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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Nintendo should teach their 3rd party supporters their file compression secrets.

DonFerrari on 02 November 2017
Zekkyou said:
Nintendo should have told Nintendo their secret when making XCX. Almost twice the size of Zelda before even downloading the 10GB~ of patches? I mean come on Nintendo, there's no excuse for that kind of laziness. A more texture dependent art-style, more geometrically complex world, voice acting, and a generally different design philosophy might have been an excuse in the past, but not in 2017.

And don't even get me started on Tropical Freeze. A side scrolling gorilla needs almost as much space as Zelda? They really are Retro.

Weren't patches things of devs that doesn't care about the quality of their games and launch buggy games to maybe correct later? Like a good game delayed will still be a good game and a bug game launched earlier will always be bad?



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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Raven on 02 November 2017

I love Nintendo but it's called asset re-use and simple textures.



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LivingMetal on 02 November 2017

This reminds of the N64 days when Nintendo's titles were the best looking while third parties struggled to keep up. I'm not saying that all third party titles had the developing talent that Nintendo is. But what I am saying is that Nintendo hardly assisted third parties in developing software for the N64 until later in the N64's life cycle. I don't think this is the case anymore thankfully.



DonFerrari on 02 November 2017
RolStoppable said:
DonFerrari said:

Weren't patches things of devs that doesn't care about the quality of their games and launch buggy games to maybe correct later? Like a good game delayed will still be a good game and a bug game launched earlier will always be bad?

Don't let yourself get trolled by Zekkyou. XCX didn't have a 10GB patch.

But having a patch was already enough to shit on X360 and PS3 if I'm not wrong and I know I aint (although I do get baffled when games have 15GB day one patches).

LivingMetal said:
This reminds of the N64 days when Nintendo's titles were the best looking while third parties struggled to keep up. I'm not saying that all third party titles had the developing talent that Nintendo is. But what I am saying is that Nintendo hardly assisted third parties in developing software for the N64 until later in the N64's life cycle. I don't think this is the case anymore thankfully.

I would be hard pressed to think Switch games of Nintendo look better than 3rd parties out there.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Zekkyou on 02 November 2017
DonFerrari said:
Zekkyou said:
Nintendo should have told Nintendo their secret when making XCX. Almost twice the size of Zelda before even downloading the 10GB~ of patches? I mean come on Nintendo, there's no excuse for that kind of laziness. A more texture dependent art-style, more geometrically complex world, voice acting, and a generally different design philosophy might have been an excuse in the past, but not in 2017.

And don't even get me started on Tropical Freeze. A side scrolling gorilla needs almost as much space as Zelda? They really are Retro.

Weren't patches things of devs that doesn't care about the quality of their games and launch buggy games to maybe correct later? Like a good game delayed will still be a good game and a bug game launched earlier will always be bad?

Being serious for a moment, no, XCX is one of the rare occasions where the patches aren't because of bugs. Monolist Soft are an incredibly skilled developer (they even helped with BotW), not many could pull off something as technically ambitious as XCX on the WiiU. It did, however, have to be quite heavily compressed to fit onto a WiiU disk, which resulted in some pretty awful loading times, popins, etc. So to make up for that, you have the option of downloading up to 10GB in patches (or 'Loading Packs') to resolve some of those issues.



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DonFerrari on 02 November 2017
Zekkyou said:
DonFerrari said:

Weren't patches things of devs that doesn't care about the quality of their games and launch buggy games to maybe correct later? Like a good game delayed will still be a good game and a bug game launched earlier will always be bad?

Being serious for a moment, no, XCX is one of the rare occasions where the patches aren't because of bugs. Monolist Soft are an incredibly skilled developer (they even helped with BotW), not many could pull off something as technically ambitious as XCX on the WiiU. It did, however, have to be quite heavily compressed to fit onto a WiiU disk, which resulted in some pretty awful loading times, popins, etc. So to make up for that, you have the option of downloading up to 10GB in patches (or 'Loading Packs') to resolve some of those issues.

So it make the game game much over the threashold OP claim Nintendo games can do and 3rd parties are unable to.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari on 02 November 2017
RolStoppable said:
DonFerrari said:

But having a patch was already enough to shit on X360 and PS3 if I'm not wrong and I know I aint (although I do get baffled when games have 15GB day one patches).

Yes, huge patches for bug fixes are frowned upon, and rightly so.

XCX has an optional 10GB install to speed up loading, but because Wii U can't install from disc, it was a download instead. The digital version of XCX didn't need the extra 10GB because it was loading its data from internal SSD or external HDD to begin with.

Certainly a similar action made by other platform holders would have been beaten down, like all the bitching about PS3 mandatory installs (that X360 later become adopting for improved loadings anyway)



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

LivingMetal on 02 November 2017
DonFerrari said:
RolStoppable said:

Don't let yourself get trolled by Zekkyou. XCX didn't have a 10GB patch.

But having a patch was already enough to shit on X360 and PS3 if I'm not wrong and I know I aint (although I do get baffled when games have 15GB day one patches).

LivingMetal said:
This reminds of the N64 days when Nintendo's titles were the best looking while third parties struggled to keep up. I'm not saying that all third party titles had the developing talent that Nintendo is. But what I am saying is that Nintendo hardly assisted third parties in developing software for the N64 until later in the N64's life cycle. I don't think this is the case anymore thankfully.

I would be hard pressed to think Switch games of Nintendo look better than 3rd parties out there.

From a techincal standpoint or an artstyle standpoint.



irstupid on 02 November 2017

To all those saying you sacrifice and use low textures, worse graphics, or ect. you are comparing current day Nintendo games versus current day other games.

How about compare current day Nintendo against past games. Pretty sure the average Nintendo game is the same size as an Average PS2 game. Now without letting your bias show too much, which games look better?



Wright on 02 November 2017
DonFerrari said:

Certainly a similar action made by other platform holders would have been beaten down, like all the bitching about PS3 mandatory installs (that X360 later become adopting for improved loadings anyway)

PS3 had mandatory installs because of blu-rays. 360 didn't adopt anything; from the get-go, DVDs can be read directly from the disc, but the console always gave you the choice to install the content for better results.