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Forums - Sony Discussion - PlayStation Nation |OT| Playing Astro Bot on the Horizon Until Dawn

I think Bend should of worked on a Jak and Daxter reboot and a reimaging of Uncharted 1.

Jak and Daxter has so much potential as an IP. Give it a pixar sudo realism lick of paint. Keep the freedom and some the robust action, edge of the Jak 2 but the colour and Eco/environmental focus of the OG.

Uncharted deserves a high quality origin story/entry point. This is no shade to original game but it's really quite mid, the franchise didn't make waves until uncharted 2. I think bend could/should re-imafine the game from the ground up, only really taking care to introduce the trio (Nate, Sully, forgot the girls name) in a way that fits the cannon.

Personally I don't feel Days Gone adds anything interesting to Sonys portfolio.



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twintail said:

ha! at this point them not doing a Golden Abyss remake would just be another poor decision from them. The VA and story beats are all done. Just need to revamp the graphics, gameplay and enhance the game is some ways unique to their style (like using Day Gone's weather system to create more emergent scenarios randomised for each playthrough). A good time Uncharted with Drake will have appeal.

And they originally wanted to do a sequel iirc, so there's that chance there. And, perhaps UC1-3 can finally come to PC with remakes.

I dunno, not the most exciting lineup of stuff for them I guess. But they need to really secure their place and remakes of GA (and UC1-3) and a GA sequel is something they can get done on a regular schedule into mid years of PS6. 

I just want them to do something other than TLoU (I know they are doing the new space IP)  - but I actually like Nathan Drake as a character and want to see more games with him.



twintail said:
Kyuu said:

It's bad enough that they let single-player studios work on live service games. But it's far worse to waste the years of work that went into those games by cancelling them. Some might have turned out decent and successful, I just don't trust the higher ups ability to judge quality. For all I know the Concord trauma may have put them on panic-auto-pilot. Remember... even Shuhei Yoshida once thought Demon's Souls was garbage... Imagine if it was cancelled and Miyazaki took it to heart and gave up on making video games. Holy shit.

Some of Sony's decisions and priorities are stupid beyond belief. A few days ago Shu shared his "theory" on why Sony is ignoring Bloodborne, which implies they really are doing nothing with the IP. How out of touch do you gotta be to not understand the popularity of FromSoftware games on PC? Why does Sony refuse to port their bigger Japanese games? Demon's Souls, Bloodborne, and Gran Turismo 7 are guaranteed million sellers on Steam. Bloodborne and GT7 should be able to sell 5+ million each. But "Nope, we're busy and excited porting Sackboy and Rift Apart!"

If the Concord situation is making them re-evaluate live service games with a closer eye, then I think that is warranted. At most, BluePoint has spent 2 years on their game (probably less), and Bend 2.5 years. You bring up Shu, who in the same interview claimed that tons of projects are cancelled all the time at various points in development. It is what it is, I suppose.

The porting issue is probably a lot more involved. No GT7 is obvious: Polyphony want to do it themselves. Why no Demon's is strange though.

Cancelled projects typically stop development at early stages, otherwise they're failures that justify criticisms. Demon's Souls Remake released over 4 years ago, so I don't find it believable that Bluepoint were working on the live service GoW for less than two years unless they had their main team working since 2021 on an unannounced project. If the entire team was busy assisting in Ragnarok development, then I'm happy to include them and Santa Monica to my list of inefficient developers. Ragnarok is a safe and unambitious PS4 sequel that took 5 whole years to make. It didn't need all of Bluepoint's resources.

A GT7 PC port is worth Polyphony Digital's involvement. With Nixxes's help, it shouldn't be much of a challenge. Bloodborne and Demon's Souls ports are much less work and easy money, but everything else is being prioritized over them.



Kyuu said:

Cancelled projects typically stop development at early stages, otherwise they're failures that justify criticisms. Demon's Souls Remake released over 4 years ago, so I don't find it believable that Bluepoint were working on the live service GoW for less than two years unless they had their main team working since 2021 on an unannounced project. If the entire team was busy assisting in Ragnarok development, then I'm happy to include them and Santa Monica to my list of inefficient developers. Ragnarok is a safe and unambitious PS4 sequel that took 5 whole years to make. It didn't need all of Bluepoint's resources.

That's the state of the entire industry right now. 

Tears of the Kingdom took 6 years, despite very heavily using the predecessor as a base. 

Super Mario Wonder took 4 years. 

We are at a point where it's newsworthy for a bog standard sequel to be done in 3 years, or for Astro Bot to be developed by 60 people in 4 years. 

There's no point in keeping a list of inefficient developers anymore. 



the-pi-guy said:
Kyuu said:

Cancelled projects typically stop development at early stages, otherwise they're failures that justify criticisms. Demon's Souls Remake released over 4 years ago, so I don't find it believable that Bluepoint were working on the live service GoW for less than two years unless they had their main team working since 2021 on an unannounced project. If the entire team was busy assisting in Ragnarok development, then I'm happy to include them and Santa Monica to my list of inefficient developers. Ragnarok is a safe and unambitious PS4 sequel that took 5 whole years to make. It didn't need all of Bluepoint's resources.

That's the state of the entire industry right now. 

Tears of the Kingdom took 6 years, despite very heavily using the predecessor as a base. 

Super Mario Wonder took 4 years. 

We are at a point where it's newsworthy for a bog standard sequel to be done in 3 years, or for Astro Bot to be developed by 60 people in 4 years. 

There's no point in keeping a list of inefficient developers anymore. 

Except they would be inefficient even in relative terms. I hardly know anything about Nintendo's divisions and development structure but I'm pretty sure the majority of the BotW team worked extensively on other projects beside TotK.

Insomniac, Capcom, Monolith Soft, FromSoftware and unironically FF7 Rebirth's division among others are very efficient. You can't make an excuse for two studios taking several years to develop a single safe sequel (5 years from Santa Monica and 2 from Bluepoint apparently). And where is the evidence that Bluepoint put all of their manpower into Ragnarok before the live service game? How come they aren't credited as the co-developers?



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Kyuu said:

Except they would be inefficient even in relative terms. I hardly know anything about Nintendo's divisions and development structure but I'm pretty sure the majority of the BotW team worked extensively on other projects beside TotK.

Insomniac, Capcom, Monolith Soft, FromSoftware and unironically FF7 Rebirth's division among others are very efficient. You can't make an excuse for two studios taking several years to develop a single safe sequel (5 years from Santa Monica and 2 from Bluepoint apparently). And where is the evidence that Bluepoint put all of their manpower into Ragnarok before the live service game? How come they aren't credited as the co-developers?

You also do realize, that Bluepoint is a small studio, right? They have like 100 developers. They're a fraction of the size of Santa Monica. 

They were listed as a partner studio: 

https://bsky.app/profile/jasonschreier.bsky.social/post/3lfvguewrts2i



I'm surprised Demon's Souls and GT7 havent ported over to Steam/PC yet considering they were on the Nvidia leak.

Since then, there's been more games that werent on the list that got released.



the-pi-guy said:
Kyuu said:

Except they would be inefficient even in relative terms. I hardly know anything about Nintendo's divisions and development structure but I'm pretty sure the majority of the BotW team worked extensively on other projects beside TotK.

Insomniac, Capcom, Monolith Soft, FromSoftware and unironically FF7 Rebirth's division among others are very efficient. You can't make an excuse for two studios taking several years to develop a single safe sequel (5 years from Santa Monica and 2 from Bluepoint apparently). And where is the evidence that Bluepoint put all of their manpower into Ragnarok before the live service game? How come they aren't credited as the co-developers?

You also do realize, that Bluepoint is a small studio, right? They have like 100 developers. They're a fraction of the size of Santa Monica. 

They were listed as a partner studio: 

https://bsky.app/profile/jasonschreier.bsky.social/post/3lfvguewrts2i

That's more developers than I thought! If most of the team worked full time on Ragnarok, they would deserve more than being listed as a "support studio" or "additional work". Monolith Soft has 250+ employees and they were also mentioned as support in multiple Nintendo games while also churning out huge games in content. Naturally, I do factor in team size. I just see no evidence that Bluepoint was 100% on Ragnarok. The evidence for the opposite is stronger.

Sony's studios with the exception of Insomniac, Asobi, and maybe Polyphony Digital have been inefficient or mismanaged this generation. Bluepoint is doing fine and it's not their fault that they worked on a GaaS. They never even truly "remade" games from the ground up as a team, so I'll cut them some slack. But you can't make an excuse for Santa Monica Studio if they did require 2 years of work from another Sony studio with a 100 developers. Did SMS really downgrade from assisting in several projects to requiring the assistance of a whole ass Sony developer?



Pretty sure Santa Monica are/where developing 2 games, a rumoured sci-fi game which was likely in development along side GOWR. So yes. They could very well require the help of another studio.



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Kyuu said:

That's more developers than I thought! If most of the team worked full time on Ragnarok, they would deserve more than being listed as a "support studio" or "additional work". Monolith Soft has 250+ employees and they were also mentioned as support in multiple Nintendo games while also churning out huge games in content. Naturally, I do factor in team size. I just see no evidence that Bluepoint was 100% on Ragnarok. The evidence for the opposite is stronger.

Sony's studios with the exception of Insomniac, Asobi, and maybe Polyphony Digital have been inefficient or mismanaged this generation. Bluepoint is doing fine and it's not their fault that they worked on a GaaS. They never even truly "remade" games from the ground up as a team, so I'll cut them some slack. But you can't make an excuse for Santa Monica Studio if they did require 2 years of work from another Sony studio with a 100 developers. Did SMS really downgrade from assisting in several projects to requiring the assistance of a whole ass Sony developer?

On the Monolith Software being support, some of these games being listed:

Tears of the Kingdom again, Monolith is listed with like a couple dozen other studios. 

Splatoon 3: they're listed with like 6 companies 

So many of these games are involving 1000's of people to some extent or another, even if it feels like that number makes no sense. A lot of those people are very part time, and it might be more like ~300 that are full time.

What evidence is there, that Bluepoint was on something else? Bluepoint doesn't have a lot of the people that are needed for an original game like a narrative director, they work with other studios. I'm hopeful it's the case that they were working on Demon's Souls PC port and other things.

>Did SMS really downgrade from assisting in several projects to requiring the assistance of a whole ass Sony developer?


Yes, that's kind of what changed over the past two generations. We've gone from games being put out by a 100 developers in 2-3 years, to a lot of these games taking 300 developers over 6 years. Hardly anyone has been immune to that, including Nintendo, and Monolith isn't in a better situation if you actually look into what is going on.