By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - General Discussion - Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Thread

JRPGfan said:

Thats a straigt up Lie.

Apparently its quite common to lose Smell & taste, when your developeing symptoms.
Around 10% of people that get this, NEVER get their sense of smell or taste back.

Long term damage:

Heart Damage:
One study published in March found that out of 416 hospitalized Covid-19 patients, 19% showed signs of heart damage.
Another study from Wuhan published in January found 12% of Covid-19 patients showed signs of cardiovascular damage.
Other studies have since found evidence of myocarditis, inflammation of the heart muscle that can cause scarring, and heart failure in Covid-19 patients.

Lung Damage:
Physicians have also found evidence of scarring in Covid-19 patients' lungs. "ground-glass opacities," which don't always heal.
One Chinese study found the patches in 77% of patients.
Research
shows that about one third of survivors of similar coronaviruses such as SARS and MERS had long-term lung damage.


Its linked to increased diabetees, ei. people that have gotten covid19, afterwards have higher chances of diabetees.
Theres all kinds of organ damages, kidney, heart, liver, brain... ect.  Alot of it is permanent damage.

You can add skin lesions to that, aka covid toes. Study of 429 cases in Spain
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/bjd.19163
It doesn't seem to have permanent effects luckily.


Neurological damage is another long term effect, 3 stages of Covid19 brain damage
https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/933131

In stage 1, viral damage is limited to epithelial cells of the nose and mouth, and in stage 2 blood clots that form in the lungs may travel to the brain, leading to stroke. In stage 3, the virus crosses the blood–brain barrier and invades the brain.

It has become "increasingly evident" that SARS-CoV-2 can cause neurologic manifestations, including anosmia, seizures, stroke, confusion, encephalopathy, and total paralysis, the authors write.

The authors note that SARS-CoV-2 binds to angiotensin-converting enzyme 2 (ACE2) that facilitates the conversion of angiotensin II to angiotensin. After ACE2 has bound to respiratory epithelial cells, and then to epithelial cells in blood vessels, SARS-CoV-2 triggers the formation of a "cytokine storm." These cytokines, in turn, increase vascular permeability, edema, and widespread inflammation, as well as triggering "hypercoagulation cascades," which cause small and large blood clots that affect multiple organs. If SARS-CoV-2 crosses the blood–brain barrier, directly entering the brain, it can contribute to demyelination or neurodegeneration.


Here is that study about loss of smell and taste done on 202 patients in Italy
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaotolaryngology/fullarticle/2767781?guestAccessKey=2e0cf7c3-ca46-47d9-902b-1f97e228e6be&utm_source=For_The_Media&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=ftm_links&utm_content=tfl&utm_term=070220


Most of it seems to lead back to Cytokine storm.




Meanwhile in Egypt :/

https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/egypt-arrests-doctors-silences-critics-over-virus-outbreak-1.5011994

A doctor arrested after writing an article about Egypt's fragile health system. A pharmacist picked up from work after posting online about a shortage of protective gear. An editor taken from his home after questioning official coronavirus figures. A pregnant doctor arrested after a colleague used her phone to report a suspected coronavirus case.

As Egyptian authorities fight the swelling coronavirus outbreak, security agencies have tried to stifle criticism about the handling of the health crisis by the government of President Abdel Fattah el-Sissi.

At least 10 doctors and six journalists have been arrested since the virus first hit Egypt in February, according to rights groups. Other health workers say they have been warned by administrators to keep quiet or face punishment. One foreign correspondent has fled the country, fearing arrest, and another two have been summoned for reprimand over "professional violations."

Coronavirus infections are surging in the country of 100 million, threatening to overwhelm hospitals. As of Monday, the Health Ministry had recorded 76,253 infections, including 3,343 deaths -- the highest death toll in the Arab world.



Around the Network

Here in New York and Connecticut colleges are having un person classes for non lecture classes, people wont be able to ha e guests in their dorms, and all classes are transitioning to online adter Thanksgiving break in November.



SpokenTruth said:

This is why the US is so fucked. Peter Navarro, the WH Director of Trade and Manufacturing Policy, just claimed that China intentionally sent hundreds of thousands of potentially infected people around the world to spread Covid-19 - a bioweapon according to him.  Our highest levels of government are populated with conspiracy theory morons and it's trickling down to their supporters.



I thought it was just some quote taken out of context / blown out of proportion, then I watched the video....



JRPGfan said:

SvennoJ said:

Thats a straigt up Lie.

Apparently its quite common to lose Smell & taste, when your developeing symptoms.
Around 10% of people that get this, NEVER get their sense of smell or taste back.

Long term damage:

Heart Damage:
One study published in March found that out of 416 hospitalized Covid-19 patients, 19% showed signs of heart damage.
Another study from Wuhan published in January found 12% of Covid-19 patients showed signs of cardiovascular damage.
Other studies have since found evidence of myocarditis, inflammation of the heart muscle that can cause scarring, and heart failure in Covid-19 patients.

Lung Damage:
Physicians have also found evidence of scarring in Covid-19 patients' lungs. "ground-glass opacities," which don't always heal.
One Chinese study found the patches in 77% of patients.
Research
shows that about one third of survivors of similar coronaviruses such as SARS and MERS had long-term lung damage.


Its linked to increased diabetees, ei. people that have gotten covid19, afterwards have higher chances of diabetees.
Theres all kinds of organ damages, kidney, heart, liver, brain... ect.  Alot of it is permanent damage.

To be fair, 12% - 19% of hospitalized patients, and 10% of those with anosmia, should both be around or below 1% of all infections.

Lung damage is trickier since we don't know the percentage of people who develop pneumonia from this, but these should also be a subset of those hospitalized except for a few people, specially among the elderly, who won't develop symptoms from lung inflammation.

Regardless... I'm surprised people never came to the realization disease causes damage, at least for some time. If only you knew the sort of tissue scarring I've seen in tonsilectomy ops, after just a few recurring episodes of strep throat... it ain't pretty I tell you.

Again, not trying to minimize this, just put in context and make people realize how much, much worse this could have been. Imagine a particulatly virulent adenovirus type 14 that causes progressive constrictive bronchiolitis in a significant number of infections a few months later. Or a random mutation making a filovirus airborne and infectious to humans, like it happened in a párticular monkey population not long ago.



 

 

 

 

 

Been saying it for a long time...
https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/scientists-warn-of-overlooked-danger-from-coronavirus-spreading-airborne-microdroplets-1.5012340

Physical distancing and frequent handwashing are not enough to fully protect against airborne transmission of the novel coronavirus, hundreds of scientists say.

Virus-carrying microdroplets pose more of a danger than is currently being communicated, the scientists argue in a new medical commentary, and the result is that poor ventilation is easing the path of the pandemic. The commentary has been accepted for publication in the journal Clinical Infectious Diseases. It is signed by 239 scientists from 32 countries and a wide variety of science and engineering disciplines, according to a statement from the Queensland University of Technology (QUT) in Australia.

“We are concerned that people may think they are fully protected by following the current recommendations, but in fact, additional airborne precautions are needed to further reduce the spread of the virus," lead author and QUT air quality expert Lidia Morawska said in the statement.



Stay out of smaller / poorly ventilated buildings. (masks don't protect against microdroplets)

There are signs that the smallest microdroplets can travel beyond the two-metre limit. One American study found that they can move three metres in 12 seconds, and a fourth metre as they linger in the air for up to a minute. Morawska said that there is significant evidence that microdroplets can travel even farther – into the tens of metres – especially when indoors.

“Studies by the signatories and other scientists have demonstrated beyond any reasonable doubt that viruses are exhaled in microdroplets small enough to remain aloft in the air and pose a risk of exposure beyond [one to two metres] by an infected person,” she said.


Earlier studies already found that Sars-Cov-2 can stay alive for over 3 hours in aerosol form.


REDUCING THE RISK

Morawska said that effective ventilation systems are the best way to reduce the spread of microdroplets. She said the most effective systems minimize the use of recirculated air by bringing in as much clean air from outdoors as possible, and that even opening doors and windows can make a major difference.

These ventilation techniques can be augmented with the use of air filtration and exhaust devices, as well as ultraviolet (UV) lights that kill germs. Another way to lessen the risk of microdroplet transmission is to avoid situations of overcrowding, especially on public transport and in public buildings, Morawka said.

Furness agreed with the suggestion to use UV lights in air filtration systems, saying that there could be a "renaissance" in this practice because the light can be effective against the virus in a way that physical filters cannot.

"I think we will probably see a resurgence in the use of UV light within air circulation systems, because UV light will kill viruses and it doesn't really matter how small they are," he said.

Face masks do not play a role in protecting against microdroplets, Furness said, because the droplets are so small that they can fit through the holes in most masks.


It's been known since April 16th...
https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMc2004973


Something to ponder while restrictions on crowding are being reduced more and more.



Around the Network
haxxiy said:

To be fair, 12% - 19% of hospitalized patients, and 10% of those with anosmia, should both be around or below 1% of all infections.

Lung damage is trickier since we don't know the percentage of people who develop pneumonia from this, but these should also be a subset of those hospitalized except for a few people, specially among the elderly, who won't develop symptoms from lung inflammation.

Regardless... I'm surprised people never came to the realization disease causes damage, at least for some time. If only you knew the sort of tissue scarring I've seen in tonsilectomy ops, after just a few recurring episodes of strep throat... it ain't pretty I tell you.

Again, not trying to minimize this, just put in context and make people realize how much, much worse this could have been. Imagine a particulatly virulent adenovirus type 14 that causes progressive constrictive bronchiolitis in a significant number of infections a few months later. Or a random mutation making a filovirus airborne and infectious to humans, like it happened in a párticular monkey population not long ago.

Lung damage has also been observed in asymptomatic patients :/

https://www.zmescience.com/medicine/covid-19-asymptomatic-lung-damage-0523532/

One of the biggest conundrums surrounding COVID-19 is its astonishing variability of disease prognosis. Take two people of identical demographics and one of them might end up in the ICU while the other might not even have any symptoms to show. This unpredictability is what partly makes this virus extremely challenging to contain. Yet, even though COVID-19 positive cases may be asymptomatic, that doesn’t mean that organs are spared from damage ‘under the hood’.

Fact is, we simply don't know what long term effects this new disease can cause. What I'm worried about atm is the ongoing symptoms my wife has with her intestinal tract. She still has trouble keeping food in, guts cramping half the day, yet doesn't think going to see a doctor will be of any use nor safe.



SvennoJ said:
haxxiy said:

To be fair, 12% - 19% of hospitalized patients, and 10% of those with anosmia, should both be around or below 1% of all infections.

Lung damage is trickier since we don't know the percentage of people who develop pneumonia from this, but these should also be a subset of those hospitalized except for a few people, specially among the elderly, who won't develop symptoms from lung inflammation.

Regardless... I'm surprised people never came to the realization disease causes damage, at least for some time. If only you knew the sort of tissue scarring I've seen in tonsilectomy ops, after just a few recurring episodes of strep throat... it ain't pretty I tell you.

Again, not trying to minimize this, just put in context and make people realize how much, much worse this could have been. Imagine a particulatly virulent adenovirus type 14 that causes progressive constrictive bronchiolitis in a significant number of infections a few months later. Or a random mutation making a filovirus airborne and infectious to humans, like it happened in a párticular monkey population not long ago.

Lung damage has also been observed in asymptomatic patients :/

https://www.zmescience.com/medicine/covid-19-asymptomatic-lung-damage-0523532/

One of the biggest conundrums surrounding COVID-19 is its astonishing variability of disease prognosis. Take two people of identical demographics and one of them might end up in the ICU while the other might not even have any symptoms to show. This unpredictability is what partly makes this virus extremely challenging to contain. Yet, even though COVID-19 positive cases may be asymptomatic, that doesn’t mean that organs are spared from damage ‘under the hood’.

Fact is, we simply don't know what long term effects this new disease can cause. What I'm worried about atm is the ongoing symptoms my wife has with her intestinal tract. She still has trouble keeping food in, guts cramping half the day, yet doesn't think going to see a doctor will be of any use nor safe.

Yes somewhere around 50% of asymptomatic patients also have lung scarring, and some degree is likely permanent.
These are the people that arn't even hospitalised, and have little to no symptoms, and soon recover, but even they (not all) have lunge damage.

Basically if you get covid19, theres high chances of you haveing some form of lasting damage from it.
Most of it probably minor, but its there.


That means if theres 3,000,000 confirmed cases theres likely to be 1,5million americans that are walking around with some form of scarring on their lunges now.
Now remember the CDC saying there may be 5-10 times as many actual cases, as the confirmed ones?

Potentially 15 million americans with lunge damage of some form, from covid19.

But its "just the flu, bro".
I imagine this isn't great for athletes, and sports stars... some of these people have contracts for millions, and even minor damage could hurt their performance.
They probably really dont wanna get covid19 and chance things.

Last edited by JRPGfan - on 06 July 2020

Luxembourg's politicians are tightening the laws a bit due to Covid, specifically about the number of people at gatherings.

See, after the reopening on June 5, many people thought that the best course of action was to celebrate with friends and family. That was of course before the mass testing really started rolling and finding some sleeping viruses in asymptomatic cases. The result: we just had a week with about 50 new cases each day due to the virus spreading at those gatherings.

So now, those gatherings are now forced to be a bit smaller and rarer.

Also a big shout-out to our police, patrolling every day making sure that visitors and bartenders both follow the rules on social distancing, mask wearing and closing hours. Every day some patron seems to be unwilling to follow the rules in their pub or café. Of course under those circumstances the virus can never be beaten unless these locations can be closed down for the time being.



Another vaccine candidate has reached Phase III trials, making 4 now in this final stage before approval.

http://www.sinovac.com/?optionid=754&auto_id=907



Miami-Dade county is closing restaurants again starting on wednesday. Broward county might follow suit. Looks like Florida might go on lock down again, At least South florida.