Forums - Nintendo Discussion - The cuts for the Sw/Sh dex were worse than even the most pessimistic predictions

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StarDoor said:
Mr.GameCrazy said:

How much Pokemon were in Diamond and Pearl? I forgot.

Here's a handy list:

Red/Blue: 151 regional, 151 total
Gold/Silver: 251 regional, 251 total
Ruby/Sapphire: 202 regional, 386 total
Diamond/Pearl: 151 regional, 493 total
Black/White: 155 regional, 649 total
X/Y: 457 regional, 721 total
Sun/Moon: 302 regional, 802 total
Sword/Shield: ~400 regional, ~400 total

So, what you're saying is that the game still has more than 3 Generations combined, but you're still bitching? 

Again, you're all just so cynical, looking on the bad side. Rather than seeing it like 'Damn, we still have 400+ pokemon!" it's "Aw, we don't have 800+!" 400 is still an incredibly huge number, and as I've said before and will say again, the culling was going to happen eventually and they chose the migration from handheld to console/hybrid (where there's a need to recreate every pokemon's models and animations from scratch in the new engine) as that time. This makes perfect sense to me and I'm genuinely shocked that people are complaining about this. 

Well, not shocked that people are complaining - this is the internet, and it's primarily used for porn and complaining - but because even when faced with the cold hard facts and reality of the situation, you still genuinely feel entitled to the content. It's almost a shame GameFreak continued to overdeliver with the prior generations by constantly adding new pokemon and allowing us to use old pokemon for so long, because now everyone sees that as the base starting point of expectations instead of the rare generosity it is. 

Y'all need a shift in perspective. 



I got it all, baby! 

PS4, Switch, WiiU, XBO, PC
Vita, 3DS, Android

Top 6 this generation: 
Bloodborne, Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice, God of War, The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, Dark Souls III, Red Dead Redemption II

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Runa216 said: 

The culling was going to happen eventually and they chose the migration from handheld to console/hybrid (where there's a need to recreate every pokemon's models and animations from scratch in the new engine) as that time.

Hahahahahahahaha

Ha.

You do you.



StarDoor said:
Mr.GameCrazy said:

How much Pokemon were in Diamond and Pearl? I forgot.

Here's a handy list:

Red/Blue: 151 regional, 151 total
Gold/Silver: 251 regional, 251 total
Ruby/Sapphire: 202 regional, 386 total
Diamond/Pearl: 151 regional, 493 total
Black/White: 155 regional, 649 total
X/Y: 457 regional, 721 total
Sun/Moon: 302 regional, 802 total
Sword/Shield: ~400 regional, ~400 total

I don't mind so much that they decided to cut the national dex, was bound to happen eventually with the number of Pokemon rapidly approaching 1000, if it didn't happen this gen would definitely have happened next gen with the bigger leap in graphics necessitating higher quality models for all Pokemon. What bugs me is that they didn't give Sword and Shield the largest regional dex of all games, that should have been a no brainer since they decided to cut the national dex. They should definitely have made it bigger than X/Y's 457. Somewhere between 5 and 6 hundred would have been nice I think.

Also kind of bugs me that they didn't focus more on keeping the most popular Pokemon after they said they were going to. Cutting popular pokemon/evolutionary lines like all earlier gen starters aside from Charmander, all earlier gen legendaries, all earlier gen fossils, Alakazam, Starmie, Nidoking, Dragonite, Houndoom, Aggron, Absol, Metagross, Luxray, Garchomp, and Volcarona is questionable to say the least. As is the large number of unpopular Pokemon they decided to keep, some of which they even gave Galarian forms to instead of giving Galarian forms to popular Pokemon that need new forms like Luxray (so he can finally get his partial dark type). 

Last edited by shikamaru317 - on 09 November 2019

Runa216 said:
StarDoor said:

Here's a handy list:

Red/Blue: 151 regional, 151 total
Gold/Silver: 251 regional, 251 total
Ruby/Sapphire: 202 regional, 386 total
Diamond/Pearl: 151 regional, 493 total
Black/White: 155 regional, 649 total
X/Y: 457 regional, 721 total
Sun/Moon: 302 regional, 802 total
Sword/Shield: ~400 regional, ~400 total

So, what you're saying is that the game still has more than 3 Generations combined, but you're still bitching? 

Again, you're all just so cynical, looking on the bad side. Rather than seeing it like 'Damn, we still have 400+ pokemon!" it's "Aw, we don't have 800+!" 400 is still an incredibly huge number, and as I've said before and will say again, the culling was going to happen eventually and they chose the migration from handheld to console/hybrid (where there's a need to recreate every pokemon's models and animations from scratch in the new engine) as that time. This makes perfect sense to me and I'm genuinely shocked that people are complaining about this. 

Well, not shocked that people are complaining - this is the internet, and it's primarily used for porn and complaining - but because even when faced with the cold hard facts and reality of the situation, you still genuinely feel entitled to the content. It's almost a shame GameFreak continued to overdeliver with the prior generations by constantly adding new pokemon and allowing us to use old pokemon for so long, because now everyone sees that as the base starting point of expectations instead of the rare generosity it is. 

Y'all need a shift in perspective. 

Dude, what the hell are you even talking about? That was my first post in this thread, and I didn't say anything about what my personal opinions were on the situation. I haven't even said anything about Dexit on VGChartz, period. It's amazing that you'd then go on to talk about people facing the "cold hard facts" when my post is literally just a list of numbers.

If you think that sharing factual information on Pokedex sizes is a criticism of Game Freak, you might want to re-evaluate your own views.



CaptainExplosion said:
So, when do we falsely accuse Junichi Masuda of being a predator again? Nothing beats trying to ruin someone's life over a video game. 8D

I choked on my soda here. What a random wtf out of nowhere comments this was. What is this man talking about?



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Runa216 said:
StarDoor said:

Here's a handy list:

Red/Blue: 151 regional, 151 total
Gold/Silver: 251 regional, 251 total
Ruby/Sapphire: 202 regional, 386 total
Diamond/Pearl: 151 regional, 493 total
Black/White: 155 regional, 649 total
X/Y: 457 regional, 721 total
Sun/Moon: 302 regional, 802 total
Sword/Shield: ~400 regional, ~400 total

So, what you're saying is that the game still has more than 3 Generations combined, but you're still bitching? 

Again, you're all just so cynical, looking on the bad side. Rather than seeing it like 'Damn, we still have 400+ pokemon!" it's "Aw, we don't have 800+!" 400 is still an incredibly huge number, and as I've said before and will say again, the culling was going to happen eventually and they chose the migration from handheld to console/hybrid (where there's a need to recreate every pokemon's models and animations from scratch in the new engine) as that time. This makes perfect sense to me and I'm genuinely shocked that people are complaining about this. 

Well, not shocked that people are complaining - this is the internet, and it's primarily used for porn and complaining - but because even when faced with the cold hard facts and reality of the situation, you still genuinely feel entitled to the content. It's almost a shame GameFreak continued to overdeliver with the prior generations by constantly adding new pokemon and allowing us to use old pokemon for so long, because now everyone sees that as the base starting point of expectations instead of the rare generosity it is. 

Y'all need a shift in perspective. 

There is no need to recreate the models. They are using the same lifeless models that have been in every game since X/Y. Even if a few of the older models required tweaking, an interview with Masuda a few months ago indicated that they've had more than 1000 people work on these games, there is absolutely no reason for them not to be in. Pokemon is by far the biggest franchise in any medium in the world, there is more than enough money to hire more artists to do the work.

Game Freak isn't an indie studio, they don't get the slack a 10-person operation does.

shikamaru317 said:
StarDoor said:

Here's a handy list:

Red/Blue: 151 regional, 151 total
Gold/Silver: 251 regional, 251 total
Ruby/Sapphire: 202 regional, 386 total
Diamond/Pearl: 151 regional, 493 total
Black/White: 155 regional, 649 total
X/Y: 457 regional, 721 total
Sun/Moon: 302 regional, 802 total
Sword/Shield: ~400 regional, ~400 total

I don't mind so much that they decided to cut the national dex, was bound to happen eventually with the number of Pokemon rapidly approaching 1000, if it didn't happen this gen would definitely have happened next gen with the bigger leap in graphics necessitating higher quality models for all Pokemon. What bugs me is that they didn't give Sword and Shield the largest regional dex of all games, that should have been a no brainer since they decided to cut the national dex. They should definitely have made it bigger than X/Y's 457. Somewhere between 5 and 6 hundred would have been nice I think.

Also kind of bugs me that they didn't focus more on keeping the most popular Pokemon after they said they were going to. Cutting popular pokemon/evolutionary lines like all earlier gen starters aside from Charmander, all earlier gen legendaries, all earlier gen fossils, Alakazam, Starmie, Nidoking, Dragonite, Houndoom, Aggron, Absol, Metagross, Luxray, Garchomp, and Volcarona is questionable to say the least. As is the large number of unpopular Pokemon they decided to keep, some of which they even gave Galarian forms to instead of giving Galarian forms to popular Pokemon that need new forms like Luxray (so he can finally get his partial dark type). 

Using Luxray as an example, it hasn't been in a single other regional dex since the third game of its intro generation released more than a decade ago. If their policy of 'wait and see if they make the next game!' applied from then, your Luxray would have been sitting in Pokemon Prison for more than a decade, completely unusable. With regional dexes as small as this one, this is going to happen to many more Pokemon in the future, I guarantee it.



Again confirmed: There are no plans to make the cut Pokemon available in any future updates.

The missing National Dex is of course also discussed, of which we mainly want to know whether it will return in the future. Will there be an update or a third game? According to Masuda, Game Freak wants to continue the approach for Sword and Shield:

“We now have no plans to make the pokémon that are missing in the Galar pokédex in-game available. That is an approach that we want to continue with Pokémon games in the future. Of course, up to now it has not been possible to encounter every pokémon in every game, so people had to transfer it from old games via Pokémon Bank to the new game, for example. ”

On the one hand, that is understandable, because Masuda previously indicated that Game Freak does not have the manpower to animate all pokémon if it also wants to introduce new game play features. On the other hand, Pokémon is pretty much the largest franchise in the world and it is not unreasonable to expect a complete Pokédex from the new parts. As a compromise, however, Junichi Masuda claims that the Pokémon Home app, which will be released in 2020, will be the place to collect pokémon from all games.

"Currently, the Pokémon Home app is under development, where players can collect their different pokémon, and only pokémon in the Galar-Pokédex can be transferred from there to Sword and Shield," he says. "But the way of playing is actually not very different from before with Pokémon Bank: until now you have always been able to meet only the pokémon of a certain region."

He continues: “We encourage people to use Pokémon Home to collect their pokémon from old games there. From there, they might be able to take it to other games in the future. So take good care of your old pokémon, because you might be able to go out with them again in the future. ”

The line about Pokemon Bank seems to imply that it will be as barebones and featureless as Bank was too. Anybody expecting any sort of gameplay in Home outside of shifting Pokemon around in boxes or trading on the GTS is kidding themselves.



Wow. Just wow.

490 pokemon getting snapped is bad enough already, but the selection of some mons they chose to keep is even worse. You leave out fan favourites like Lycanroc, Krookodile, Luxray Empoleon, etc, and then put a worthless POS like maractus and morelull in there. Like, really?



Bet with Intrinsic:

The Switch will outsell 3DS (based on VGchartz numbers), according to me, while Intrinsic thinks the opposite will hold true. One month avatar control for the loser's avatar.

The silver lining here, is the competitive aspect. Lando-T and Incineroar gone, with those countless broken uber legendaries and megas gone too. Might actually reverse some of the power creep.



Bet with Intrinsic:

The Switch will outsell 3DS (based on VGchartz numbers), according to me, while Intrinsic thinks the opposite will hold true. One month avatar control for the loser's avatar.

So, honest questions. What is the number that Pokémon fans feel like is enough? Do people really expect every generation to constantly grow without an end? Where is the sweet spot? When will the number be just to overwhelmingly high?

Who even is motivated enough to collect, trade and evolve almost 900 Pokémon? That sounds like a chore and nothing else.

More is NOT always better.



Gameplay > Graphics

Substance > Style

Art Direction > Realism