely rendered at 540P and upscaled to 1080P. Chip is roughly a base Xbox One.

Well, supposedly it's about base Xbox One in handheld mode, which is to say about 6x more powerful than Switch 1 in handheld mode. When docked I'd guess we'll see power closer to PS4 Pro. If I had to guess, we'll get like 480-540p native DLSS'd up to 900-1080p in handheld mode (assuming of course that Nintendo is willing to pay for a 1080p screen), and something like 900p native DLSS'd up to 1800p when docked.

Base XBO will be it's max not it's min. This is Jetson Oriin. It's max output for what Nintendo will want is the lower end model that has a max output of 102GB bandwidth. This is not a 4K gaming machine.



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