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Forums - Nintendo - If you suck, you should lose

 

Did you like the way they approached this?

Yes 40 28.57%
 
I think it's great 15 10.71%
 
I don't care 22 15.71%
 
No 19 13.57%
 
It sucks 23 16.43%
 
I like waffles 19 13.57%
 
Total:138

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKiBTMbJU2k

Yes (as stated in the title) thats what Mike Matei said in his video.  (sorry forgot to embed)

 

Personaly, I agree with him overall, save for a few points he mentioned. But before I state my opinions on the video, I'll say this. I don't care how much the times has changed over the years. It's not good to surgar coat a person's failures by telling them that they're still winners on the inside becuase they're special.

Because if we keep tellings kids and future generations that, then we're setting them up for faliure cause they'll lack the "try harder" factor in life. We're too afraid to get our kid's feelings hurt because they failed. But I'm also aware that there needs to be a balance. I know we can't just throw them into the real world and expect them to learn it all on their own. They need a teacher to show them and give them the tools to succeed. There needs to be a balance. Help is needed but no han-holding.  

 

 

Okay....I can see where he's going at with the invincible tanooki suit. In my personal opinion, I had no problem with the super guide concept ever since Super Mario Galaxy 2 becuase in the end you still had to beat the level except now the game showed you how, so it still needed your input. Same with the past NSMB titles. Yeah the games now do the level for you, but you don't get rewarded the same way if you were to beat it yourself (i think correct me if im wrong). Nothing wrong with that IMO (and don't think Mike had a disliking to it that much either until SM3DW but thats only my assumption). 

Now with Super Mario 3D World, they seem to have made so easy that you don't have to do anything but get this invicibility suit and causually (figuratively of course) cruise past the level with very little effort. If you aske me, they should've left the "super guide" just the way it was and not have made it this easy. I know a lot people (namely kids) might not be able to beat these levels but it might not be as fun with the suit itself since you can just zip through it like that.

 

What are your thoughts on the suit?



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Thanks to micro-transactions in games, poor games players with money can soon win. Just imagine playiing a game with limited ammo. You've both had a go at shooting each other but you've run out of bullets and despite hitting him more times he isn't dead. However the other game player buys some extra bullets as a micro-transaction. Result you die and he wins.

Alternatively your racing a against someone in a car that does 180mph however your opponent has bought a 250 mph car and you lose.

Of course the micro-transaction could be a better weapon, more shields, better armour, a map, access to hidden areas or millions of other enhancements that make it easier to win.

The point is gaming is changing its no longer just about skill it will be about skill and/or additional purchases.





I'm his age and from his generation and I agree. Anyone over 30 has a mental skill set that the early 20 somethings, teenagers and kids will never have. We didn't HAVE walk throughs, the internet, super guides or anything else. Most of our games gave a set number of lives, or continues, and if you lost them, that it...you're done. Can you imagine an 8 year old who's only ever seen an Xbox or Wii-U having to play Contra without the Konami code? Imagine forcing him or her to get to stage four before quitting. You'd see a total break down and they'd likely just give up crying.

Having said all that...there's nothing we can do. Games have gotten soft and gamers have as well. Times change, and that's just reality. There's still hard games out there, but they aren't Nintendo games. I guess that's what I'd tell Mike if I were talking to him. I'd say "If you hate easy games, why are you playing modern Mario?".



I completely agree.  It's like what Wesley Snipes says as Simon Phoenix in Demolition Man.

"I'm sorry to say, the world has become a pussy whipped Brady Bunch version of itself."

If developers keep giving the option for people to just collect an item and run past a level, especially a company like Nintendo whose games have become easier and easier over the years, developers in the future will be scared to make a difficult game because you'll have all these noobs who call themselves gamers complaining about even the slightest difficulty. 

It reminds me of this. 



It's optional (yes, I know he said that near the end).

Not everyone enjoys games for being ridiculously challenging. Everyone takes different enjoyments out of playing games, and this helps cater to those who have troubles with that challenge. To many gamers, gaming is about trial and error and overcoming difficult obstacles. For them, they can avoid this suit altogether.

The *only* thing you're losing as a "hardcore gamer" is the bragging rights to friends (since your friends can also beat the game even if they suck). You still make the exact same accomplishments. To compensate, at least Nintendo rewards non-"cheaters" with special markings showing that they beat the game without using the suit.

On a side note, can Mario still fall to his death with the suit on? The video didn't mention it.



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If they didn't put the White Tanooki Suit in this game, I wouldn't play the multiplayer. My friends and my little sister suck at video games, and quite frankly, there is no reason why they need to be good at it. I don't play Super Mario 3D World with them to beat the game and challenge myself. I play it because it's a way we can all enjoy each other's company through a medium that they all know I personally enjoy more than they do. I can't do that if I constantly have to babysit and yell "Jump AWAY from the spikes!" They are already going out of their comfort zone by playing this foreign thing called a video game. If the White Tanooki Suit makes that easier, so be it. Also, have you ever tried to play Trine 2 with someone who sucks? Yeah. I'd rather take an arrow to the knee then do that again.

Keep the White Tanooki Suit. I've never used it. I'll never use it. People who need it will. Didn't know it was in 3D Land, though. Never saw it, personally...

wfz said:
It's optional (yes, I know he said that near the end).

Not everyone enjoys games for being ridiculously challenging. Everyone takes different enjoyments out of playing games, and this helps cater to those who have troubles with that challenge. To many gamers, gaming is about trial and error and overcoming difficult obstacles. For them, they can avoid this suit altogether. 

The *only* thing you're losing as a "hardcore gamer" is the bragging rights to friends (since your friends can also beat the game even if they suck). You still make the exact same accomplishments. To compensate, at least Nintendo rewards non-"cheaters" with special markings showing that they beat the game without using the suit.

On a side note, can Mario still fall to his death with the suit on? The video didn't mention it.

Yep.



wfz said:
It's optional (yes, I know he said that near the end).

Not everyone enjoys games for being ridiculously challenging. Everyone takes different enjoyments out of playing games, and this helps cater to those who have troubles with that challenge. To many gamers, gaming is about trial and error and overcoming difficult obstacles. For them, they can avoid this suit altogether.

The *only* thing you're losing as a "hardcore gamer" is the bragging rights to friends (since your friends can also beat the game even if they suck). You still make the exact same accomplishments. To compensate, at least Nintendo rewards non-"cheaters" with special markings showing that they beat the game without using the suit.

On a side note, can Mario still fall to his death with the suit on? The video didn't mention it.


Yes and I agree. If you're going the easy way out then you're not getting the full reward which makes for good motivation to try the level without the suit. Plus its good to hear people acutally say their opinion without the angry tone here. I mean the comments on AVGN's video is atrocious.



I really don't care much since those blocks are optional and I always ignore them myself. I'm also not that concerned by how others choose to play the game.
But, I think the Super guide was a way better feature. While it helps people get through the stages it doesn't beat the stage for them, it only shows how it's done and you still have to do the dirty work yourself.



prayformojo said:
I'm his age and from his generation and I agree. Anyone over 30 has a mental skill set that the early 20 somethings, teenagers and kids will never have. We didn't HAVE walk throughs, the internet, super guides or anything else. Most of our games gave a set number of lives, or continues, and if you lost them, that it...you're done. Can you imagine an 8 year old who's only ever seen an Xbox or Wii-U having to play Contra without the Konami code? Imagine forcing him or her to get to stage four before quitting. You'd see a total break down and they'd likely just give up crying.

Having said all that...there's nothing we can do. Games have gotten soft and gamers have as well. Times change, and that's just reality. There's still hard games out there, but they aren't Nintendo games. I guess that's what I'd tell Mike if I were talking to him. I'd say "If you hate easy games, why are you playing modern Mario?".

The difficulty in games actually still remain, but in a different area altogether.

Single player games are no longer what they used to be. SP has become the mode that people go to relax without having to overcome any hurdles. That's why you see all these crutches and options that essentially beat the game for you.

The real difficulty now is in the Multiplayer aspect of games where you are put up against the world and you learn through getting your a$$ beat. I remember when I first got Call of Duty MW2 (my first COD), I went online thinking I'll be able to beast, but I got my candy backside whooped so hard I had to call for mama. If I even got 1 kill and 10 deaths a game, I would be so happy. Eventually after practicing over and over, learning how to aim, understanding the maps and strategies, now I can pretty much decimate all the noobs that come online to play FPS.  MP is like the old days where you have to get abused to get better. Only difference here is that you are being owned by other human beings rather than AI.



 

Ugh Mike Matei.



Sigs are dumb. And so are you!