I have to agree. I remember a great thread made by Viper1; don't feed itwas called. I think this is a very good opportunnity to live by that statement... He thinks he's smarter than he is and won't be turned around by our arguments. He's made up his mind about these things.

I think there's a difference in being successful and ending up in 3rd place; they're not mutually exclusive. Nintendo can end up in 3rd place (quite likely) but they can still be successful. I would never call the PS3 a success since it lost so much money for Sony and lost a lot of market share as well. All in all PS3 was a failure, but that doesn't mean it wasn't a good console with good sales. I think you lack perspective when you say that Wii U won't be successful. As long as it makes Nintendo money it'll be more of a success than PS3, and possibly PS4 and Xbox720.

Core and casual are gameplay styles; casual games can be easily picked up a played by inexperienced gamers, and have simple gameplay that doesn't require long term investment or effort, core is the opposite. Whether a game is rated E or M is uttery beside the point. Heavy Rain is only core because it's not accessible. There are M rated casual games, and E rated core games.

To say that every Wii U will be shifted by SSB alone is absurd. But SSB, and 3D Mario, and HD Zelda, and Mario Kart, and X, and Metroid/Pikmin/etc, isn't absurd at all. A large portion of the sales of any Nintendo console can be accounted for by less than a dozen key games.

So the console that helped secure Sony the next-gen optical format and has sold over 70 mill isn't a success....how? Lost market share =/= failure. It's not as if they have 10% of the market. Also the PS3 hardware started turning over a profit summer 2010...
"All in all the PS3 was a failure" - I'm guessing you don't understand business? Almost a 3rd of the market, secured bluray and the base hardware started turning a profit a few years ago. How is that a failure? 

Personally I think the Wii U will shift less then 25 mill units. I can't see it actually making Nintendo money yet I see it pushing core gamers away from the Nintendo label onto either MS or Sony. Losing your fan base and not making money? Now that IS a failure. I doubt a handful of expected franchise titles will help save it either - as I said if every single SSB fan went out and bought a Wii U, we're only talking about 10 million consoles. The great thing with the PS360 is that you can say with a straight face that it's likely that those who like CoD may not be into other highly selling series such as Fifa, GT or Uncharted.

Examples plx. If you are going to make such a statement please back it up. 

The issue with those titles are is that the SSB fans tend to be 3D Mario fans who tend to be Zelda fans etc etc meaning the net increase in Nintendo console owners is very little. This could be a reason why both the N64 and GC didn't really sell all that well. This is the reason why I think people expecting each title to cause a spike in console sales aren't being realistic about who is attracted by the nintendo franchises,.

Exactly, so the Wii U will not be one even if it doesn't match Wii sales.

Because it will almost certainly make more money than the PS3; Sony lost nearly  $5 BILLION in the first few years of that system, Nintendo will never lose that much on Wii U.

Oooooooo...K? SSB only pushed GCN in terms of system sellers. Wii had MK+SMG doing that mostly for it. Why do you think SSB is the only game pushing Wii U? Also, it seems like your very VERY biased to Nintendo, cuz wat you say about attach ratio's/etc you only point out nintendo and exclude everything else? Be fair bro,...... BE FAIR

Bluray hasn't become the main format, I would imagine that the digital format is more popular, and DVD's is still selling pretty well. So PS3 has failed to make bluray the dominant format. Maybe the most mainstream (I don't know I have to admit), but it is not dominant like DVD were. And while the hardware started to make a profit in 2010 doesn't mean Sony has re-coped the MAJOR losses they made initially on the hardware. The HW could have made $10 profit for every sold console, but they still lost billions in the first few years. Billions. (I'm exaggerating with the $10 just to make a point)

It would seem that I know as little about business as do you, with you calling out Wii U as a failure. Even if Wii U ended up doing GC numbers Nintendo would still profit from it, and that would make the console a (modest) success. And PS3 might hold 30% of the market, but at what price? You seem to forget that. At what price? I guess you're familiar with the term of a Pyrrhic victory, and that's kinda what PS3 could be likened with. It holds a 3rd of the market, it is turning a profit, and it has pushed bluray as a media format. But looking at the bigger picture we see that; PS3 has lost a lot of money for Sony, it has lost a market share of nearly 75%, and bluray hasn't been able to kill DVD's or digital formats. As a stand alone console PS3 has been very much a success, but looking at other factors it has not. It's all about perspective.

And it's still too early to deem Wii U a failure. Unless you have a magic crystal ball? Because if you do, I'd like to have the lottery numbers for next week... Mind looking up that for me? I'm not saying that Wii U will be top dog this gen, or that it'll even finish in 2nd place, but as long as it makes money for Nintendo to make a new console in 5 years that'll be enough. If they make money of the system that'll be enough.

COD is an M rated casual game, La Mulana is an E rated hardcore game.

And yet the different franchises all caused separate sales spikes on Wii...

I don't think he CAN be fair... he's spinning these things like hell! And he's even dropped the attach ratio argument when we brought up that neither of PS1 or PS2 had any decent selling games if applying his arguments.