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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - CONTROVERSIAL OPINION: Characters to Remove and Replace in The Next Smash Bros.

Dulfite said:

I actually hope Ultimate is the final Smash of Phase 1, if you will, and that the next Smash is a long way away and revolutionizes the genre with many new features, modes, better online, story, etc. Because of this, and to make it really feel like a phase 2 rather than just another Smash sequel, I hope that they eliminate all characters from games not available on Switch (Nintendo or third party) or the next device. I want the roster to feel next gen just as much as the features. Cut everything pre-Switch unless they are making a game for it in Switch 2, then freely release said character around launch of their new game to hype it up alongside Smash. Let Ultimate be the end of Super Smash Bros. Let the next game be the beginning of Ultra Instinct Smash Bros.

In some way I agree with this. I know this is a rather unpopular opinion but I don't want a new Smash game very soon. It can take a good decade, or even longer. Smash Ultimate is already packed to the brim. I imagine the next game to be much smaller but trimmed from all the fat. However, for this to work out there needs to be a large gap in between, otherwise it would feel cheap and half-assed. Also, let's look at the concept of Smash, an arena brawler. Does this game need cutting edge technology? It can easily stay relevant on the market for a long time, even on the next Nintendo system. Especially at the current rate of diminishing returns in graphical capability. So yeah, I don't want a new Smash very soon. Also, let's give Sakurai his damn break already and let him do something new. He does great things when he wants to. Let him enjoy a breath of fresh air for once.

PAOerfulone said:

We're going to get A LOT of cuts in Smash 6, and not nearly enough new fighters.

For those thinking that we're going to get 70-80-90 fighters and basically Ultimate 2.0...
It's not gonna happen.
Ultimate was a once in a lifetime experience that we will likely never see again.

Most of the 3rd parties, a lot of older and obscure fighters are going to get cut and each Smash Bros. game moving forward is going to be a screenshot of what is relevant and big in video gaming AT THAT SPECIFIC point in time.

For example: A lot of Fire Emblem reps are going to get cut and all we're going to get for that franchise will be Marth (face of the franchise), Lucina (Marth's echo), Ike (most popular character), and whoever the main character for the next FE game is. Same deal with Pokemon. Reps like Greninja, Incineroar, and Lucario will be long gone and we're most likely going to have Pikachu, Jigglypuff, maybe Mewtwo, and the evolved form of one of the starters for that console's Pokemon game.

The only characters that are going to be safe and stay in Smash no matter what are the original 12 fighters.

Outside of that, you'll have some very popular staple characters in the franchises that will most likely stick around like Mario - Peach and Bowser; Zelda - Zelda and Ganondorf; And then, some of the popular, more Nintendo-associated 3rd party reps like Sonic, Bayonetta, and Mega Man.

After that, it's pretty much a guessing game as to who will be on a potential Smash 6 roster. But I can tell you right now, in terms of roster size, it's going to be a HUGE downgrade from Ultimate.

I agree. The roster is pretty inflated and could easily be downsized. A new Smash game is probably going to be smaller instead of bigger, at least that's what I think.

peachbuggy said:

Actually partially agree with the OP. There should be more Nintendo characters and less 3rd parties.

But please no Waluigi.



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GoOnKid said:
Dulfite said:

I actually hope Ultimate is the final Smash of Phase 1, if you will, and that the next Smash is a long way away and revolutionizes the genre with many new features, modes, better online, story, etc. Because of this, and to make it really feel like a phase 2 rather than just another Smash sequel, I hope that they eliminate all characters from games not available on Switch (Nintendo or third party) or the next device. I want the roster to feel next gen just as much as the features. Cut everything pre-Switch unless they are making a game for it in Switch 2, then freely release said character around launch of their new game to hype it up alongside Smash. Let Ultimate be the end of Super Smash Bros. Let the next game be the beginning of Ultra Instinct Smash Bros.

In some way I agree with this. I know this is a rather unpopular opinion but I don't want a new Smash game very soon. It can take a good decade, or even longer. Smash Ultimate is already packed to the brim. I imagine the next game to be much smaller but trimmed from all the fat. However, for this to work out there needs to be a large gap in between, otherwise it would feel cheap and half-assed. Also, let's look at the concept of Smash, an arena brawler. Does this game need cutting edge technology? It can easily stay relevant on the market for a long time, even on the next Nintendo system. Especially at the current rate of diminishing returns in graphical capability. So yeah, I don't want a new Smash very soon. Also, let's give Sakurai his damn break already and let him do something new. He does great things when he wants to. Let him enjoy a breath of fresh air for once.

PAOerfulone said:

We're going to get A LOT of cuts in Smash 6, and not nearly enough new fighters.

For those thinking that we're going to get 70-80-90 fighters and basically Ultimate 2.0...
It's not gonna happen.
Ultimate was a once in a lifetime experience that we will likely never see again.

Most of the 3rd parties, a lot of older and obscure fighters are going to get cut and each Smash Bros. game moving forward is going to be a screenshot of what is relevant and big in video gaming AT THAT SPECIFIC point in time.

For example: A lot of Fire Emblem reps are going to get cut and all we're going to get for that franchise will be Marth (face of the franchise), Lucina (Marth's echo), Ike (most popular character), and whoever the main character for the next FE game is. Same deal with Pokemon. Reps like Greninja, Incineroar, and Lucario will be long gone and we're most likely going to have Pikachu, Jigglypuff, maybe Mewtwo, and the evolved form of one of the starters for that console's Pokemon game.

The only characters that are going to be safe and stay in Smash no matter what are the original 12 fighters.

Outside of that, you'll have some very popular staple characters in the franchises that will most likely stick around like Mario - Peach and Bowser; Zelda - Zelda and Ganondorf; And then, some of the popular, more Nintendo-associated 3rd party reps like Sonic, Bayonetta, and Mega Man.

After that, it's pretty much a guessing game as to who will be on a potential Smash 6 roster. But I can tell you right now, in terms of roster size, it's going to be a HUGE downgrade from Ultimate.

I agree. The roster is pretty inflated and could easily be downsized. A new Smash game is probably going to be smaller instead of bigger, at least that's what I think.

peachbuggy said:

Actually partially agree with the OP. There should be more Nintendo characters and less 3rd parties.

But please no Waluigi.

Yeah, I'd love for Nintendo to do an HD port of Kid Icarus Uprising yo Switch while Sakari works on two sequels. Give me a Kid Icarus Trilogy with all that story, humor, and glorious combat! Then he can make the next Smash in 2031.



CaptainExplosion said:
Kakadu18 said:

Wouldn't make much sense with most of them for Nintendo. Who's Black Shadow?

Antagonist from F-Zero.

Leynos said:

Fuck this topic. Waluigi DESERVES DEATH! Fucking the worst thing to ever come from Nintendo. Keep Bayonetta and Joker FOREVER! How do I downvote topics and when can I be a mod to ban this person for this topic? I will have the Government ban their internet for life.

Try that and I will hold your head in a microwave at full blast until your head is nothing but a burned skull.

PAOerfulone said:

"Cut Bayonetta" - Not gonna happen. She's damn near 1st party at this point. As close as you could get without Nintendo outright owning the IP. She and Sonic are the only two 3rd party characters I think are completely safe. 

"Replace with Shantae" - This is even less likely. I would love to see Shantae get a spot on the roster, but if she's gonna take someone's spot, it ain't gonna be Bayonetta's.

-----------------

"Cut Hero" - Japan would like a word with you.

"Replace with Zero" - They're not gonna do that when we already have Mega Man as the ideal rep. They're just going to keep him as an Assist Trophy and a Mii Fighter costume.

------------------

"Cut Steve" - Oh good luck with that one. Given how big Minecraft is and how big of a deal his inclusion was, I think there's a bigger chance he stays than goes.

"Replace with Waluigi" - FUCK NO! FFS, what is people's infatuation with Waluigi?!? He's a useless sack of crap! I'd rather see Captain Toad get in over Waluigi, at least he does something!

------------------

"Cut Sora" - This is one of the few I agree with. Nothing against Sora as a fighter or character, I like him just fine. But given the shit Nintendo and Sakurai had to go through with Disney just to get him in, I'm thinking that this is a "one and done" type deal. Sorry, Sora fans.

"Replace with Isaac" - Only way I see that happening is if they are making a new GoldenSun game, which I highly doubt. If anything, this would be the spot that Shantae would take in order to get into Smash. 

-------------------

"Cut Terry"

"Replace with Dixie Kong"

Sure why not.

-------------------

"Cut Kazuya"

"Replace with Black Shadow"

Who? OH YEAH, that dude from F-Zero. Yeah, much like GoldenSun, the only way that happens is if they make a new F-Zero game, which the chances of that happening are next to none.

--------------------

"Cut Cloud"

"Replace with Urbosa"

...

------------

"Cut Sephiroth"

"Replace with Ghirahim"

You got something against Square Enix or something?

----------------------------

"Cut Joker" NO! ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOT!!!

"Replace with Dr. Eggman" - Give him Waluigi's invitation if you want him in that bad! But you leave Joker ALONE!!!!

People actually WANTED Joker? Seriously, name someone besides you and Leynos (Whom I might have to run down with a freight train if he tries anything with me) who actually wanted some random anime pretty boy douchebag.

Hero I'd say has gotta go because of reasons I won't say, the other Square Enix characters are more based on the assumption that  Terry because his franchise is now half-owned by a war criminal, Shantae because she's actually attractive while Bayonetta's just some demonic slut, and Kuntzuya because his trailer pissed me off big time for how it treated Captain Falcon AND he reduced Shantae to a Mii costume, which has become an even bigger insult to characters wanted for Smash Bros. than being an Assist Trophy.

mZuzek said:

This is one of those you'd just write off as a joke thread until you see who made it.

*skins mZuzek and wears him as a hat*

I don't have a skull  I'm a mech. All your microwave would do is blow up because of me.  Besides All the characters you want to cut are the only reason I own the game. If it's just lame ass Nintendo characters it's boring as fuck and takes Nintendo back when they were dull like the N64 and Gamecube era. Nintendo's worst eras. Switch and games like Smash are so appealing because for once Nintendo is not just appealing to Nintendo die hards which sorry to break it to you,not enough to keep a system successful. Wii U proved that. So unless you want another Wii U, you gotta let Nintendo and it's series expand.



Bite my shiny metal cockpit!

Dulfite said:
peachbuggy said:

Actually partially agree with the OP. There should be more Nintendo characters and less 3rd parties.

I'd be fine with it if all the new characters came from sub genres (like Rawk Hawk from Paper Mario) or untouched ips they own that have no representative so far. But having 5+ characters each from Pokemon, Fire Emblem... is such a waste.

I'd have characters like Karate Joe (Rhythm heaven), Chibi Robo, Legendary Starfy and maybe something retro like Mike Jones (Startropics) oh and Paper Mario definitely.



DON'T WIN ME CHIBI BUDDY DON'T WIN ME.

ANIMAL CROSSING NEW LEAF FRIEND CODE:- 5129 1175 1029. MESSAGE ME.
ANDY MURRAY:- GRAND SLAM WINNER!

In my opinion the N64 was not just the best console of the 5th gen but, to this day the best console ever created!

CE also needs to stop with the cringe shit with the "sticks head in the microwave" or whatever that shit is. He does it every time he disagrees with them. He has some fantasy violence. I half expecting he does a robot voice when he types it' Remember JP from Grandma's Boy? No one liked JP. Stop acting like JP.



Bite my shiny metal cockpit!

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This is relevant: https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2021/12/a-new-smash-bros-would-need-a-smaller-roster-admits-sakurai#reply



I'll just leave this here



With how big Ultimate is, I foresee Nintendo skipping this series one generation just so that they can reset it. Fans could get mad, sure, but it'll give us a break from this game until we start to miss it, and settle for a reset. I'd say skip Switch 2.0 and restart with the next gen after that.

As far as Waluigi go, I doubt he'll ever be in this game as a fighter. Although, knowing how trollish Nintendo can be/get, I would really like to see a surprise add and show that Master Hand(s) are actually Waluigi's hands.



PSwii60 said:

With how big Ultimate is, I foresee Nintendo skipping this series one generation just so that they can reset it. Fans could get mad, sure, but it'll give us a break from this game until we start to miss it, and settle for a reset. I'd say skip Switch 2.0 and restart with the next gen after that.

As far as Waluigi go, I doubt he'll ever be in this game as a fighter. Although, knowing how trollish Nintendo can be/get, I would really like to see a surprise add and show that Master Hand(s) are actually Waluigi's hands.

I'm having a hard time seeing Nintendo skipping a generation on a series that has sold 25+ million units in its latest iteration and is guaranteed to move consoles, not to mention helps justify a paid online service. It's not about fans getting mad, it's about money left on the table and consoles left on store shelves.



PSwii60 said:

With how big Ultimate is, I foresee Nintendo skipping this series one generation just so that they can reset it. Fans could get mad, sure, but it'll give us a break from this game until we start to miss it, and settle for a reset. I'd say skip Switch 2.0 and restart with the next gen after that.

As far as Waluigi go, I doubt he'll ever be in this game as a fighter. Although, knowing how trollish Nintendo can be/get, I would really like to see a surprise add and show that Master Hand(s) are actually Waluigi's hands.

I think that long of a gap is really unrealistic unless Nintendo really wants to gamble and go the GTA V route with Ultimate. 

Switch 2 won't come out until at least 2023, and 2024 is looking pretty likely. So if we only get an enhanced port of Ultimate on Switch 2, that means we'll have to wait until 2030 at least for Ultimate's sequel on Switch 3. 

Nintendo hit a gold mine with Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, but there's no guarantee that would work with Ultimate. Also keep in mind the base version of MK8 was on Wii U. While it had a fantastic attach rate for the Wii U, the Wii U was a failure. Ultimate is a new game on a smash hit (pun intended) piece of hardware. I don't know if Ultimate DX on Switch 2 would equal or even sell 67% of what Ultimate's lifetime sales will be. 

It's realistic that fighters are going to be cut. Third-parties aren't going to give the Smash team and Nintendo rights in perpetuity for their characters in every future Smash installment. I think the only third party characters in it for the long haul (or close to it) are Sonic, Mega Man, and Pac-Man. There's also plenty of dead-weight on the first-party side like Pichu, Dr. Mario, Wii Fit Trainer, Duck Hunt, and others. 



Lifetime Sales Predictions 

Switch: 156 million (was 73, then 96, then 113 million, then 125 million, then 144 million, then 151 million)

PS5: 115 million (was 105 million) Xbox Series S/X: 48 million (was 60 million, then 67 million, then 57 million)

PS4: 120 mil (was 100 then 130 million, then 122 million) Xbox One: 51 mil (was 50 then 55 mil)

3DS: 75.5 mil (was 73, then 77 million)

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