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Forums - Sony Discussion - PS3 now 70% Cheaper to Produce!

Munkeh111 on 31 July 2009
Slimebeast said:
Kantor said:
Slimebeast said:
Munkeh111 said:
Well PS2 is definitely profitable from a hardware side, and now apparently the PS3 makes more profit that the PS2 sells for, and I think the PSP makes money

On a software side, SCE are definitely profitable, most of their games sell in excess of 1m copies


How can everything be profitable when overall Sony Entertainment has been posting losses for three years in a row?

You're just making things up.

The 1st party software is not profitable. Sony games have huge budgets and never sell well since the PSP/PS3 era. Also, when MS is selling away a lot of their first party you can suspect that Sony doesnt make profit on their 1st party either (but it still might be worth it overall, because 1st party games sell consoles, which in turn moves third party software). The little money Sony Entertainment makes comes from the $10 license fees from third party. 

SCE WWS has been profitable for a long time. The PS3, however, is still selling at a loss. Can you name any Sony games released recently which could feasibly have lost money?

All of them except MGS4 (and that is maybe not even published by Sony but Konami?).

Well, LBP i'd say indeed also made a profit.

Like Uncharted, which sold 2.5m on a $20m budget. Or Insomniac who manage to release a game which sell about 1.5m copies every year, with 150 people.

If SCE was losing money, do you really think that there would not have been any job cuts? Banjo did not sell enough, so Rare has had job cuts. SCE make Sony money, so they are not going to drop support of it



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Kantor on 31 July 2009
Slimebeast said:
Kantor said:
Slimebeast said:
Munkeh111 said:
Well PS2 is definitely profitable from a hardware side, and now apparently the PS3 makes more profit that the PS2 sells for, and I think the PSP makes money

On a software side, SCE are definitely profitable, most of their games sell in excess of 1m copies


How can everything be profitable when overall Sony Entertainment has been posting losses for three years in a row?

You're just making things up.

The 1st party software is not profitable. Sony games have huge budgets and never sell well since the PSP/PS3 era. Also, when MS is selling away a lot of their first party you can suspect that Sony doesnt make profit on their 1st party either (but it still might be worth it overall, because 1st party games sell consoles, which in turn moves third party software). The little money Sony Entertainment makes comes from the $10 license fees from third party. 

SCE WWS has been profitable for a long time. The PS3, however, is still selling at a loss. Can you name any Sony games released recently which could feasibly have lost money?

All of them except MGS4 (and that is maybe not even published by Sony but Konami?).

Well, LBP i'd say indeed also made a profit.

You think Resistance 2 lost money?

Let's say Sony gets $20 per game sold (probably too low- they are publisher AND platform holder). 1.5 million * 20 = $30 million. Now look at Resistance 2. Do you really think it took $30 million to make? Recycled engine, two years of development (not even with the full Insomniac staff- Tools of Destruction and Quest 4 Booty both launched between RFOM and R2) and no phenomenal graphics or anything. Besides, R2 isn't done selling, or close to it.

The only game which may not have made a profit (yet) is Killzone 2.



(Former) Lead Moderator and (Eternal) VGC Detective

Munkeh111 on 31 July 2009

Resistance 2 was Insomniac's fastest selling game and they rekon it will be probably be their biggest commercial success

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/generating-resistance



Slimebeast on 31 July 2009
Munkeh111 said:
Slimebeast said:
Kantor said:
Slimebeast said:
Munkeh111 said:
Well PS2 is definitely profitable from a hardware side, and now apparently the PS3 makes more profit that the PS2 sells for, and I think the PSP makes money

On a software side, SCE are definitely profitable, most of their games sell in excess of 1m copies


How can everything be profitable when overall Sony Entertainment has been posting losses for three years in a row?

You're just making things up.

The 1st party software is not profitable. Sony games have huge budgets and never sell well since the PSP/PS3 era. Also, when MS is selling away a lot of their first party you can suspect that Sony doesnt make profit on their 1st party either (but it still might be worth it overall, because 1st party games sell consoles, which in turn moves third party software). The little money Sony Entertainment makes comes from the $10 license fees from third party. 

SCE WWS has been profitable for a long time. The PS3, however, is still selling at a loss. Can you name any Sony games released recently which could feasibly have lost money?

All of them except MGS4 (and that is maybe not even published by Sony but Konami?).

Well, LBP i'd say indeed also made a profit.

Like Uncharted, which sold 2.5m on a $20m budget. Or Insomniac who manage to release a game which sell about 1.5m copies every year, with 150 people.

If SCE was losing money, do you really think that there would not have been any job cuts? Banjo did not sell enough, so Rare has had job cuts. SCE make Sony money, so they are not going to drop support of it

Im confused. Isnt it a well established fact that SCE has been losing 100's of millions of Dollars during the last three years?

Uncharted probably made a small profit, and yes, Insomniac are probably also profitabel. But u have to weight those two against all the other first party titles that are losin money. What abot Motorstorms? And so far KZ2 lost money. Hevenly Sword, Lair lost money.



johnsobas on 31 July 2009
Kantor said:
luisgvm said:
wow awesome news. this is true?.

It might be. But it's currently 4 threads for, and one thread against, so by that logic, yes it's true.

However, by following more logical logic, the one thread against actually has some sort of evidence that it's fake...apparently. I'm not listening to an hour long conference call to prove them right (or wrong).

4 threads that use the same source so that doesn't really count.  I could listen to it but even if I do it doesnt' mean everyone will believe me, they didn't believe the thread creator.  We need someone everyone trusts here to listen to it like Source or Brett.



currently playing: Skyward Sword, Mario Sunshine, Xenoblade Chronicles X

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Munkeh111 on 31 July 2009
Slimebeast said:
Munkeh111 said:
Slimebeast said:
Kantor said:
Slimebeast said:
Munkeh111 said:
Well PS2 is definitely profitable from a hardware side, and now apparently the PS3 makes more profit that the PS2 sells for, and I think the PSP makes money

On a software side, SCE are definitely profitable, most of their games sell in excess of 1m copies


How can everything be profitable when overall Sony Entertainment has been posting losses for three years in a row?

You're just making things up.

The 1st party software is not profitable. Sony games have huge budgets and never sell well since the PSP/PS3 era. Also, when MS is selling away a lot of their first party you can suspect that Sony doesnt make profit on their 1st party either (but it still might be worth it overall, because 1st party games sell consoles, which in turn moves third party software). The little money Sony Entertainment makes comes from the $10 license fees from third party. 

SCE WWS has been profitable for a long time. The PS3, however, is still selling at a loss. Can you name any Sony games released recently which could feasibly have lost money?

All of them except MGS4 (and that is maybe not even published by Sony but Konami?).

Well, LBP i'd say indeed also made a profit.

Like Uncharted, which sold 2.5m on a $20m budget. Or Insomniac who manage to release a game which sell about 1.5m copies every year, with 150 people.

If SCE was losing money, do you really think that there would not have been any job cuts? Banjo did not sell enough, so Rare has had job cuts. SCE make Sony money, so they are not going to drop support of it

Im confused. Isnt it a well established fact that SCE has been losing 100's of millions of Dollars during the last three years?

Uncharted probably made a small profit, and yes, Insomniac are probably also profitabel. But u have to weight those two against all the other first party titles that are losin money. What abot Motorstorms? And so far KZ2 lost money. Hevenly Sword, Lair lost money.

Sorry, SCEWWS. So Motorstorm 1 sold 3.48m, but yeah it was bundled, but that is certainly plenty. Pacific Rift is very likely undertracked, it sold 1m according to the developer: http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/motorstorm-pacific-rift-passes-one-million-sales.

Heavenly Sword sold about 1.4m, made by a team with only about 25 employees, in 3 years, so that would have had a reasonably small budget.

Yes, Lair was a flop

 



Slimebeast on 31 July 2009
Kantor said:
Slimebeast said:
Kantor said:
Slimebeast said:
Munkeh111 said:
Well PS2 is definitely profitable from a hardware side, and now apparently the PS3 makes more profit that the PS2 sells for, and I think the PSP makes money

On a software side, SCE are definitely profitable, most of their games sell in excess of 1m copies


How can everything be profitable when overall Sony Entertainment has been posting losses for three years in a row?

You're just making things up.

The 1st party software is not profitable. Sony games have huge budgets and never sell well since the PSP/PS3 era. Also, when MS is selling away a lot of their first party you can suspect that Sony doesnt make profit on their 1st party either (but it still might be worth it overall, because 1st party games sell consoles, which in turn moves third party software). The little money Sony Entertainment makes comes from the $10 license fees from third party. 

SCE WWS has been profitable for a long time. The PS3, however, is still selling at a loss. Can you name any Sony games released recently which could feasibly have lost money?

All of them except MGS4 (and that is maybe not even published by Sony but Konami?).

Well, LBP i'd say indeed also made a profit.

You think Resistance 2 lost money?

Let's say Sony gets $20 per game sold (probably too low- they are publisher AND platform holder). 1.5 million * 20 = $30 million. Now look at Resistance 2. Do you really think it took $30 million to make? Recycled engine, two years of development (not even with the full Insomniac staff- Tools of Destruction and Quest 4 Booty both launched between RFOM and R2) and no phenomenal graphics or anything. Besides, R2 isn't done selling, or close to it.

The only game which may not have made a profit (yet) is Killzone 2.

Okay okay! Dont take it literally. I acknowledge that there's more than LPB and MGS4 who has made money.

Insomniac probably yes.

BBut my argument was mainly that on average Sony 1st party since 2006 has lost money (i refuted a claim by Munkeh who said Sony 1st party is profitbale).



johnsobas on 31 July 2009

well motorstorm 2 had a million shipped shortly after launch, I'm sure that it was overshipped because the sales were not there but 1 million was probably enough to break even on the sequel.



currently playing: Skyward Sword, Mario Sunshine, Xenoblade Chronicles X

Kantor on 31 July 2009
Slimebeast said:
Munkeh111 said:
Slimebeast said:
Kantor said:
Slimebeast said:
Munkeh111 said:
Well PS2 is definitely profitable from a hardware side, and now apparently the PS3 makes more profit that the PS2 sells for, and I think the PSP makes money

On a software side, SCE are definitely profitable, most of their games sell in excess of 1m copies


How can everything be profitable when overall Sony Entertainment has been posting losses for three years in a row?

You're just making things up.

The 1st party software is not profitable. Sony games have huge budgets and never sell well since the PSP/PS3 era. Also, when MS is selling away a lot of their first party you can suspect that Sony doesnt make profit on their 1st party either (but it still might be worth it overall, because 1st party games sell consoles, which in turn moves third party software). The little money Sony Entertainment makes comes from the $10 license fees from third party. 

SCE WWS has been profitable for a long time. The PS3, however, is still selling at a loss. Can you name any Sony games released recently which could feasibly have lost money?

All of them except MGS4 (and that is maybe not even published by Sony but Konami?).

Well, LBP i'd say indeed also made a profit.

Like Uncharted, which sold 2.5m on a $20m budget. Or Insomniac who manage to release a game which sell about 1.5m copies every year, with 150 people.

If SCE was losing money, do you really think that there would not have been any job cuts? Banjo did not sell enough, so Rare has had job cuts. SCE make Sony money, so they are not going to drop support of it

Im confused. Isnt it a well established fact that SCE has been losing 100's of millions of Dollars during the last three years?

Uncharted probably made a small profit, and yes, Insomniac are probably also profitabel. But u have to weight those two against all the other first party titles that are losin money. What abot Motorstorms? And so far KZ2 lost money. Hevenly Sword, Lair lost money.

Sigh.

SCE have made a loss for the past few years because of, and only because of, PS3 hardware. It was selling at more than a $200 loss at launch.

Uncharted would have made a huge profit. Look at the sales.

MotorStorm 1 definitely made money. It was not an expensive game, and it crossed 3 million units sold.

MotorStorm 2 didn't sell very well, but it sold well enough- again, how much could it have cost? That might have made a slight loss, but enough to offset Naughty Dog, Insomniac, MotorStorm 1...?

Heavenly Sword sold 1.3 million units. It wasn't a long game, and it looked pretty good, but not THAT good. Definitely profitable.

Lair probably lost money, but I doubt they spent much money on it, looking at the quality of the final product.



(Former) Lead Moderator and (Eternal) VGC Detective

luisgvm on 31 July 2009
Kantor said:
luisgvm said:
wow awesome news. this is true?.

It might be. But it's currently 4 threads for, and one thread against, so by that logic, yes it's true.

However, by following more logical logic, the one thread against actually has some sort of evidence that it's fake...apparently. I'm not listening to an hour long conference call to prove them right (or wrong).

mmmm i see. well lets hope is true!!!.