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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Why is the Switch still not getting big games from 3rd parties? October edition

potato_hamster said:
AngryLittleAlchemist said:

Why would EA be bothered with Assassin's Creed?

Lol. Ohh man. My bad. Sorry about that. <>

Nah, it's ok xD Sorry, just yanking your chain! 



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Game development takes years in most cases. 90 to 95 percent of the big triple A publishers were guessing the Switch would fail or be a middling success before it blew the doors off the industry last year. It is difficult to change major development that quickly and impossible if the budget isn't be offered. Most Western development is already on locked out at this point save a few so until the next Switch successor it pretty much will only get middle of the road UBI Soft and some Bethesda stuff as their 'major ' software.



NoirSon said:
Game development takes years in most cases. 90 to 95 percent of the big triple A publishers were guessing the Switch would fail or be a middling success before it blew the doors off the industry last year. It is difficult to change major development that quickly and impossible if the budget isn't be offered. Most Western development is already on locked out at this point save a few so until the next Switch successor it pretty much will only get middle of the road UBI Soft and some Bethesda stuff as their 'major ' software.

Developing a game does take years. But,  adding a new platform to a development cycle doesn't add years to development time. In fact, often time you can just add people to your team to do it, which means it adds nothing to to the development time. It's not nearly as rigid as you're letting it on to be.



potato_hamster said:
Miyamotoo said:

Actually when we talk about PS4 vs XB1, almost all multiplatform games sold at least twice better on PS4 compared to XB1, why?  Simple, much higher install base. Just look here numbers for first 3 best selling games on PS4 and XB1.

Offcourse that not every game will have much stronger sales with higher install base (but fact is that will have higher sales in any case), espacily when we talking about games that are not popular, Killzone: Shadow Fall is not popular game, but games like Last Of Us, Uncharted Trilogy and Uncharted 4 are totally different story, they keep selling solid how install base is growing simple because they are some of must have Sony exclusives.

Results for multiplatform games for different platforms, espacily for yearly releases can be different, but remember, we were talking Sony PS4 games vs Nintendo Switch games, and thats much easier to compare.

You dont know what are you talking about, you do realise that Odyssey, MK8D, Zelda BotW and Splatoon 2 last few quarters each of them sold from 700k to around 1m per quarter without any bundle? And those games yet need to have bundles and price cuts. Only last quarter where Switch gain install base of  1.9m, Odyssey sold 750k, MK8D did 1.1m, Zelda BotW 850k, Splatoon 2 did 750k. You again missing point, Zelda TP would sell less if Wii install base was smaller, or would sell more if install base was stronger, same like Zelda BotW will continue selling how Switch install base is growing (offcourse that Zelda BotW will not left on 9.3m, probably will hit 15m LT of Switch only).

 

Offcourse that every game on one platform will sell more if its higher install base compared to sales of same game on same platform (Zelda BotW will have better sales when Switch has install base of 40m instead of current numbers on install base of 20m). Just let numbers speak for itself, at end of this month we will have again update for sales for Switch sales and games like Zelda BotW, Mario Odyssey, MK8D and Splatoon2, and you will how much those games sold in just one quarter, not to mentione how much those games will sell at end of this year when Switch install base will be around 30m. So no, your point where you comparing sales of Sony and Nintendo games on two different platforms where one has 4x higher install base, dont make any sense, and you even used that like proof how how Sony games selling better than Nintendo games, while fact is that when you look attach rate Odyssey, MK8D, Zelda BotW and Splatoon 2 destroying every Sony PS4 game.

I mean... if you exclude all the multi-platform games that don't sell 2-1, I can see your point.

Not every? Most games don't have stronger sales with a higher install base. You can cherry pick different examples of popular franchises that keep selling, but these are the exception, not the rule.

I don't know what I'm talking about? Are those sales rates for those games as good as they were when the titles were first released? Ohh they weren't? Sales are actually decreasing over time despite increased platform sales? That's interesting. It seems curious to me that Mario Odyssey sold 9 million games to an install base of 18 million consoles, yet have only sold another 2 million games along with another 8 million consoles sold? Shouldn't Mario Odyssey have sold another 4-5 million in 2018, instead of the 2 or so they sold?

How much less would Twillight princess have sold if Wii only sold 50 million units instead of 105 million?

As for attach rate, it's a pretty meaningless statistic. "Our game we released only sold 150,000 copies on Switch, and 1 million copies on PS4. Sure we'll never recoup the money we spent porting our game over to Switch, and if we didn't release on PS4 we would have been bankrupt, but look at how much better the attach rate was on Switch!"

Attach rates don't make platforms more lucrative to invest in. Attach rates don't put money in developers pockets. Attach rates don't get sequels greenlit.  Attach rates don't mean anything for businesses. The only people that care about it are video game fans that like to argue about video games on the internet.

Not all, but huge majority, like 90%.

Fact is that every game continue to sell how install base is growing, some better same worse, but they all continue to sell. I don't cherry picking anything, we talked about Sony vs Nintendo games sales, and offcourse we comparing best selling games.

Hardly somes will sell year or two later same like it did compared when its released, but that isnt my point, but games that I mentione will continue to sell very good. For your information in first two quarters of this year, Odyssey sold around 2m (where Switch sold 3.8m), in other two quarters of year it will easily sell at least 2-3m more (probably 3m+ more), so only in this year it will sell 4-5m more at least, while MK8D sold 3m in same time period (first two quarters of this year), Zelda BotW 2.6m and Splatoon 2 sold 1.85m in same time period.

We cant know that, but fact is it would sell less in any case, same like we know that Zelda BotW will have higher selling numbers when Switch install base will be around 40m instead of current 20m (for instance Zelda BotW sold 2.8m first month and now is at 9.3m, at end of this year will probably be somewhere around 12m).

Attach rate has much more sense when you comparing platforms with totally different install basis instead of sales numbers, it simple show of how much some game is selling compared to its install base.

No one arguing that, remember, we talked Sony vs Nintendo games sales.

Last edited by Miyamotoo - on 22 October 2018

HintHRO said:
Apparently downgrading games for the Switch is time-consuming and frustrating work and most companies won't make much money anyway because Nintendo fans don't care about them. Nobody wants to do that (except Panic Button).

This dont make any sense, Panic Button is port company and they living from porting games, and you have plenty of port companies, and 3rd party developers higher such a companies to port games for different platforms, Panic Button is just one of them not only one, for instance Virtuous Games is onother company, same like Tantalus, Bluepoint Games...and every port company will make any game for Switch if they are hired and paid for that.

Last edited by Miyamotoo - on 22 October 2018

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This is the main problem for Nintendo. They release underpowered hardware, and big 3rd party games can't run on it or, they might run but you have to re-work on them, and basicly they would look so much worse, and probably even AI, animations and physics should be re-worked.

It appears Nintendo don't care that much about, as they keep releasing weak hardware; their target is "an original concept", in this case a Home console together with a portable, but the other side of the coin is the very poor support from 3rd party devs/publishers, which will be almost zero when Next Sony and MS consoles will be released, I think 2 years from now.



”Every great dream begins with a dreamer. Always remember, you have within you the strength, the patience, and the passion to reach for the stars to change the world.”

Harriet Tubman.

I think people expect way too strong, that all triple A titles need to be available on Nintendo systems. All initial Wii U ports flopped. Not only because the console didn't sell, but also because those that already care for other franchises usually have their go to platform. They already own a gaming pc, xbox one or playstation 4 and the only advantage and reason to port games onto the Switch and buy it there is it's mobile capabillity. In return we see franchises on a Nintendo system, we haven't seen before. Both Sword Art Online games, Diablo, Final Fantasy, Doom, Wolfenstein, Dark Souls, South Park rpgs, Skyrim and we see pretty popular or important ports like Paladins, Rocket League, Arena of Valor, Warframe or Fortnite for the system and we even receive ports like Starlink or Doom Eternal for Switch.

The other perspective is pretty simple. By the time the console launched even all japanese devs had pretty low expectations for the system. That has changed and now all major jp companies work on many titles for the system. Bandai Namco, Square Enix, Konami, Capcom, Sega or Atlus for instance. Western publishers are a lot slower, but the work, that is necessary for porting games like Monster Hunter World, DmC5, Darksiders 3, Red Dead Redemption 2, Resident Evil 7, Final Fantasy XV, Tomb Raider, Assassins Creed Odyssey etc. isn't always worth it. For those games cloud gaming will be the solution on Switch, which is a problem because it actually kills the portabillity aspect.



potato_hamster said:
Jumpin said:

And it's a testament to how terrible the AAA third party devs are when their market researched formulaic games got stomped by smaller, yet more creative and experimental, studios who released "shovelware" type games expanding the scope of what a video game could be, and finding success; while the AAA studios fail with their big budgets and market researched formulas.

So in this very thread you have two groups of Nintendo fans:

One calling them idiots or having a bias against NIntendo for not bringing their top, high budget titles on Nintendo platforms and not giving their audience a chance to support these games with substantial sales, and another calling them idiots who are completely out of touch with Nintendo's audience and are foolish to think the games they aren't porting to Nintendo platforms wouldn't sell well on Nintendo platforms, and instead should observe the "creative, experimental, quirky" games that do sell better on Nintendo platforms, that you know, these third party publishers have historically made instead.

Like, you do realize games like Boom Blox are made by EA, right?

P.S. I'm sure EA felt super that they never bothered porting Assassin's creed to the Wii, but 50+ games like "Get Fit with Mel B",  "My horse and Me: Riding for Gold" combined to outsell what they projected Assassin's Creed would have.

I fall in the second group. Just look at Ubisoft. They did it. They try to cater to the audience. It doesn't always work out, but it does sometimes. Just Dance was created by Ubisoft for the Wii audience. And it worked out big time, it was a really big franchise. Only that Nintendo themself was playing at the next garden and gave up on motion gaming eroded the userbase for Just Dance over time.

Switch has a much more classical userbase, but not one that is after the last graphical things (obviously). So games that sell over technical feats - mostly action games and FPS - do sell badly on Switch. That's why it is mind-boggling that Bethesda tries themself at shooters on Switch so much. Doom and Wolfenstein do sell badly on Switch, but Bethesda is unphased. I think a manger is fan of Switch. Or Bethesda wants to be the one company that sells games to the Switch audience. That might work out.

But Switch has a userbase for Platformers, Metroidvanias, Brawlers, RPGs and adventures. Therefore pretty much everything in that categories is ported to Switch and sells great. Only this forum mostly cares about shooters and action-games. Therefore it seems Switch has bad 3rd-party support, while it actually gets pretty decent support, only in different genres.

Yeah, besides that AssCreed is Ubi not EA. Just wanted to say.



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Teno said:

I think people expect way too strong, that all triple A titles need to be available on Nintendo systems.

Yeah, we have also to realize, that the userbase of Switch is different than the userbase of PS4/XB1 (which are pretty similar). Shooters and action games will never sell well on Switch. So COD, Battlefield, GTA, RDR, Farcry, AssCreed and so on are pretty unlikely ports. Sales of Doom and Wolfenstein show a bad ratio of sales, compared to other multiplatform titles.

But other genres do sell well. Square didn't decide to port pretty much all Final Fantasy because they suddenly all chummy with Nintendo, they decided that because they saw how RPGs sold on Switch and saw a chance for easy money. I started my gaming career with LucasArts point and click adventures and for years after the demise of LucasArts it seemed like the genre was dead. But recently there was a renaisance - and all important titles (Darkside Detective, Broken Age, Thimbleweed Park, Broken Sword, Harvey and Edna, Inner World) are on Switch and a bunch of less known titles are too. That's not because they all love the Switch, it is because these games sell. Platformers did well even on WiiU, for games like Sonic Mania and Forces the Switch version nearly outsells the other platforms combined. Namco and Capcom didn't decided on a whim to port Dragon Ball Z, Street Fighter Anniversary or My Heroes One Justice, they saw how well fighters did on Switch and were going after the money.

If this forum decides only Shooters and action games count, then the Switch will never get 3rd party support. But the gaming world is so much bigger than these two genres, and the Switch already covers these bases.



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I dont see an issue with the lack of ports, its not like the Switch has nothing to play. Theres a mountain load of games. If ports come its a bonus.