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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Is Pokemon going to the right direction?

It's been headed in the wrong direction for almost 10 years at this point. Even Legends Arceus was one step forward, two steps backward. Which is one more step forward than most of the other recent games.

I've long given up on the franchise, it's clear for some time that it's become a product and that means getting media out fast. So the games have stopped trying to improve, never mind innovate, they each just come with their own gimmick that they could come up with that's quick and easy to implement. New Pokémon designs have been awful for a while too and instead of trying to put more effort in that department, they just resort to making new versions of old designs, more specifically gen 1. They want to get as many games out as quickly as possible and the way they keep interest up is by having dumb stuff that gets attention. Like a motorcycle legendary and dynamax or whatever crystal thing you say is the new gimmick, cause of course there is one. There always is.

The best hope we can have for this series is that someone else picks up the slack and makes a game that fulfills the potential Pokémon never will.




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I don't have any expectations of Gamefreak at this point. Like FIFA and Call of Duty, they favor cranking these over taking more meaningful leaps.
I envisioned a bigger grander Pokemon game as a kid when N64 was new, but I never would have imagined that in 2022, we'd still be at this point.
So I have 0 expectations of Gamefreak.

160rmf said:

You get the legendary right from the start and you can only use it to explore the world.

That seems fine to me. I'm sure you unlock it as a fighter towards the end of the game.
The only gripe I have is the aesthetics of one of them.

The other one spins.

160rmf said:

@Jules98

I see. The problem was not in using the abilities in the world, the problem was that is consuming a slot that could be using for a good ability in battle. That's pretty easy to solve, just make an extra slot for the non battle abilities (an "action" button?).

Yeah, I really hated having Pokemon be HM slaves, or it taking up a skill slot. So if it didn't, I'd be fine with those skills.

Last edited by Hiku - on 05 August 2022

Hiku said:
160rmf said:

You get the legendary right from the start and you can only use it to explore the world.

That seems fine to me. I'm sure you unlock it as a fighter towards the end of the game.
The only gripe is the aesthetics of one of them.

I phrased it wrong. What I tried to say is that you can only use this pokemon to fly, swim and ride. The other pokemons don't have any use other than battling. This legendary going to your team to battle is given.

And the fact that this pokemon is classified as legendary but everybody is riding one on the trailer is just mind-boggling 



 

 

We reap what we sow

160rmf said:

How so? Gameboy era was all about exploring pokemon world and legends by your own ways, starting with a single basic creature. The pokedex entries always tell bizarre behaviors which are basically unused when we get to the game. 

By that time you would be sure that was hardware limitations that stopped us from truly immerse on that world. But as of now they are just creating pointless gimmicks in battle and pokemons are nothing but 3d models placed randomly on a regular landscape. What's even the point to make the game 3d open world if you don't make an appealing world?

You talk about the right direction for a business corporation standingpoint, even that, it won't be good if you have the potential to reach an even wider audience but you remain with a part, even if its big in absolute numbers.

The brand is huge no doubts, but talking about the gaming aspects, it's just don't match.

Pokemon has always been about one thing collecting Pokemon and the player's interactions with them (battling and trading etc...) everything else was chopped and changed around this aspect to suit the times for the target audience of the era, this is apparent in that Pokemon only exists because of the GB transfer cable. What you think Pokemon is about was merely the team at the time applying one man's idea to the Earthbound template after all Creatures were formerly Ape the the Earthbound team, the goal was never to go down the path you're suggesting it was to always build a subculture around the collection and player interactions of Pokemon this is why more and more features over each gen focused more on interacting with Pokemon rather than what you mistook the series for this is even seen from as early as G/S onward and why newer games will even employ gimmicks.

The franchise never aimed to pushed hardware because unlike most series it always had a clear focus on what it wanted to do and who it's audience was always going to be and this continues even today hence why older fans are constantly highlighting what they don't like but the games keep doing better and better, here's something you're mistaken on Pokemon is reaching the wider market it always has been it's you who is not part of it hence why they're going the right direction on all fronts not just from a corporate view even if it means leaving some old fans behind. It may not please some to hear that but believe me that's the reality of things, brand power alone doesn't maintain the level of success Pokemon has consistently commanded since it first released.



160rmf said:
Hiku said:

That seems fine to me. I'm sure you unlock it as a fighter towards the end of the game.
The only gripe is the aesthetics of one of them.

I phrased it wrong. What I tried to say is that you can only use this pokemon to fly, swim and ride. The other pokemons don't have any use other than battling. This legendary going to your team to battle is given.

And the fact that this pokemon is classified as legendary but everybody is riding one on the trailer is just mind-boggling 

I see.
Having one Pokemon for all the traversal options and it doesn't even take up a slot in your roster (I assume, since it won't be fighting) would have been a nice solution back in the day when I was forced to carry around multiple pokemon just to have Cut/Fly etc, available.
But I suppose people may want to be able to do some of those things using some other pokemon they like.



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I honestly am not sure what is going on: though I am partially basing this on the anime and media around it as that is part of Pokemon as well. Gen 8 is very much been out of synch: Ash is running around with a Mega Lucario and using Z-Moves after all. I'm not sure how I feel about that...frankly I like Ash doing that but from a marketing perspective that cannot be ideal. Plus they handled Legends Arceus very...unusually, and in a way that seems odd. Like seriously, it sold really well but was barely featured in the anime unlike most main series games (including Let's Go)

Also I've heard that OLM, like several anime studios, are having problems. Which is partially why they may be having two recap episodes in a short span of time one last week and one next week (it may also be partially because the guys above OLM told them that no, the fans do want to see champions versus champions so please don't skip those battles).

Plus who knows whats happening elsewhere.....is Netflix still doing that live action series?



The Democratic Nintendo fan....is that a paradox? I'm fond of one of the more conservative companies in the industry, but I vote Liberally and view myself that way 90% of the time?

KrspaceT said:

I honestly am not sure what is going on: though I am partially basing this on the anime and media around it as that is part of Pokemon as well. Gen 8 is very much been out of synch: Ash is running around with a Mega Lucario and using Z-Moves after all. I'm not sure how I feel about that...frankly I like Ash doing that but from a marketing perspective that cannot be ideal. Plus they handled Legends Arceus very...unusually, and in a way that seems odd. Like seriously, it sold really well but was barely featured in the anime unlike most main series games (including Let's Go)

Also I've heard that OLM, like several anime studios, are having problems. Which is partially why they may be having two recap episodes in a short span of time one last week and one next week (it may also be partially because the guys above OLM told them that no, the fans do want to see champions versus champions so please don't skip those battles).

Plus who knows whats happening elsewhere.....is Netflix still doing that live action series?

Isn't the anime industry in a drought of animators nowadays? Too many animes being done at once and not enough seasoned animators to go around. This and the fact the pokemon generations are becoming shorter and shorter is giving the anime studios much less room to fledge out stories. That and the aimless direction of the series, that certainly doesn't help.



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Hiku said:
160rmf said:

I phrased it wrong. What I tried to say is that you can only use this pokemon to fly, swim and ride. The other pokemons don't have any use other than battling. This legendary going to your team to battle is given.

And the fact that this pokemon is classified as legendary but everybody is riding one on the trailer is just mind-boggling 

I see.
Having one Pokemon for all the traversal options and it doesn't even take up a slot in your roster (I assume, since it won't be fighting) would have been a nice solution back in the day when I was forced to carry around multiple pokemon just to have Cut/Fly etc, available.
But I suppose people may want to be able to do some of those things using some other pokemon they like.

You could say that, but is also about the sense of achievement. You are building your team, when first was merely a single basic lv 5, to do stuffs that will make you go even further in the world. Sometimes you change the team in some missions, but that's how it works a journey. It never felt like a burden to me.

But as @Wyrdness said, this is not what this franchise is about, pokemon is a TCG/Tamagotchi thing while the adventure is a plus/side stuff and I can agree with this.

But it wouldn't hurt them (it would do wonders for them actually) invest more on a game that is all about adventuring as a side project. They have to improve a lot on Legends Arceus

Last edited by 160rmf - on 06 August 2022

 

 

We reap what we sow

Wyrdness said:
160rmf said:

How so? Gameboy era was all about exploring pokemon world and legends by your own ways, starting with a single basic creature. The pokedex entries always tell bizarre behaviors which are basically unused when we get to the game. 

By that time you would be sure that was hardware limitations that stopped us from truly immerse on that world. But as of now they are just creating pointless gimmicks in battle and pokemons are nothing but 3d models placed randomly on a regular landscape. What's even the point to make the game 3d open world if you don't make an appealing world?

You talk about the right direction for a business corporation standingpoint, even that, it won't be good if you have the potential to reach an even wider audience but you remain with a part, even if its big in absolute numbers.

The brand is huge no doubts, but talking about the gaming aspects, it's just don't match.

Pokemon has always been about one thing collecting Pokemon and the player's interactions with them (battling and trading etc...) everything else was chopped and changed around this aspect to suit the times for the target audience of the era, this is apparent in that Pokemon only exists because of the GB transfer cable. What you think Pokemon is about was merely the team at the time applying one man's idea to the Earthbound template after all Creatures were formerly Ape the the Earthbound team, the goal was never to go down the path you're suggesting it was to always build a subculture around the collection and player interactions of Pokemon this is why more and more features over each gen focused more on interacting with Pokemon rather than what you mistook the series for this is even seen from as early as G/S onward and why newer games will even employ gimmicks.

The franchise never aimed to pushed hardware because unlike most series it always had a clear focus on what it wanted to do and who it's audience was always going to be and this continues even today hence why older fans are constantly highlighting what they don't like but the games keep doing better and better, here's something you're mistaken on Pokemon is reaching the wider market it always has been it's you who is not part of it hence why they're going the right direction on all fronts not just from a corporate view even if it means leaving some old fans behind. It may not please some to hear that but believe me that's the reality of things, brand power alone doesn't maintain the level of success Pokemon has consistently commanded since it first released.

While I agree with your perception about Pokemons games framework, I think you're exageritng a bit the mission/goal behind pokemon games

The focus and vision about Pokemon is to sell toys and merchandise and it's arguably a more successful interprise than selling video games. That's why Pokemon has a separate company to deal with marketing and products. Pokemon already reached the wider market way back in the 90s with anime and movies, everybody knows Pokemon and Pokemon merchan is a easy gift even for people who doesn't care at all for either gaming or animes. 

The games weren't doing any better either. They were doing about the same from the third to seventh generation, with Switch generation been the outlier because of the Switch software boom coming from people who haven't owned Nintendo handheld consoles, but this success was given to more core gamers than supposed wider audiences 

Wider audiences though are more present in other Games, like Pokemon Go and Pokemon Unite. We can see Pokemon company is succeeding bringing in casuals to platforms they don't need to pay for. 

The reason why they keep releasing generational games is to release more Pokemons (i.e. more merchan to sell) and use this new generation to keep releasing new anime, movies and having source material to keep upgrading the host of their side games 

In this sense, they can drastically change the gameplay of a mainline game and sales are very likely to not suffer much, and even if they suffer most of their source of money (merchan) will be kept intact for as long the brand still fresh and light, and Pokemon Company is pretty good are keeping Pokemon brand clean and soft.

So I'd say the reason why they never tried to changed much their formula is precisely because gaming is already secondary for them. They have the same devs from the 90s working in their host, they have no reason to pass trough the hassle and challenge of changing much when their framework keep providing content to release their animes, cards and movies. 

I will be even more blunt and say if it wasn't by Nintendo sharing the IP I could see Game Freak changing their approach to focus only on mobile games and forgetting their mainline efforts completely, but alas it's a shared IP so it won't happen. 



I don't really get the complaints about game specific gimmicks not carrying on past the game. Like, we don't need every gimmick jammed into the new games. That would be a mess, and it would remove a lot of the identity of the different games and different regions. Like, imagine you get into a battle and seven buttons pop up on screen asking you which gimmick you'd like to select for this battle/move. It would be a confusing, jumbled disaster. I do wish that all of the gimmicks were as good as Mega evolutions, but at the same time, I would much rather each Pokemon game focus on doing something new (ideally with a limited Dex focusing on new and regional pokemon) than every game just being a messy grab bag of every gimmick they've ever come up with.

There are plenty of issues with modern Pokemon games, but the fact that they don't have Z-Moves is not one of them.