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Forums - Politics Discussion - FISA/FBI memo released - how Obama/Clinton spied on the Trump campaign

PwerlvlAmy on 03 February 2018
Locknuts said:
Machiavellian said:

Obama has absolutely nothing to do with this.  Exactly what was abused.  You are making an opinion from a political opinion piece and not all the facts.

Ok so the Clinton campaign paid for a 'Dossier' from a former British spy who got his information from some Russians (foreigners interfering in an election anyone?) with the intent to get dirt on the Trump campaign. Most of the information in the Dossier is unverifiable. This unverified Dossier is the cited as a critical piece of evidence in order to get a FISA application to spy on a US citizen by the name of Carter Page. It would have been impossible for a FISA application to be used to spy on a US citizen before Bush changed the law to allow it. Obama did nothing to change this and continued to allow it. The man at the top always bears some responsibility for the things that happen under his administration and I find it very hard to believe he had no idea this was going on. Carter Page at one time worked for the Trump campaign, this was the reason he was targeted.

Also, the memo is not an opinion piece. If the statements in it are false, there could be serious repercussions for the author. No government official is going to risk going to prison over this. I'd say it's factual.

you sir are my new best friend.



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Illusion on 03 February 2018

The corporate mainstream media is panicking and now calling for violence in the streets in the wake of this memo's release. This kind of response from the media is absurd and it shows 1) just how the MSM and the Democratic Party are pawns being controlled by the same big money and 2) just how terrified this big money is now getting that their criminal network is coming down:

https://www.infowars.com/msnbc-calls-for-revolution-against-donald-trump-after-fisa-memo-release/

Hopefully the left who is watching this pitiful reaction from the mainstream media realizes that it is time to turn the TV off and just let this beast die. Only a fool would believe that the lawful and democratic release of classified information to the public are the actions of a dictator.   They are only mad because their butts are in trouble and they want to make you into their pawns who can keep them out of jail.  The dictators are the ones who keep information from the public and they are also the ones who resort to violence to deal with their political adversaries... a shoe that very well fits the mainstream media and the big money that controls them.

Last edited by Illusion - on 03 February 2018

Puppyroach on 03 February 2018
Nighthawk117 said:
Puppyroach said:
Well, this was a desperate thread. This memo was a big, fat piece of smoke. It doesn't contain any news whatsoever, so why the big fuss?? It doesn't incriminate Obama or Clinton, it doesn't incriminate the FBI. It only further incriminate Carter, so this backfired in a great, hilarious way.

Did you even read the memo?

"Neither the initial application in October 2016, nor any of the renewals, disclose or reference the role of the DNC, Clinton campaign, or any party/campaign in funding Steele’s efforts, even though the political origins of the Steele dossier were then known to senior and FBI officials."

Aaaaand? They were investigating Page back in 2013 and this was part of their ongoing investigation. It's not relevant if Steele was biased  it's only relevant if the information acquired has some credibility. Almost all info they gather in cases come from biased sources, and they then make assessment on its validity. 



Puppyroach on 03 February 2018
Locknuts said:
Machiavellian said:

Obama has absolutely nothing to do with this.  Exactly what was abused.  You are making an opinion from a political opinion piece and not all the facts.

Ok so the Clinton campaign paid for a 'Dossier' from a former British spy who got his information from some Russians (foreigners interfering in an election anyone?) with the intent to get dirt on the Trump campaign. Most of the information in the Dossier is unverifiable. This unverified Dossier is the cited as a critical piece of evidence in order to get a FISA application to spy on a US citizen by the name of Carter Page. It would have been impossible for a FISA application to be used to spy on a US citizen before Bush changed the law to allow it. Obama did nothing to change this and continued to allow it. The man at the top always bears some responsibility for the things that happen under his administration and I find it very hard to believe he had no idea this was going on. Carter Page at one time worked for the Trump campaign, this was the reason he was targeted.

Also, the memo is not an opinion piece. If the statements in it are false, there could be serious repercussions for the author. No government official is going to risk going to prison over this. I'd say it's factual.

How could you possibly know most of the info in the dossier is unverifiable? 



The_Yoda on 03 February 2018
Machiavellian said:
Locknuts said:
This is actually serious shit. Being a small government person, this does nothing to challenge my stance.

Bush, the FBI and Obama are to blame for this FISA crap. Bush for changing the law, and Obama for allowing it to be abused and the FBI and DOJ for actually abusing it.

Obama has absolutely nothing to do with this.  Exactly what was abused.  You are making an opinion from a political opinion piece and not all the facts.

 Ignoring "political opinion piece" aren't you doing the same thing if the entirety of the dossier hasn't been released?



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The_Yoda on 03 February 2018
Locknuts said:
Machiavellian said:

Obama has absolutely nothing to do with this.  Exactly what was abused.  You are making an opinion from a political opinion piece and not all the facts.

Ok so the Clinton campaign paid for a 'Dossier' from a former British spy who got his information from some Russians (foreigners interfering in an election anyone?) with the intent to get dirt on the Trump campaign. Most of the information in the Dossier is unverifiable. This unverified Dossier is the cited as a critical piece of evidence in order to get a FISA application to spy on a US citizen by the name of Carter Page. It would have been impossible for a FISA application to be used to spy on a US citizen before Bush changed the law to allow it. Obama did nothing to change this and continued to allow it. The man at the top always bears some responsibility for the things that happen under his administration and I find it very hard to believe he had no idea this was going on. Carter Page at one time worked for the Trump campaign, this was the reason he was targeted.

Also, the memo is not an opinion piece. If the statements in it are false, there could be serious repercussions for the author. No government official is going to risk going to prison over this. I'd say it's factual.

While I do not disagree with the first half of that sentence I find it fairly easy to believe that Obama may have known little to nothing of this.  The POTUS has a good deal going on and I don't know how much attention he may have spent during that period on how his party / what his party was doing in the election.

 

I have not read what is available of the dossier but I believe from what I do know that the title of this thread should at best be "FISA/FBI Memo Released  - How The Obama Administration/DNC spied on the Trump campaign"

Again I know very little about this and the real bitch is that I did not like Obama but I find myself defending him at the moment.  Full disclosure I don't like Trump either, but then again I haven't liked a POTUS since I was a little kid and I sure ain't no spring chicken.



The_Yoda on 03 February 2018
OTBWY said:

lol

If you have Sigs turned off, turn it on a moment and know why I'm thanking you for lending credence to my middle jpg

Locknuts said:
This is actually serious shit. Being a small government person, this does nothing to challenge my stance.

Bush, the FBI and Obama are to blame for this FISA crap. Bush for changing the law, and Obama for allowing it to be abused and the FBI and DOJ for actually abusing it.

Oh yeah I agree with that too.



Nem on 03 February 2018

So... they investigated the campaign that is proved to have had dealings with Russians? That actually were having frindly pats in the back with Russians in the public square.

This is a witch hunt? Well... don't be surprised people witch hunt when you are casting a spell everyone can see.



The_Yoda on 03 February 2018
Bandorr said:
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/02/02/the-nunes-memo-makes-no-sense-216928?lo=ap_e1

Fairly good reason.

Sums up what the "argument" is. Why it is deeply flawed. Goes into explaining the Fisa order etc.

 

Thanks for the read.  A good read but the last paragraph doesn't instill the greatest confidence in some of the speculation that proceeded it.  Sorry for the spoiler for those that hadn't followed his link.

 

Edit- Ignore below, Nem slipped in there while I was typing and may have saved me a moderation.

General note after my forth consecutive post:  I'm going to stop responding now since this is my fourth uninterrupted post and I'm not sure if it is considered spamming on the site.



ironmanDX on 03 February 2018
Bandorr said:
Hiku said:

From his posting history he appears to be serious, and not a troll.

However I can't find most of the things he claimed in the memo, as you've pointed out here.
I'm guessing he heard it on some conspiracy site, and posted it here without reading through the memo.

If I recall this person correctly - they are very deep into conspiracies. I think I recall quite a few from Infowars, and breitbart.

Although looking through I don't see the threads that I thought were created by him. I think there was one about a sacrifice or a ritual/ceremony?

I can't keep this crazy conspiracies separate.

edit: Nope apparently that thread was created by Snoopy.

Breitbart is a conspiracy site? Since when?

 

I just saw it as right leaning.... Well, leaning quite far right news.