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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Jimquisition about movie comparisons, crunch and TLOU2

d21lewis said:
Darashiva said:

He hasn't given scores to games in at least a few years now.

Not a serious score, at least. I watched his Gears 5 review where he gave the game nonstop praise and at the end he said "but it's from Microsoft so 2/10" or something like that.

Yeah, he still occasionally makes jokes at the expense of people who got angry at his review scores in the past, usually when he's talking about exclusive games.



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RolStoppable said:
Mordred11 said:

     Why are you being so vocal of a game you haven't played? How can you say TLOU2 is a step back for videogames as a medium without having played the game? Because you read up the story and you watched some cutscenes?

      I don't agree with this video at all because there shouldn't be boundaries on how a story is told. If a specific approach is the best for that story to be told, then so be it. This is becoming a world where everyone is critical of everything, even people who didn't give those things a chance.

mnementh explained it already, but it's not even necessary to have read up on the story of The Last of Us Part II to know that it isn't high quality movie level, because AAA games don't go beyond the depth of a popcorn movie. Whenever video game journalists go out of their way to portray video games as an art form, they usually get caught up in comparisons that make gamers come across as delusional to people outside of gaming. It's the completely wrong approach to garner broader acceptance.

A wrong, deeply misinformed statement in regards to TLOU2 and my love for movies is beyond that of videogames. The way this game portrays pain and how even the best of people can succumb to pain is unlike anything I've seen in a movie form.



His video, while on form with his usual stuff raised a question for me.

What is considered a good video game story? Instead of moaning that video game stories are crap compared to some films, what are good stand out stories in games that show what a game can produce, so that story in games can be compared to other games. For every great movie story, there are 50 books that are better. For every pun filled super-hero film, there are 15 graphic novels that outshine them. You can't compare different mediums stories against each other as how they are told and portrayed are so different.

Video game medium is still hung up on the idea it's entertainment media has to be compared to that of films because films are still more popular as an entertainment media even if games make more money.



Hmm, pie.

Mordred11 said:
RolStoppable said:

mnementh explained it already, but it's not even necessary to have read up on the story of The Last of Us Part II to know that it isn't high quality movie level, because AAA games don't go beyond the depth of a popcorn movie. Whenever video game journalists go out of their way to portray video games as an art form, they usually get caught up in comparisons that make gamers come across as delusional to people outside of gaming. It's the completely wrong approach to garner broader acceptance.

A wrong, deeply misinformed statement in regards to TLOU2 and my love for movies is beyond that of videogames. The way this game portrays pain and how even the best of people can succumb to pain is unlike anything I've seen in a movie form.

TLOU 2 has about as much thematic depth as BvS. It has pretensions of being some intellectual think piece but has as much depth as a puddle. Have you never seen or read anything on the cycle of revenge before, this version isn't even well done it's so basic and has nothing of note to add.



Darashiva said:

Yeah, he still occasionally makes jokes at the expense of people who got angry at his review scores in the past, usually when he's talking about exclusive games.

I think it was mainly because of Nintendo fans after he gave Breath of the Wild a 7/10. He then gave scoreless reviews for a while now mostly give them as random score at the end as a joke.



Hmm, pie.

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The Fury said:
His video, while on form with his usual stuff raised a question for me.

What is considered a good video game story? Instead of moaning that video game stories are crap compared to some films, what are good stand out stories in games that show what a game can produce, so that story in games can be compared to other games. For every great movie story, there are 50 books that are better. For every pun filled super-hero film, there are 15 graphic novels that outshine them. You can't compare different mediums stories against each other as how they are told and portrayed are so different.

Video game medium is still hung up on the idea it's entertainment media has to be compared to that of films because films are still more popular as an entertainment media even if games make more money.

Just think of games that tell a story in a way that only a video game could or is improved because it is a videogame. The issue with so many videogame stories is ludonarrative dissonance. TLOU 2 has a big issue where it's trying to say revenge and killing is bad while also having you slaughter hundreds of people throughout the game.



The Fury said:
His video, while on form with his usual stuff raised a question for me.

What is considered a good video game story?

Nier Automata



Bite my shiny metal cockpit!

pikashoe said:

Just think of games that tell a story in a way that only a video game could or is improved because it is a videogame. The issue with so many videogame stories is ludonarrative dissonance. TLOU 2 has a big issue where it's trying to say revenge and killing is bad while also having you slaughter hundreds of people throughout the game.

But that's ND's thing. You really think the organisations, people or even Nathan drake himself would not be affected by the mindless slaughter of over 3000 people he kills in the games? :P By Uncharted 4, Nadine is getting it. It's just not worth it. Gameplay and Story are always basically a separate thing in Uncharted. TLoU actually made it less so, as you needed to get past the clickers and were being hunted by cannibals.

The issue I have with many people in this argument about this game is that TLoU was a game about f***ed up humans and their ways after a mass apocalyptic thing, and by the sounds of it TLoU2 is no different. The story, even if it's bad, is actually on point if that's the case. 

But it still doesn't give examples of actually good stories in video games. It's hard as you have to do the ludonarrative dissonance in some games for it to work. Yet we have games like Witcher or Horizon where it's gameplay works with the story because of the way the narrative is told. 

Last edited by The Fury - on 23 June 2020

Hmm, pie.

The Fury said:
Darashiva said:

Yeah, he still occasionally makes jokes at the expense of people who got angry at his review scores in the past, usually when he's talking about exclusive games.

I think it was mainly because of Nintendo fans after he gave Breath of the Wild a 7/10. He then gave scoreless reviews for a while now mostly give them as random score at the end as a joke.

Undertale? I mean... I'm aware that in the grand scheme of things the story itself it's nothing that can compare to the great icons of the movie industry. However, because its a videogame and the story and characters react and evolve because of your actions during gameplay, this "simple" plot gets a lot more meaningful and emotional than any movie or book could convey. Basically because it becomes personal.



Mordred11 said:
RolStoppable said:

mnementh explained it already, but it's not even necessary to have read up on the story of The Last of Us Part II to know that it isn't high quality movie level, because AAA games don't go beyond the depth of a popcorn movie. Whenever video game journalists go out of their way to portray video games as an art form, they usually get caught up in comparisons that make gamers come across as delusional to people outside of gaming. It's the completely wrong approach to garner broader acceptance.

A wrong, deeply misinformed statement in regards to TLOU2 and my love for movies is beyond that of videogames. The way this game portrays pain and how even the best of people can succumb to pain is unlike anything I've seen in a movie form.

I was going to write a response, but then I saw this:
https://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9171274

Mordred11 said:

     Like I said in another thread, the game sits at 8.5/10 for me after finishing it, but this is coming from someone who deems the first game as the greatest game of all time. This takes such a different route from what I expected all these years and it's impossible not to feel frustrated at times, it occasionally takes the enjoyment out of the playthrough because it becomes something more than just another videogame. It becomes the best character study I've ever seen in a game and it transcends the medium to a point where it surpasses even some of the best movies out there with similar themes.

     To me, someone who played the first TLOU 5 times, TLOU2 cannot be more than a 8.5/10. However, in terms of what this game achieves with all of its elements and craftsmanship combined, it is beyond giving it a score. You don't give a painting a score because there will be times when a painting will make you feel nothing and times when that same painting will unravel the emotions in you. I will not be replaying this game any time soon, probably ever. And that is fine, because I will never forget it.

Schindler's List.



Legend11 correctly predicted that GTA IV (360+PS3) would outsell SSBB. I was wrong.

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