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Forums - Politics Discussion - The Next Rosa Parks?

Mr Puggsly said:
ArchangelMadzz said:

The haircuts thing definitely isn't a thing in the UK. Women pay a lot more, but this is because women can be in the hairdressers for hours having something done that takes years of training to do. Women here can go into men's barbers and get a trim for £5 which does happen. 

Equality just means everyone has the same legal rights, there's a market for ladies nights, there isn't for men's nights. The only people that complain wouldn't have even gone in if it wasn't a ladies night and just looking for things to be offended by. 

Well the thing is I cant control what gender I am, per se. Unless you believe in the gender is fluid thing...

So it becomes a legal issue when women can pay less simply for something people cant control. Where is the equality in that? Your argument is valid for why business do ladies night, but its not equality. Does a man claiming to be a woman pay less as well? Or does the bar decide radomly? That could be a potential lawsuit.

Haircutting business in the US like Great Clips and Super Cuts had flat prices for basic haircuts. But it was a few dollars more for women given their styles are more complex, time consuming, etc. But what if some lesbian wanted a basic haircut for a man? Obviously you should charge the male rate. And perhaps vice versa! So they settled with a flat rate. Which made a simple mens haircut kinda expenisve.

These are modern problems in a more inclusive world.

For that establishment yeah. 

You have no control over when you're born, yet children pay less to get into buffets. 
Is it a bit shitty that on a ladies night women pay less? Sure, but if someone doesn't like it then they don't have to support. But it's hardly a legal issue, It would be better if nothing like that ever existed in the first place as it would just make things simpler. Especially the whole trans argument of if identiying as a women counts etc



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2 Hairstyles for female characters: Long and 'Political Agenda'
2 Sexualities: Straight and 'Political Agenda'

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SpokenTruth said:
pokoko said:
I don't really understand why the double standard is considered okay, to be honest. Male only clubs have been under attack for awhile but female only venues have been springing up without complaint. They're either both okay or neither is okay.

I'm also getting sick of those who think no one should ever complain about an issue faced by men or boys. They have zero idea of what equality actually means and are, ironically, the mirror reflection of those they complain about.

Female only venues?  Can you provide a link to one?  Never heard of that in US.

o_O.Q said:

 

" Probably wants it to go back to what it once was"

when we sent women off to die in wars and made them do the hardest dirtiest jobs that build and maintain infrastructure?

You mean the wars started by men? 

 

As for the OP

Guy has some points, everything should be equal, any area which suggests one gender has more rights than the other should be altered to become equal, this includes things like ladies nights, free female entry and insurance companies which are exclusively for female drivers etc.

Sexism isn't just a one way thing, it's the same as racism, it's possible to be racist towards a white person the same as it's possible to be sexist to a guy, if you don't agree with that statement then you are delusional and shouldn't be involved in what is a battle for equality because you do not see where inequalities really happen.



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Honestly there are much bigger fish to fry if you are talking about men's rights. Before I would be worried about stuff like this i would be more interested in:

 

-Sentencing disparity (depending on what you look at men get up to 63% longer sentences and are twice as likely to be convicted as compared to women)

-Mothers get custody of children 82% of the time (US data, will vary based on what you look at but is always high) ... let's also not forget that children of single mothers perform worse by virtually every measure you can name and are more likely to be single parents themselves ... not to mention the crime they commit. 

-The fact that Selective Service is still a thing (in 2018 in the US we have a quasi draft program in place in the event of a large scale war that ONLY men are required to sign up for). You could argue that it will never happen ... well then why does this even exist anymore then?

-Less than 44% of men are going to college and the number seems to be dropping year after year. 

 

There are dozens more issues after this that are more relevant to the average man than the stuff this guy is going after so in a way do agree with the OP that this guy is focusing on mostly non issues. 



SuperNova said:
o_O.Q said:

 

"Your own example of men going to war is already no longer as big of a factor because women wanted the right to fight for their country just the same."

really? wanted? so why aren't they fighting to desegregate men's and women's sports?

or did you really mean to say that its not that women wanted the chance to fight alongside men in the past, its that now that the emphasis in combat has moved more to the use of machines women are coming forward

yeah... you're resorting to some type of slight of hand there, so i think i corrected it a bit there

 

"only that the male patriarchy refuses to acknowledge and take corrective action on those that women have. When women didn't have the right to vote, who made that decision?  Men or women?"

men... gloria steinem for example was a CIA agent.. she didn't rise up and push this movement, she was following orders and anyone who has done their research knows that

and come on dude isn't your narrative that men had all the power before? so... wouldn't men have to decide that they wanted women to have more rights and change society? you can't have it both ways

 

"Also, anybody that thinks feminism ignores the plights of men doesn't understand feminism. "

well as far as i know the goal feminism has always been to achieve equal rights between men and women... what are you saying the goals of feminism are from your perspective?

'and come on dude isn't your narrative that the King of France had all the power before? so...wouldn't the King of France have to decide to have himself decapitated by the revolution in oder to establish a democracy? Can't have it both ways.'

Not a single opression in history has ever ended because the opressor suddenly realized the error of their ways and was happy to then give up their privilige. It has always taken fight, uproar and bloodshed to establish a new status quo. People have been had to be forced to reconize other people rights time and time again. Just because an opressor has the overwhelming amount of power in a society, that doesn't mean strengh in numbers isn't a thing.

Also I'm not sure what you think you corrected with your first point, but you come off as borderline insulting to every female soldier in history, the way it's currently phrased.

"'and come on dude isn't your narrative that the King of France had all the power before? so...wouldn't the King of France have to decide to have himself decapitated by the revolution in oder to establish a democracy? Can't have it both ways.'"

the king of france supported his own decapitation? are you denying the support women were given ( by men ) when they moved for emancipation? that's not really a sensible comparison

it shows though the concept you have of men in the past and probably now as evil oppressors only out to keep the poor women down that you would compare them to the nobility of the past... there's no acknowledgement of the benefits women gained (despite their inequality) from society


"Just because an opressor has the overwhelming amount of power in a society, that doesn't mean strengh in numbers isn't a thing."

well i personally don't buy the argument that women were oppressed over men as i have already laid out in this thread... society has always been oppressive towards ALL members and it will always be oppressive towards ALL members

i would even go as far as to say that a society CANNOT exist without being to some extent oppressive because a society is a structure that represents what is common across the majority of the people of a society at some point in time or some type of metaphysical idea such as "all men are created equal"

which means that it has a template for things such as behavior that all are expected to abide by, and because people are inherently different from each other some people are going to fall short

the problem i have with these ideas that feminist and communists for example keep pushing is that they don't acknowledge any of the above and act as if a perfect society can be made if we just stamp out individuality which is insanely delusional and i don't think many of them even understand the ideas they claim to be advancing

like "equality"

 

"Also I'm not sure what you think you corrected with your first point, but you come off as borderline insulting to every female soldier in history, the way it's currently phrased."

i'm speaking generally, that doesn't mean disregard for the sacrifices women have made in the past but what i'm saying is that we have to take a rational approach with regards to history and the narrative of "men =oppressors/power, women =victims" is not a rational approach

Last edited by o_O.Q - on 04 January 2018

I'm all for anybody standing up for civil rights - even ones that aren't popular at a given point in time. However, there is no civil right to force any business to do anything, including let someone in, give them preferred pricing, or anything else.



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ArchangelMadzz said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Well the thing is I cant control what gender I am, per se. Unless you believe in the gender is fluid thing...

So it becomes a legal issue when women can pay less simply for something people cant control. Where is the equality in that? Your argument is valid for why business do ladies night, but its not equality. Does a man claiming to be a woman pay less as well? Or does the bar decide radomly? That could be a potential lawsuit.

Haircutting business in the US like Great Clips and Super Cuts had flat prices for basic haircuts. But it was a few dollars more for women given their styles are more complex, time consuming, etc. But what if some lesbian wanted a basic haircut for a man? Obviously you should charge the male rate. And perhaps vice versa! So they settled with a flat rate. Which made a simple mens haircut kinda expenisve.

These are modern problems in a more inclusive world.

For that establishment yeah. 

You have no control over when you're born, yet children pay less to get into buffets. 
Is it a bit shitty that on a ladies night women pay less? Sure, but if someone doesn't like it then they don't have to support. But it's hardly a legal issue, It would be better if nothing like that ever existed in the first place as it would just make things simpler. Especially the whole trans argument of if identiying as a women counts etc

Your argument is weak because we all age. But things like gender amd etchnicity dont change, not REALLY. So maybe an argument could be made for age but its not equal.

Lower price for ethnicity would offend many. While gender is just business. So this is partly why ladies night is not as common.

I guess my feeling is these law laws should reach as far as people desire or we pull back regulations. Maybe let businesses do whatever they want regardless who it offends... But that wont happen.



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VAMatt said:
I'm all for anybody standing up for civil rights - even ones that aren't popular at a given point in time. However, there is no civil right to force any business to do anything, including let someone in, give them preferred pricing, or anything else.

I could be wrong, but I think the Civil Rights Act of 1964 does exactly that.

Last edited by Mr Puggsly - on 05 January 2018

Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

See, the clever thing would've been if he said he identifies as a woman and then throw a major tantrum and accuse them of being transphobes.

It's so amazing that this equality stuff emerged at the same time as the trans stuff. Now nothing is sure anymore and everything is confusing^^



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