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Forums - Sony - Rumor: PS5 Pro specs leaked out, dev kits go out in 11/2023, release 11/2024

Norion on 22 July 2023
shikamaru317 said:
Norion said:

If there is a PS5 Pro I don't see that happening since not only ceding the power advantage but letting them have an outright big advantage in that regard for the 2nd half of the generation would be a significant disadvantage. 

Xbox's hands are kind of tied at this point because they did 2 consoles from the start of the gen. Their options basically are:

  • Force developers to support 3 different Xbox Series spec tiers, S, X, and a new Pro tier. (This would anger a fair few devs, as some of them are already saying that Series S is a burden for them to develop for, if you make them support a 3rd Xbox console they may just decide to drop Xbox support altogether)
  • Drop the requirement that devs make a Series S version of games and then release an Xbox Series Pro system more powerful than PS5 Pro. (This would anger Series S owners, as they were promised a full generation of game support, yet would only be getting that full generation of support from Xbox 1st and 2nd party devs, most 3rd parties would choose to drop Series S if Xbox dropped the requirement that devs support it)
  • Stick with just Series S and Series X, and instead focus on making Xbox Series the pricing king this gen. They could drop Series S down to $250 soon and eventually $200 later this gen. They could drop Series X down to $400 later this year and then $350 next Holiday when PS5 Pro releases (or maybe release a cheaper, digital Series X model for $350 instead), which would make Series X the best price/performance console next Holiday, with specs that are only about 30-35% below PS5 Pro most likely, but priced probably $250 cheaper than PS5 Pro.

It's also worth noting that even if they choose to respond with a Pro console of their own, since one doesn't appear to already be in R&D based on recent Xbox statements, that it would basically take them 2 years from now to R&D and release the console, meaning that it would be releasing a year later than PS5 Pro itself, just like One X vs PS4 Pro. Releasing an Xbox Pro console Holiday 2025 just isn't a great idea, as the next gen Xbox console and PS6 will likely be Holiday 2028 releases, meaning people would be shelling out a likely $600 for a console that would only last the 3 remaining years of this generation and then the cross-gen period at the start of next-gen. They really needed to do a 2024 release for a Pro console, and that just doesn't seem to be in the cards, they'd have to rush through R&D very quickly in order to release a Pro console Holiday 2024 alongside PS5 Pro. 

One thing is for sure, I doubt Xbox will bother with 2 consoles at the start of next gen, it was a novel idea but it just hasn't worked out for them. I suspect they will release just 1 console at the start of next-gen, and then release Slim and Pro consoles middle of next gen. It may even be a good idea for them to go for a 1 year headstart, aim for a Holiday 2027 release since PS6 is likely targeting Holiday 2028. That 1 year headstart could have positive effects for them the entire gen just like it did on Xbox 360. 

I doubt any developers will drop Xbox support over a third system to support. Since it'd be a more powerful revision it would be a lot easier to support than the Series S so at worst some might get lazy and certain games won't run as well on it as they should. Holiday 2025 wouldn't be ideal but I think it would be preferable to letting the PS5 be the best console for multiplats for a few years.

I do agree that the Series S hasn't worked out that well. It worked out during the stock shortages when it was the only console you could buy easily but going forward I don't see it doing much. A cheap way to play games like GTA 6 will appeal to some people but at large people aren't gonna want to play that at a resolution under 1080p and at low graphical settings. 



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haxxiy on 22 July 2023
shikamaru317 said:

haxxiy said:

There absolutely will be games that struggle this gen for CPU reasons, we're already seeing it in a few 2023 games, and we have only recently exited the cross-gen period and started seeing games that target Xbox Series, PS5, and PC only, this generation will most likely last through 2028 before Xbox and Sony's next gen consoles release. 5 more years to get through as PC games begin to target Zen 4+ and Zen 5 CPU's on PC high end in the later years of the gen, a much bigger gap than there is now with them targeting Zen 4 on the high end vs Zen 2 on Xbox Series/PC. CPU bound games won't be as big of an issue on console as they were last gen, as relatively speaking, the 8 core Zen 2 CPU's in Xbox Series and PS5 are closer to modern PC CPU's than the Jaguar CPU's in Xbox One and PS4 were, but less CPU bound games than last gen doesn't mean that there will be no CPU bound games. 

Kyuu is right to say that the PS5 Pro likely won't help much with those CPU intensive games, just like PS4 Pro barely helped on them. Assuming that PS5 Pro is just an overclock of the current PS5 CPU that is, just like PS4 Pro was just an overclock of the PS4 CPU. Higher CPU clockrates will add a few fps to CPU bound games, but higher clocks alone can't get a game that runs at say 38 fps on PS5 up to more than maybe 47 fps on PS5 Pro, higher clocks alone are not going to magically allow a locked 60 fps on games that are that badly CPU bound. Now maybe Sony will go for more than just a CPU overclock this time, and actually upgrade PS5 Pro to a Zen 3 or Zen 4 CPU instead of sticking with Zen 2, but I'm doubtful that will happen, GPU and RAM upgrades, and likely a bigger SSD, will already be adding alot to their build cost, I get the feeling they won't want to charge more than $600 for PS5 Pro, so I can't see them doing much CPU wise beyond higher clockrates on the same Zen 2 CPU as PS5.

There is no game that averages below 60 fps in a ~ 3700 or equivalent. CPU bottlenecks are usually 30-90 frames above that threshold or more.

Or to specify: there are some, but they are horribly unoptimized for multithreading in the first place (Arma, Crysis Remastered).

Or to specify further: if the bottleneck you imagine to exist actually existed then there would be no CPU in the market that could run 2023 games above 60 fps since generational IPC improvements are small for CPUs and very few use more than 12-16 threads.



 

 

 

 

 

DonFerrari on 22 July 2023
Kyuu said:

I suspect FPS won't see a considerable improvement in CPU-intensive games. CPU will be the bottleneck again, so I wouldn't expect a huge increase in FPS on most AAA and ambitious games. The benefits will be higher resolutions and settings, more stable framerate, potentially more efficient raytracing, and little else.

As the generation goes, games will be a lot more demanding and native 4K on base consoles might go exinct outside indies, sports and smaller games.

Curious how Microsoft is going to react. They could release a much more powerful upgrade 2 years later, but then the gap between it and the Series S would be absolutely massive (much bigger than One S vs One X, let alone PS5 vs Pro).

If MS launches a Pro version of the Xbox 2 years after the PS5Pro that would be very near the end of the gen so wouldn't make sense unless they dump Series S, makes the X the baseline and act like really there isn't really gens for them anymore, just new iterations with at some point in place the older version isn't supported anymore.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari on 22 July 2023
shikamaru317 said:
Norion said:

If there is a PS5 Pro I don't see that happening since not only ceding the power advantage but letting them have an outright big advantage in that regard for the 2nd half of the generation would be a significant disadvantage. 

Xbox's hands are kind of tied at this point because they did 2 consoles from the start of the gen. Their options basically are:

  • Force developers to support 3 different Xbox Series spec tiers, S, X, and a new Pro tier. (This would anger a fair few devs, as some of them are already saying that Series S is a burden for them to develop for, if you make them support a 3rd Xbox console they may just decide to drop Xbox support altogether)
  • Drop the requirement that devs make a Series S version of games and then release an Xbox Series Pro system more powerful than PS5 Pro. (This would anger Series S owners, as they were promised a full generation of game support, yet would only be getting that full generation of support from Xbox 1st and 2nd party devs, most 3rd parties would choose to drop Series S if Xbox dropped the requirement that devs support it)
  • Stick with just Series S and Series X, and instead focus on making Xbox Series the pricing king this gen. They could drop Series S down to $250 soon and eventually $200 later this gen. They could drop Series X down to $400 later this year and then $350 next Holiday when PS5 Pro releases (or maybe release a cheaper, digital Series X model for $350 instead), which would make Series X the best price/performance console next Holiday, with specs that are only about 30-35% below PS5 Pro most likely, but priced probably $250 cheaper than PS5 Pro.

It's also worth noting that even if they choose to respond with a Pro console of their own, since one doesn't appear to already be in R&D based on recent Xbox statements, that it would basically take them 2 years from now to R&D and release the console, meaning that it would be releasing a year later than PS5 Pro itself, just like One X vs PS4 Pro. Releasing an Xbox Pro console Holiday 2025 just isn't a great idea, as the next gen Xbox console and PS6 will likely be Holiday 2028 releases, meaning people would be shelling out a likely $600 for a console that would only last the 3 remaining years of this generation and then the cross-gen period at the start of next-gen. They really needed to do a 2024 release for a Pro console, and that just doesn't seem to be in the cards, they'd have to rush through R&D very quickly in order to release a Pro console Holiday 2024 alongside PS5 Pro. 

One thing is for sure, I doubt Xbox will bother with 2 consoles at the start of next gen, it was a novel idea but it just hasn't worked out for them. I suspect they will release just 1 console at the start of next-gen, and then release Slim and Pro consoles middle of next gen. It may even be a good idea for them to go for a 1 year headstart, aim for a Holiday 2027 release since PS6 is likely targeting Holiday 2028. That 1 year headstart could have positive effects for them the entire gen just like it did on Xbox 360. 

I don't think devs would drop the support for Series S since it may be over 70% of xbox base, it would be more likely of them to drop Xbox altogether.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Alex_The_Hedgehog on 22 July 2023

Hm... I don't see people complaining about lack of power on current PS5. What I see is people wondering when Sony will release a smaller version, since the current one is quite big.

I have a friend that loves Playstation games, but he don't have a PS5 yet, He told me one of the reasons he hadn't bought one yet is because he doesn't even know where he would put it, since it's way too big for his living room.



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JRPGfan on 23 July 2023
Alex_The_Hedgehog said:

Hm... I don't see people complaining about lack of power on current PS5. What I see is people wondering when Sony will release a smaller version, since the current one is quite big.

I have a friend that loves Playstation games, but he don't have a PS5 yet, He told me one of the reasons he hadn't bought one yet is because he doesn't even know where he would put it, since it's way too big for his living room.

They are clearing stock by lower prices atm (getting rid of current versions of the PS5 they have)

So "soon" should be the answear. A smaller cheaper PS5, thats sold discless, and with a optional addon buy, of a disc bay via usb....
has been heavily rumored for along time now.

I suspect its going to be out, well before the holiday season.
Sony would want to capitalise on holiday sales for such a console.



DonFerrari on 23 July 2023
Alex_The_Hedgehog said:

Hm... I don't see people complaining about lack of power on current PS5. What I see is people wondering when Sony will release a smaller version, since the current one is quite big.

I have a friend that loves Playstation games, but he don't have a PS5 yet, He told me one of the reasons he hadn't bought one yet is because he doesn't even know where he would put it, since it's way too big for his living room.

I recognize PS5 is pretty big, but I find hard to think of a living room that couldn't fit one at all even more on a gamers house = p



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Azzanation on 24 July 2023

So, the base PS5 will be holding back the PS5 Pro since that's what everyone is saying about the Series S right?

Specs aren't too bad, but I still think it's rather early.

-- User was thread banned for this post.

Last edited by Bandorr - on 24 July 2023

Qwark on 24 July 2023
Azzanation said:

So, the base PS5 will be holding back the PS5 Pro since that's what everyone is saying about the Series S right?

Specs aren't too bad, but I still think it's rather early.

Pro versions in general are only there for higher Res and perhaps more RT, nothing more. It will make games look better, but games will never be optimized for the pro version of any console. However especially as we saw in crossgen games, the pro version of these games will hold up much better and the PS6 will probably be able to play the PS5 pro variant of PS5 games meaning a better bc experience.

Also we really need to take rumours as rumors especially specs. I still remember the teraflop claims for Switch living their own live.



Please excuse my (probally) poor grammar

JRPGfan on 24 July 2023
Azzanation said:

So, the base PS5 will be holding back the PS5 Pro since that's what everyone is saying about the Series S right?

Specs aren't too bad, but I still think it's rather early.

The differnce will be Raytraceing ON, vs Raytraceing Off, in future games, and maybe a slight resolution differnce.

Series S vs X, is a factor of +300% (4tflops vs 12)
PS5 vs rumored PS5pro, is a factor of +50% (10,2 Tflops vs ~15 Tflops)

Completely the same thing.
Also your only as strong as your weakest link in the chain.
If devs will have to make ports to the Series S, I think the PS5 stock, should be fine.

Like its not like devs will go "we'll only make PS5pro versions from now on".
When they still have to make Series X and S ports as well (PS5 and XSX are close enough, that if you can do one, you can do the other).

If devs really did drop the PS5 base version, for the pro, they would also drop the Series X and S.

Plus theres bound to be over 40m normal PS5 out in the wild by now... thats a large base to just drop.
Supposedly Xbox leaked around 21m sales resently for the Series S/X. Where somewhere around 65-70% of sales are the S.
That means the series X is sitting around 6,3m to 7,3m sales (the rest being series S) (compaired to the 40m PS5's out there).

Which is why devs might not put as much effort into ports for the x, as they do the PS5.
(hence leading to some of why you see PS5 out performing the Series X, from time to time)

PS5 wont get dropped or be held back by devs.... thats a silly suggestion.
The upcomeing PS5slim (discless PS5) is bound to only increase sales of PS5s (stock version).
Its going to keep being the majority of current gen, console sales (Switch 2 is releaseing soon, the PS5 will be the biggest marketshare for consoles then).


Last edited by JRPGfan - on 24 July 2023