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Forums - Gaming - Might Sony go with a two-SKU strategy next-gen (like Microsoft did with Series S)?

 

Will Sony launch with two SKUs next-gen?

Yes, a regular & weaker PS6 at launch 6 17.65%
 
A PS5 Pro will be the budget option 4 11.76%
 
The PS5 will be the budget option 3 8.82%
 
PS5'll end immediately at PS6 launch 0 0%
 
No, a PS6 and later a PS6 Pro next-gen 18 52.94%
 
Yes, but the weaker one after launch 1 2.94%
 
Other (please explain in the comments) 2 5.88%
 
Total:34
Qwark said:

Why would there even be a PS6 to begin with isn't streaming the way by 2030

At least that is what we hear in VGC over the past 10 years



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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Qwark said:

Why would there even be a PS6 to begin with isn't streaming the way by 2030

This generation probably won't make it until 2030.  That would be 10 full years.  And even as streaming becomes more popular, there'll probably still be a market for consoles.  There's been a market for consoles since the 1970s, and nothing seems to change that.  Not the rise of PC gaming.  Not the rise of mobile gaming.  And, so far at least, not the rise of game streaming.  Despite it all, consoles are as popular as ever.

I stream some games to my console, and run others locally.  Some games lend themselves to streaming, such as ones that are slower, or turn-based, or are more demanding than your hardware can handle, or when fidelity just isn't crucial.  Others lend themselves to being run locally.

I predict game streaming may slow the rate at which consumers upgrade, but I don't think it'll actually stop them from doing so.  And even if you're right about game streaming taking over by 2030, we'll probably have a new generation launching sometime between 2025-2028.  By then we'll have new architectures that are vastly better that will be getting cheap enough for it to make sense.



DonFerrari said:

The only problem is actually the availability of HW. The reason PS still kept producing and supporting PS4 base for over 2 years after release of PS5 is sales of SW not HW. Due to limited availability of HW to be purchased they limiting the new titles to new HW would severely impact possible SW sales (at a time that cost to make SW is much higher than on previous gen). And if we look for some key 1st party titles it seems like 70% of their sales were already on new HW (because there is people holding on buying the title, even when there is free upgrade available, so they can play on the best hw).

For next gen I only see they cutting support short if for some reason they are able to produce a lot more HW since start of gen so they have less need to keep selling on older gen. I won't ever buy the idea of any company being purely pro customer, they are first pro profit, so the duration of support for previous gen (and even BC) will exist depending on what make more profit for them.

I think moving to a new architecture is also pro-profit, though.  The Series S is cheaper to manufacture than the One X (that they had considered potentially keeping around instead), for example.

I don't think the PS4 still being around two years later is just PS5 availability.  The PS1 stayed around for years after the PS2 came out.  The PS2 stuck around for years after the PS3 came out.  The PS3 stuck around for a time after the PS4 came out.  So, if there's no alternative budget system at the PS6 launch, why wouldn't Sony keep the PS5 around for a while too?  Not only have they not dropped the cost of the PS5 Digital, they've actually raised its price in most countries.  That price increase is not going to help them retire the PS4!  :)



At launch? Doubt it. I think we're talking about two different strategies here. MS main goal is to spread gamepass to as many customers as possible at any price point, hence why we have series S in the first place. Also it wouldn't surprise me if an additional MS' plan for the series S was to create a base platform for their future XB handheld (if AMD manages to create low power SoC with the same specs. It'd be much easier to achieve than to have series X / PS5 handheld equivalent) to spread gamepass to all of those handheld lovers (mainly in Asia) and realistically starting to compete with Switch and Steam Deck.



scrapking said:
Norion said:

Due to the success of the Series S I think it's likely they will but I hope they don't so their first party games have better minimum hardware. And I disagree about there not being a PS5 Pro since the PS4 Pro and Xbox One X were both successful and if one of them does it the other has to unless they're ok with being at a big disadvantage power wise throughout the 2nd half of the generation and I don't think Sony would be fine with that.

How do you define successful?  Neither the PS4 Pro nor the One X sold all that well.  And they were a lightning-in-a-bottle situation, since the PS4 and the Xbox One were unusually weak compared to 2013 PCs.  Add in the rapid adoption of 4K TVs, and you had two reasons to do mid-gen "Pro" consoles.

There's no indication 8K will be coming on strong anytime soon, and the Series X and PS5 aren't nearly as far behind contemporary PCs.  And the final nail in the coffin is that die-shrinks may not drive cost reductions.  They'll still occur, and they'll save space and reduce heat, but they're not predicted to also drive down costs this generation.  That's the whole reason Microsoft launched with the Series S, in fact, rather than keeping some version of the One S around until the Series X dropped in price.

Microsoft predicted the Series X won't drop in price very much.  And so far Microsoft's prediction is looking pretty good, what with Sony having actually *raised* prices of the PS5 (in every country but the U.S.) nearly two years after launch.  Last-gen that might have been a reduction in the U.S. price, rather than a price increase everywhere else.

If I have it right after the PS4 Pro launched in Japan a bit over a quarter of PS4's sold there were that model and I doubt it was drastically different from that worldwide so I'd consider that successful. For the One X I remember Mat Piscatella saying it sold well. 

They aren't as far behind but will still become low end hardware later this decade so won't be capable of 4K in an increasing number of games in the coming years which would make a more powerful revision needed for 4K in some future games and also needed for improved ray tracing since neither console is good at that.

The cost part could make it tricky though.



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Somewhat...

I feel like the ideal solution with be upgradable hardware and start with a $399 machine, that can be upgrade to a more powerful box from the get go



scrapking said:
DonFerrari said:

The only problem is actually the availability of HW. The reason PS still kept producing and supporting PS4 base for over 2 years after release of PS5 is sales of SW not HW. Due to limited availability of HW to be purchased they limiting the new titles to new HW would severely impact possible SW sales (at a time that cost to make SW is much higher than on previous gen). And if we look for some key 1st party titles it seems like 70% of their sales were already on new HW (because there is people holding on buying the title, even when there is free upgrade available, so they can play on the best hw).

For next gen I only see they cutting support short if for some reason they are able to produce a lot more HW since start of gen so they have less need to keep selling on older gen. I won't ever buy the idea of any company being purely pro customer, they are first pro profit, so the duration of support for previous gen (and even BC) will exist depending on what make more profit for them.

I think moving to a new architecture is also pro-profit, though.  The Series S is cheaper to manufacture than the One X (that they had considered potentially keeping around instead), for example.

I don't think the PS4 still being around two years later is just PS5 availability.  The PS1 stayed around for years after the PS2 came out.  The PS2 stuck around for years after the PS3 came out.  The PS3 stuck around for a time after the PS4 came out.  So, if there's no alternative budget system at the PS6 launch, why wouldn't Sony keep the PS5 around for a while too?  Not only have they not dropped the cost of the PS5 Digital, they've actually raised its price in most countries.  That price increase is not going to help them retire the PS4!  :)

Sorry but you are wrong on this.

A new architecture is more costlier to manufacture than the older one at the time of launch. MS is losing money on Series X and even more money on Series S, while Sony is about breaking even with PS5 and losing money on the digital version. Meanwhile PS4 is sold at profit for a long time now and didn't got pricecuts on the late life making the reduction in cost bring more profit on it.

I'll say again to you, the reason the systems are still manufactured and SW released for the older systems well into the gen is profit. Even on the other discussion we had you got it backwards, it isn't that Sony keeping the system under manufacture (even if in small quantity) that keeps the support of SW going or any mandate on it, it is just that the sales of SW on the older gen is still high enough for them to keep supporting and since they make profit on the older HW (which being discontinued wouldn't really open space to make the newer one since it is a different manufacturing process) they make it.

The sole reason MS discontinued Xbox 1 was that it was selling poorly and SW likely had dwindled a lot faster than PS4. This happens every gen, Sony keep manufacturing and supporting the older system longer than MS and Nintendo because the success they sustained on those systems allow for it to be alive longer.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

I predict Sony will move forward with a single SKU and its digital only. Disc drive will be add-on from now on.

Easier to manufacture just one, and less confusing for customers.



I don't think so. The most I could see Sony doing is a two-SKU approach that they did with the PS3. Perhaps they'll be a cheaper PS6 with less ports and 1 to 2 TB SSD and there will be a more expensive one with more ports and 2 to 4 TB SSD.
I don't think we'll get the digital vs. standard SKU separation that we got with the PS5. The detachable disc drive rumor is pretty likely, and I could see PS6 only being digital out of the box. They'll probably sell the disc drive separately. Heck, I think the PS5 Slim will be digital-only with a detachable disc drive sold separately.
PlayStation home consoles (with the exception of the PS3) have been the dominant ones. Yes, the Switch has outsold the PS4. But the Switch is in a weird category where it's a hybrid and indirectly competes with both the PS4 and PS5 during its life. PS1 clobbered the N64, PS2 destroyed the GameCube, PS4 annihilated the Wii U, etc. Xbox has usually lost to PlayStation as well. The bottom line, Sony doesn't need to. Microsoft needed the multiple spec approach, though.



Lifetime Sales Predictions 

Switch: 161 million (was 73 million, then 96 million, then 113 million, then 125 million, then 144 million, then 151 million, then 156 million)

PS5: 122 million (was 105 million, then 115 million) Xbox Series X/S: 38 million (was 60 million, then 67 million, then 57 million. then 48 million. then 40 million)

Switch 2: 120 million (was 116 million)

PS4: 120 mil (was 100 then 130 million, then 122 million) Xbox One: 51 mil (was 50 then 55 mil)

3DS: 75.5 mil (was 73, then 77 million)

"Let go your earthly tether, enter the void, empty and become wind." - Guru Laghima

"Sony shoud do 2 SKUs, to offer a cheaper alternative, with different options"
"No, the PS5 Digital Edition doesn't count"

Okay