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Forums - Sony Discussion - PS5 Confirmed Backward Compatibility

BasilZero said:
Awesome.


I've invested in a lot of PS4 games that I'm sure will carry on to next gen ;)

Same! I know modern hardware isn't quite as indestructible as is was when the PS2 launched, so it's nice to know that a PS4 game playing device won't be obsolete until 2029. If the last PS5s roll off the production line, in 2029 then it should be feasible to have a working unit in 2040 or even later. 



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Not all that surprising, but nice to hear. The storage and loading times seem extremely impressive right now though. Waiting to hear how many TF 'XB2(s)' have?

Based on this new info I would expect that at PSX later this year we see a $249 PS4 SS and $349 Pro S. Maybe, just maybe, we also get an announcement for a PS Portable, maybe.

PS5 Nov 2020 for $399-$499. If Pro was still $349 by the time PS5 launches, it would make it easier for PS to price PS5 at $449 if they wish. If it lands at $499, I would have to imagine that only lasts a year and then drops to $399 holiday 2021. $499 with loads of acceptable quality games due to x86 will allow for the same launch numbers as PS3 worst case, but more than likely better with how the worldwide economy is at the moment.

Even with loading speeds faster than anything on the market now, I don't see that meaning an expensive storage solution overall. Expensive for the small amount that's part of the whole loading and storage solution maybe, but something like that I can't see being a substantial portion of the budget. Unless the GPU and/or RAM will suffer because of it, which is possible but I'd think they would rather balance things and use an HDD for mass storage, if it'll give them those speeds anyway with what's on board. Or do they launch at $399-$449 with 500GB on board and let customers make the add on choice of HDD/SSD/SSHD expansion bay/external mass storage? 



DonFerrari said:
spemanig said:
I wonder how this will compare to Stadia, spec-wise.

theoretical or real world...

From what we heard from stadia it seems to be about X1X level of power, while this seems to be about double (on raw number, performance will be much higher).

On real world with latency, bandwidth and all else Stadia will be lower than full HD, this will be about 4K (capable of 8K output per the interview).

Stadia is more powerful than XBO X and PS4 Pro combined. That was confirmed by the specs shown at its reveal. I don't know where you heard that it's only XBO X-level, but that's false.

Stadia is also shooting for 4K 60fps at launch, with 8K 60fps as time progressed. I don't really like thrown out numbers like that anyway because it's just unsubstantiated flexing, but that's also something that was said explicitly at reveal. It has as much validity atm as anything confirmed so far for PS5.

I'm really just curious how streaming platforms will compare spec-wise to standalone consoles. The next 3 years will be buy far the most interesting in gaming since maybe the Wii/DS/XB Live era. So transformative with streaming, VR, and new hybrid platforms like Switch entering the mainstream. (pun intended) Considering rumors of PS5 being $500, I wonder if they'll consider selling a cheaper $400/$450 model that's digital only. Exciting times!



Bofferbrauer2 said:
Trumpstyle said:

We had 3 new rumors from Jason Schreier, french leak and Brad sams since I made my prediction in the same thread, here's my updated one.

Xbox two (Lockhart)
CPU: Zen2 8 cores, 16 threads, 2,4 ghz
GPU: Navi 4TF
Memory: 12GB Gddr6 Ram, 192-bit bus, 336 GB/s Bandwidth
Storage: 1TB NVMe drive (Will be disc-less)
Launch: Fall 2020 250-300$

Xbox two+ (Anaconda)
CPU: Zen2 8 cores, 16 threads, 2,8 ghz
GPU: Navi 12TF, 80CU with 1200 Mhz clock
Memory: 16GB Gddr6 Ram, 256-bit bus, 448 GB/s Bandwidth
Storage: 1TB NVMe drive
Launch: Fall 2020 400$

Playstation 5
CPU: Zen2 8 cores, 16 threads, 2,8 ghz
GPU: Navi 12TF, 80CU with 1200 Mhz clock
Memory: 16GB Gddr6 Ram, 256-bit bus, 448 GB/s Bandwidth
Storage: 1TB NVMe drive
Launch: Spring 2020 400$

Basically I don't think Microsoft is doing a premium console anymore based on information from the French leak and Brad sams, it will be a cheap 1080p Disc-less console for 250-300$ and a mainstream console for 400$. PS5 and Xbox two+ (anaconda) will probably be identical in spec.

400$ might sounds cheap but here's my build:

Soc/Apu = 100$
Memory = 70$
Nvme drive = 50$
Rest = 150$
Total = 370$

Prices are based on speculation.

Even at 7nm, a chip with 8 CPU cores, 80 Compute Units and all the caches will be gargantuan, with about 500 mm2 at the very least. 100$ per chip wouldn't even be enough to pay TSMC for the wafers, let alone make any profit for AMD. You can at least double the price for that just to make it covering the costs.

Also, just a 50$ NVME drive? If you really expect PS5 to be SSD only, then that's certainly not nearly enough. 80$ would be a better fit right now when buying in bulk.

As you can see, 400$ for your build are impossible, put at least another 100$ on top of it.

Finally, An Xbox 2 model being considerably less powerful than the One X doesn't make sense at all to me. I think it would at least match the One X in GPU performance, with the better CPU and possibly more RAM making the difference between the two.

No. Just no. So much wrong here.



SSD as standard is a good thing, open world games have been limited by HDD for sometime now.



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Bofferbrauer2 said:

Finally, An Xbox 2 model being considerably less powerful than the One X doesn't make sense at all to me. I think it would at least match the One X in GPU performance, with the better CPU and possibly more RAM making the difference between the two.

I agree in general, but at the moment, I can see two reasons why they might do this, if they are doing it.

First, there's a price point they want to hit for whatever reason, and there's certain hardware that's basically necessary across both models, so the GPU TF performance must suffer for the lower end model to hit that price.

Second, if MS feels XB1X owners may feel burned by a base next gen unit that matches or exceeds theirs, by making it weaker it takes the sting away. Now that still leaves everybody else wondering WTF, but as long as the price is right and it has a worthy audience, it doesn't matter all that much.



V-r0cK said:
Will this be the end of remasters that are only 1 gen apart?? lol

If indeed this is true then honestly this is great news as my backlog is taking awhile to complete but would love to move forward as well.

Remasters a gen apart are fine. One of my favorite releases this gen has been Halo:MCC. The jump to 1080p or even 4K with 60 fps is awesome, the definitive experience. The original games struggled to maintain 30 fps and much lower resolution.

Furthermore, a generation can be like 7 years. So sometimes there is still a big gap between a remaster. Maybe a decade, I mean we're just getting Halo Reach on X1.

This doesn't end any need or desire for remasters though. Because some games might be capped at 30 fps, locked at a low resolution (a bigger problem for native BC), or use low quality assets. A remaster can either swap out the visual assets entirely like Gears of War Ultimate, while some remasters might just improve frame rate, resolution and use higher quality assets that may have been exclusive to PC.

Sometimes a game on my backlog might just switch to the remaster. Which is great if the remaster is ultimately the superior experience and I can use my newer hardware.



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River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

I'll be excited about BC when PS3 backwards compatibility is announced.

PSNow is awful and a joke. I want real PS3 titles on my current gen console.



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It's been a while since I've been this hyped for a PS console before it came out. Backward compatibility and the disc drive sealed the deal.



EricHiggin said:
Bofferbrauer2 said:

Finally, An Xbox 2 model being considerably less powerful than the One X doesn't make sense at all to me. I think it would at least match the One X in GPU performance, with the better CPU and possibly more RAM making the difference between the two.

I agree in general, but at the moment, I can see two reasons why they might do this, if they are doing it.

First, there's a price point they want to hit for whatever reason, and there's certain hardware that's basically necessary across both models, so the GPU TF performance must suffer for the lower end model to hit that price.

Second, if MS feels XB1X owners may feel burned by a base next gen unit that matches or exceeds theirs, by making it weaker it takes the sting away. Now that still leaves everybody else wondering WTF, but as long as the price is right and it has a worthy audience, it doesn't matter all that much.

A 4TFLOP Navi GPU in the base "1080p" machine is a massive red flag imo. The problem with a base model less or equal than 1/3rd  the power of the PS5, is that native 4k is still not guaranteed to be standard next gen, just as PS3 was tauted a 1080p machine but rarely hit above 720p and 10+ years later a system magnitudes more power (X1) is still not hitting that 1080p target on a frequent basis. X1X in particular is setting false standards in this regards, with the Pro & X1X developers have nothing else to do but bump the resolution and tinker the FPS. They're not going to invest the time to exploit the hardware on an individual asset basis. When building games from the ground up for next gen machines however, they'll take a far more dynamic approach to how they utilise the GPU and I'm sure we'll see many games sacrifice Native 4k for far more impressive VFX, textures, lighting and overall aesthetics. Things which everyone will benefit from regardless of whether they have a 4k TV or not. And most gamers still do not have 4k tvs and even when they do upscaling techniques will offer a close to 4k picture without being as much of hardware drain.

So what happens when a game is built to run at 1440p on PS5 and has to be scaled down to a GPU 1/3rd its capacity. The entry level Xbox will be more a 720p-900p console than anything and even then I could see developers botching visuals even further. In the digital foundry age, I think that will MS lots of harm. Worse case scenario is that it actually dictates how developers approach development knowing that they've got such a weak GPU to cater for. Or going by how poor recent base Xbox One games perform I think they'll just stop optimizing for the Anaconda and call it a day once they've reached a passable framerate and resolution.