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Forums - Gaming Discussion - CD Projekt Red Making 6 Day Work Weeks Mandatory Leading Up To Launch

I really do think if companies followed Nintendo's model devs wouldn't have these crunch times. Metroid Prime is an exception that doesn't count as it shifted to an entirely different developer after being announced. Most publishers announce games 2-3 years out (if AAA), and then everyone focuses on them so much that when those devs need more time they have to crunch to appease impatient fans, which isn't healthy. Nintendo announces and releases most of their games within 2-9 months, when they are already programmed and are just in minor adjustments phase. We didn't know Oragami King was even being made until they announced it would release in two months lol. This model would stress out devs a lot less, as studios wouldn't feel pressure from fans to "just release the game." And Nintendo sales are an indicator that quality games don't need 2-3 years of hype to sell.



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Personally I don't like when a company does crunch time. It generally means miss management between the devs and higher ups. At the same time though, I also understand when companies gotta do it at a temporary measure to meet certain deadlines. It sucks but it does happen even with the company that I work for but very rarely. So for me, as long as it's not the norm and the people are getting paid fairly with hopefully bonuses at the end and majority of the devs agreed to it, I can understand it.



                  

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Srex117 said:
I am maybe in minority here but i rly dont care about that. Most of developers work when they want to work and nobody force them, only when game is close to release they work harder. So out of 60 months (counting from Witcher 3 release) they maybe worked 3-4 months harder while the other 56-57 they maybe worker few hours per day at best.

Have you ever type a piece of software code in your life to say this ?

There are reasons why teams are most productive by the end of dev cycle. Do you think all technical knowledge, business logic, risks, infrastructure constraints and system specifications are set and well defined since beginning of project?

As long there is time they will ask you to rework on your code as much as they can. Only when managers and product owners finally realize that have a deadline they stop and settle what the fuck devs really need to do



Srex117 said:
I am maybe in minority here but i rly dont care about that. Most of developers work when they want to work and nobody force them, only when game is close to release they work harder. So out of 60 months (counting from Witcher 3 release) they maybe worked 3-4 months harder while the other 56-57 they maybe worker few hours per day at best.

Hmm... That doesn't sound realistic.

Most of your developers keeping their jobs by doing fuck all for most of the development time?

Na.



IcaroRibeiro said:
vivster said:

Many other video game studios don’t pay for overtime.

Is it even legal? 

Somewhat, game development studio, when they don't want to pay for overtime, do not hire developers but contract them. This do bypass many obligation laid out by labor code.



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That sounds like Crunch.... honestly these project leaders just need to extend project time tables instead.
That said, if it needs it to get done in time, and its launching reguardless (at a fixed date).... I rather have the crunch than not.

Too many games launch buggy and not as polished as is needed.
Sadly instead of takeing their time to work things out (properly), usually they rush and rely on crunch to get it done last minuet.

I feel like if your a good enough developer, you shouldn't be so fixated on time tables and launch dates/periodes.
Just let the game be done, when its done and then launch it. If its polished and well enough done, it will sell reguardless of what date it launches.



mZuzek said:
Dulfite said:
I really do think if companies followed Nintendo's model devs wouldn't have these crunch times. Metroid Prime is an exception that doesn't count as it shifted to an entirely different developer after being announced. Most publishers announce games 2-3 years out (if AAA), and then everyone focuses on them so much that when those devs need more time they have to crunch to appease impatient fans, which isn't healthy. Nintendo announces and releases most of their games within 2-9 months, when they are already programmed and are just in minor adjustments phase. We didn't know Oragami King was even being made until they announced it would release in two months lol. This model would stress out devs a lot less, as studios wouldn't feel pressure from fans to "just release the game." And Nintendo sales are an indicator that quality games don't need 2-3 years of hype to sell.

I highly doubt Nintendo doesn't do crunch. We just don't hear about it because it's commonplace in Japan.

Well if they do it isn't because of public pressure. When people don't know something is coming, it's hard to demand updates or the release of that something. Public ignorance is a developer's bliss.



Srex117 said:
I am maybe in minority here but i rly dont care about that. Most of developers work when they want to work and nobody force them, only when game is close to release they work harder. So out of 60 months (counting from Witcher 3 release) they maybe worked 3-4 months harder while the other 56-57 they maybe worker few hours per day at best.

It's mandatory. So its do this or get fired. I think thats the problem here imo. CD actually promised that Cyberpunk would not have crunch, so they better compensate their staff appropriately and figure out if anything could be done to avoid it in future. Sustained overtime (i.e weeks of it) always sucks and is always unhealthy, I think CDs commitment to trying to avoid it is the right direction even if they failed this time round.

Honestly its one of the better crunch conditions layed out if people are allowed to stick to core hours within those working days (9-5), but there yeah people have the right to kick up a fuss if they love the job but want better work conditions/rights. 



IcaroRibeiro said:
vivster said:

Many other video game studios don’t pay for overtime.

Is it even legal? 

I guess it depends on the country. But generally, in one way or another, overtime must be retributed. It can be paid with money (and normally extra hours are worth more than regular hours), or it can be retributed with days off equivalent to the total hours of overtime. 

Also, overtime is generally optional. Nobody can make you put extra hours if you don't want. There are a few exceptions, like if they are pacted between the worker and the employer or if they are included in the company's collective agreement... Or cases of natural catastrophes. If... I don't know... Some heavy rains flooded your workplace, the boss can make you put extra hours in order to be able to get the company back on track. 

Also, it should be noted that overtime cannot exceed a certain number of hours a year, and hours have to be distributed in a certain way for the week, because a worker normally cannot work more than X hours a week. 

The problem is... From what I can gather, since 2013, Poland (which is where CD Projekt comes from) has become a very shitty country to work in. Because they changed how overtime works, companies can make you work a crap ton of extra hours for a very long period of time, make them pass as extraordinary in order to make you not be able to deny... And then when everything is said and done and you are half dead (so to speak), they give you days off.



Ka-pi96 said:
It's not really mandatory... what are they going to do if you don't show up on the 6th day? They won't fire you since they're clearly desperate for manpower. They're pretty powerless here, plus you'd think an EU country would have laws preventing employess from getting fired for refusing to work overtime anyway.

Would be even better if they'd unionise. If a big chunk of their staff were to turn around and say "do that and we'll stop coming to work full stop" and they'd likely never demand something like this again.

They will fire you after development ends, they don't need to justify it at all 

Or just sabotage your career progression until you get pissed and ask to resign

Whatever comes first