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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Series milking old games and dependant on nostalgia way too much ?

DonFerrari said:
AHYL88 said:

I mentioned that certain people on this thread did, I did not state the OP. I won't deny that Nintendo do milk certain franchises a tad, but at the same time, we can't be ignorant and lump only them when there has been so many other games that have been remade or remastered for this generation.

You said "people here". And your argument was in defense of Nintendo, like for you to accept saying Nintendo that person needs to list all companies that done it? OP is very clear on this being something the market in general have been doing and people gave examples they remembered. Still you didn't took offense that he basically only listed Square Enix.

Apologies my bad, I got too worked up too easily and it clouded my thinking too much. I've calmed down now. I'll have to say generally, yes Square Enix does milk Final Fantasy a lot. But my personal big offender is Sega with the Sonic franchise.

Sega milks the Sonic franchise far too much, while also pandering and heavily relying on nostalgia with general themes and designs (levels, enemies, even boss fights) being rehashed and reused so many times (how many variations of Green Hill Zone have we had?). And yet they aren't able to be consistently successful with the franchise nowadays (besides the brilliant but fan developed Sonic Mania) while leaving so many of their own franchises and IPs (Jet Set Radio, Skies of Arcadia, House of the Dead, Crazy Taxi and much more) locked up and dormant, barely even given a chance to at least develop further or get a sequel. 

Last edited by AHYL88 - on 10 June 2020

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Capcom with the Resident Evil Series. They've just about remade and or remastered every game in the series up to 5.

I'm guessing they are now working on a remake of RE4.



AHYL88 said:
DonFerrari said:

You said "people here". And your argument was in defense of Nintendo, like for you to accept saying Nintendo that person needs to list all companies that done it? OP is very clear on this being something the market in general have been doing and people gave examples they remembered. Still you didn't took offense that he basically only listed Square Enix.

Apologies my bad, I got too worked up too easily and it clouded my thinking too much. I've calmed down now. I'll have to say generally, yes Square Enix does milk Final Fantasy a lot. But my personal big offender is Sega with the Sonic franchise.

Sega milks the Sonic franchise far too much, while also pandering and heavily relying on nostalgia with general themes and designs (levels, enemies, even boss fights) being rehashed and reused so many times (how many variations of Green Hill Zone have we had?). And yet they aren't able to be consistently successful with the franchise nowadays (besides the brilliant but fan developed Sonic Mania) while leaving so many of their own franchises and IPs (Jet Set Radio, Skies of Arcadia, House of the Dead, Crazy Taxi and much more) locked up and dormant, barely even given a chance to at least develop further or get a sequel. 

The worse part on Sonic is that they generally don't even make good games. I totally understand Nintendo milking their franchises and character because it add sales and they don't let the quality drop because of it (and generally each serie have one or at most two entries in a gen). I don't even know if they are variations or the same level with new textures (Green Hill Zone, but I do love the level and music).



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
Mandalore76 said:

What?  The Wii U may have been Nintendo's biggest home console flop in terms of sales, but it wasn't for lack of trying on their part.  Poor branding and poor advertising early on, yes.  But "dropped like a red hot ball of iron" is being disingenuous.  

System Release:  November 18, 2012
Discontinued:      January 31, 2017

Some notable Nintendo developed or published games released in 3 year or later:

Mario Tennis Ultra Smash (2015)
Splatoon (2015) released in 3rd year of console's life as a brand new IP and launched a hugely successful new franchise.
Super Mario Maker was released September 10, 2015 and I remember a huge effort to push it with Wii U bundles in the 2015 holiday season.
Yoshi's Wooly World (2015)
The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess HD (2016)
Star Fox Guard/Zero (2016)
Tokyo Mirage Sessions #FE (2016)
Paper Mario Color Splash (2016)
The Legend of Zelda:  Breath of the Wild (2017) released 2 months after the console was officially discontinued. 

Nintendo also made an effort to collaborate with other devs to share IP's such as with Koei Tecmo on Hyrule Warriors and with Atlus on the aforementioned Tokyo Mirage Sessions.  They also made an effort to publish games for other devs to bring exclusives to the Wii U at the time such as The Wonderful 101 and Bayonetta 2.

3rd Party developers may have dumped out of releasing games for the Wii U a year into its lifespan (EA never released another Madden NFL on the system after Madden 13 in 2012), but implying that Nintendo abandoned it just as quickly is highly selective memory.  

4 years and 3 months isn't a long console life by any stretch, but there have been worse.  The Dreamcast released in NA on September 9, 1999 and was discontinued on March 31, 2001.  That's less than 2 years (still less than 3 years even if you had the 1998 Japan release).

Sony may not have officially discontinued the PlayStation Vita until 2019, but what efforts did they make to support the system beyond mid-2014 (two years into the systems life)?

Funny thing, a friend of mine that is a big Nintendo fan even while owning all consoles have his favorite console as WiiU.

I believe it.  It was honestly a much better system than people give it credit for.  I also have around 40 physical games for it.  EA may have only released 1 Madden NFL on it as I said, but my friend and I still play it to this day (well up until the stay home orders the pandemic brought on).  Having a touch screen that I can draw hot routes on for my receivers at the line of scrimmage was an amazing innovation, and you can do the same with making changes on the fly to blitz packages or coverage on defense.  Aside from the gaming aspect, I also used the Wii U gamepad as my default web browser for years.  Larger screen than my phone, and easier to just pick-up the Gamepad from right next to me to look something up than to get up and turn on my PC and pull out my keyboard and mouse.  It was also my go to for Netflix and YouTube for a long time before I upgraded to a smart TV a couple of years ago.  Some of the Gamepad lives on in the form factor & touchscreen utility of the Nintendo Switch in portable mode, so I'm glad that Nintendo managed to successfully merge the two states (console & portable).  



Mandalore76 said:
DonFerrari said:

Funny thing, a friend of mine that is a big Nintendo fan even while owning all consoles have his favorite console as WiiU.

I believe it.  It was honestly a much better system than people give it credit for.  I also have around 40 physical games for it.  EA may have only released 1 Madden NFL on it as I said, but my friend and I still play it to this day (well up until the stay home orders the pandemic brought on).  Having a touch screen that I can draw hot routes on for my receivers at the line of scrimmage was an amazing innovation, and you can do the same with making changes on the fly to blitz packages or coverage on defense.  Aside from the gaming aspect, I also used the Wii U gamepad as my default web browser for years.  Larger screen than my phone, and easier to just pick-up the Gamepad from right next to me to look something up than to get up and turn on my PC and pull out my keyboard and mouse.  It was also my go to for Netflix and YouTube for a long time before I upgraded to a smart TV a couple of years ago.  Some of the Gamepad lives on in the form factor & touchscreen utility of the Nintendo Switch in portable mode, so I'm glad that Nintendo managed to successfully merge the two states (console & portable).  

There is so many good stuff you can do with the touchscreen on WiiU (or touchpad on PS4) but because of it not being industry standard almost no one cared to use that is sad. And there haven't been a NHL game for Switch yet? Because I believe similar stuff could be done on it.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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DonFerrari said:
Mandalore76 said:

I believe it.  It was honestly a much better system than people give it credit for.  I also have around 40 physical games for it.  EA may have only released 1 Madden NFL on it as I said, but my friend and I still play it to this day (well up until the stay home orders the pandemic brought on).  Having a touch screen that I can draw hot routes on for my receivers at the line of scrimmage was an amazing innovation, and you can do the same with making changes on the fly to blitz packages or coverage on defense.  Aside from the gaming aspect, I also used the Wii U gamepad as my default web browser for years.  Larger screen than my phone, and easier to just pick-up the Gamepad from right next to me to look something up than to get up and turn on my PC and pull out my keyboard and mouse.  It was also my go to for Netflix and YouTube for a long time before I upgraded to a smart TV a couple of years ago.  Some of the Gamepad lives on in the form factor & touchscreen utility of the Nintendo Switch in portable mode, so I'm glad that Nintendo managed to successfully merge the two states (console & portable).  

There is so many good stuff you can do with the touchscreen on WiiU (or touchpad on PS4) but because of it not being industry standard almost no one cared to use that is sad. And there haven't been a NHL game for Switch yet? Because I believe similar stuff could be done on it.

No NHL, no Madden...  EA limited their support to a couple of FIFA releases and that was it.  It's a shame, because the 2K ports of NBA have been excellent on the Switch.



Mandalore76 said:
DonFerrari said:

There is so many good stuff you can do with the touchscreen on WiiU (or touchpad on PS4) but because of it not being industry standard almost no one cared to use that is sad. And there haven't been a NHL game for Switch yet? Because I believe similar stuff could be done on it.

No NHL, no Madden...  EA limited their support to a couple of FIFA releases and that was it.  It's a shame, because the 2K ports of NBA have been excellent on the Switch.

That is sad even if understandable.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
Mandalore76 said:

No NHL, no Madden...  EA limited their support to a couple of FIFA releases and that was it.  It's a shame, because the 2K ports of NBA have been excellent on the Switch.

That is sad even if understandable.

Eh, I'm not sure how understandable it is.  If these sales #'s warrant ports to PS4 and Xbox One, why not the Switch?

NHL 18 (PS4) - 0.57m
NHL 18 (XBO) - 0.39m

NHL 19 (PS4) - 0.43m
NHL 19 (XBO) - 0.29m



Mandalore76 said:
DonFerrari said:

That is sad even if understandable.

Eh, I'm not sure how understandable it is.  If these sales #'s warrant ports to PS4 and Xbox One, why not the Switch?

NHL 18 (PS4) - 0.57m
NHL 18 (XBO) - 0.39m

NHL 19 (PS4) - 0.43m
NHL 19 (XBO) - 0.29m

They must be expecting a lot lower than that.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
Mandalore76 said:

Eh, I'm not sure how understandable it is.  If these sales #'s warrant ports to PS4 and Xbox One, why not the Switch?

NHL 18 (PS4) - 0.57m
NHL 18 (XBO) - 0.39m

NHL 19 (PS4) - 0.43m
NHL 19 (XBO) - 0.29m

They must be expecting a lot lower than that.

Lol, could be.  But, it's hard for me to find reasons to defend a 3rd Party software company completely ignoring a platform with closing in on a 60m userbase in just over 3 years.  They tell their investors "Switch owners can buy our games elsewhere".  That's about as anti-consumer friendly a stance that a 3rd Party could have.  Yes, I can buy EA sports games on my Xbox One.  I just choose not to.

Anyway, it's not like Nintendo is the only platform EA has ever tried to sabotage.  Besides the Switch and the Wii U, they had previously done it to Sega's Dreamcast.