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Forums - Politics Discussion - I'm ignorant about politics. But I know I want change.

bunchanumbers said:
Ouroboros24 said:

Okay, you're thinking to broadly about this.  When I say change, he already made the change, at least in my view, the same view that was in the OP.  The change was that he was not one of them.  Not completely, at least.  In Wrestling, you have to look for the small nuiances about wrestlers.  We have big ones, we have medium ones, and we have small ones.  In all categories there are many of each big, medium and small.  But in wrestling, when you see that big one or medium or small, that is different from the rest, you know there is a change.  A small change, but a change nonetheless.  The change I'm talking about is that Donald is different.  Is it a big difference, herhaps not, but there is enough there for someone like me to realize there is a difference and I'm sure you can list a few things that he IS that is different. 

As for Bernie, I don't see it.  At least not that big a difference.  Bernie had different ideas, but not too different from Hillary.  Yeah he wanted to legalize **, and of course other things I don't want to research for the sake of this reply.  But ultimately he is the same as Hillary in my eyes.  He has been there for 30+ years.  He is less notorious, but he acts just like everyone other politician.  He goes on stage to talk, he has the perfect record for a political career, he will abide by the Demos as he should.  He speaks like politician does and acts as a politician does.  

When ask of Trump to acknowledge the winner, his answer akined to, "I'll think about it."  Bernies was, "yeah, I concede.  Because that's the thing to do for a politician."  When trump was against other repubs, his was, "no, f these guys, I'm not coming to a debate that's all robotic, logical, and maneuvered."  We hear Marco autoreply himself just because he's still so green.  We hear Ted "bundy" cruz, after all the stupid shit trump said about his daddy and wife, because it was part of what Dems or Repubs would do because of tradition, and still he backs the bastard.  When real people would be like, "No, Calvin, fuck that, you said my wife was a whore.  We ain't buds anymore.  Fuck your presidential aspirations.  Bitch!"

But no.  It's all the same answers.  Same people.  Same mindset.  Same actions in course to what's expected of them.  When asked about his use of loop holes in his business woes, Trump's answer was in the likes of, "yeah, I got it for 2 for 1 deal.  It's cool, it was legal at the time".  In that capacity trump is different by a big margin.  And again, that does not mean he's a good candidate.  But, he is a change.

You realize that Bernie fought to the end of the primaries. Even went so far as to have the delegates counted state by state at the convention. You realize that Trump has run before? Back then he wasn't flying off the handle and still demanding to fight even if he lost. And of course he couldn't deny the loopholes. But he is still denying all the sexual assault allegations even though he even told people how he does it.

Again you're right. He isn't a good candidate. But Politics isn't supposed to be entertainment. Its the direction of the country being laid out by the people. Like you said, if you are more interested in entertainment, then maybe you should pursue that interest more. Smackdown is awesome. Hang out and watch Smackdown instead.

Oh, sure Bernie fought for the seat, you always have to fight for the seat.  But when that was taken away from him, he fell back in line with everyone else and by default, he has to back hillary.  His party expect that of him.  In that, he becomes another Ted Cruz where he must back the nominee.  All that made him different is no longer there.  When a wreslter loses numer 1 contender, that's it.  But that Wreslter doesn't go out and tell others to cheer for the guy that beat him.  And in that, it's politics as usual, and in that there is no change.  The political system is a farce and a joke and apparently when hillary wins, they cycle continues.  And whatever party takes over after her, the same cycle.  At least trump is a wild card.  It's the devil we know and the devil we don't know. 

What does sexual assault allegations have to do with this?  Bill went up and down the white house touching tail all day.  None relevent.  And so what Trump ran before.  It was with a 3rd party that couldn't get their shit together.  Maybe change didn't occur back then, but now he has it.  Matt Hardy didn't have it until this year after he got broken.  None relevant. What changes occur when you mention any of that?  Every other candidate is still nothing but a polititican wholly grasping on to keeping this old archaic system that's not worked for a long time. 

And no, Smackdown is not awesome.  It's just better than raw and most of the time it only wins by default because of 2 hour format.  And please, don't dismiss my interest as nothing but for entertaiment.  It is a concern I have that we not repeat the same old ways of doing things that clearly has not worked.  With Hillary it's the same old stuff repackaged this time in her.  Great, Roman reigns again.



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Ouroboros24 said:

Okay, you're thinking to broadly about this.  When I say change, he already made the change, at least in my view, the same view that was in the OP.  The change was that he was not one of them.  Not completely, at least.  In Wrestling, you have to look for the small nuiances about wrestlers.  We have big ones, we have medium ones, and we have small ones.  In all categories there are many of each big, medium and small.  But in wrestling, when you see that big one or medium or small, that is different from the rest, you know there is a change.  A small change, but a change nonetheless.  The change I'm talking about is that Donald is different.  Is it a big difference, herhaps not, but there is enough there for someone like me to realize there is a difference and I'm sure you can list a few things that he IS that is different. 

As for Bernie, I don't see it.  At least not that big a difference.  Bernie had different ideas, but not too different from Hillary.  Yeah he wanted to legalize **, and of course other things I don't want to research for the sake of this reply.  But ultimately he is the same as Hillary in my eyes.  He has been there for 30+ years.  He is less notorious, but he acts just like everyone other politician.  He goes on stage to talk, he has the perfect record for a political career, he will abide by the Demos as he should.  He speaks like politician does and acts as a politician does.  

When ask of Trump to acknowledge the winner, his answer akined to, "I'll think about it."  Bernies was, "yeah, I concede.  Because that's the thing to do for a politician."  When trump was against other repubs, his was, "no, f these guys, I'm not coming to a debate that's all robotic, logical, and maneuvered."  We hear Marco autoreply himself just because he's still so green.  We hear Ted "bundy" cruz, after all the stupid shit trump said about his daddy and wife, because it was part of what Dems or Repubs would do because of tradition, and still he backs the bastard.  When real people would be like, "No, Calvin, fuck that, you said my wife was a whore.  We ain't buds anymore.  Fuck your presidential aspirations.  Bitch!"

But no.  It's all the same answers.  Same people.  Same mindset.  Same actions in course to what's expected of them.  When asked about his use of loop holes in his business woes, Trump's answer was in the likes of, "yeah, I got it for 2 for 1 deal.  It's cool, it was legal at the time".  In that capacity trump is different by a big margin.  And again, that does not mean he's a good candidate.  But, he is a change.

Change? Less compromise and civility for more chaos and belligerency. Vote Trump,he is the Molotov cocktail that will burn it all down. Change.



If you want change there is only one thing you can do. Vote for people who aren't bought by moneyed interests.



I LOVE ICELAND!

All you need to know is that Hilary and Trump are shit.



                
       ---Member of the official Squeezol Fanclub---

JustcallmeRiff said:
Ouroboros24 said:

Okay, you're thinking to broadly about this.  When I say change, he already made the change, at least in my view, the same view that was in the OP.  The change was that he was not one of them.  Not completely, at least.  In Wrestling, you have to look for the small nuiances about wrestlers.  We have big ones, we have medium ones, and we have small ones.  In all categories there are many of each big, medium and small.  But in wrestling, when you see that big one or medium or small, that is different from the rest, you know there is a change.  A small change, but a change nonetheless.  The change I'm talking about is that Donald is different.  Is it a big difference, herhaps not, but there is enough there for someone like me to realize there is a difference and I'm sure you can list a few things that he IS that is different. 

As for Bernie, I don't see it.  At least not that big a difference.  Bernie had different ideas, but not too different from Hillary.  Yeah he wanted to legalize **, and of course other things I don't want to research for the sake of this reply.  But ultimately he is the same as Hillary in my eyes.  He has been there for 30+ years.  He is less notorious, but he acts just like everyone other politician.  He goes on stage to talk, he has the perfect record for a political career, he will abide by the Demos as he should.  He speaks like politician does and acts as a politician does.  

When ask of Trump to acknowledge the winner, his answer akined to, "I'll think about it."  Bernies was, "yeah, I concede.  Because that's the thing to do for a politician."  When trump was against other repubs, his was, "no, f these guys, I'm not coming to a debate that's all robotic, logical, and maneuvered."  We hear Marco autoreply himself just because he's still so green.  We hear Ted "bundy" cruz, after all the stupid shit trump said about his daddy and wife, because it was part of what Dems or Repubs would do because of tradition, and still he backs the bastard.  When real people would be like, "No, Calvin, fuck that, you said my wife was a whore.  We ain't buds anymore.  Fuck your presidential aspirations.  Bitch!"

But no.  It's all the same answers.  Same people.  Same mindset.  Same actions in course to what's expected of them.  When asked about his use of loop holes in his business woes, Trump's answer was in the likes of, "yeah, I got it for 2 for 1 deal.  It's cool, it was legal at the time".  In that capacity trump is different by a big margin.  And again, that does not mean he's a good candidate.  But, he is a change.

Change? Less compromise and civility for more chaos and belligerency. Vote Trump,he is the Molotov cocktail that will burn it all down. Change.

That's all assumptions.  Less compromise and civility can easily translate to more assertiveness and a productivity towards positive goals.  With another politician like Hillary you are performing the same experiment that has failed over and over and over again.  Give a businessman a chance.  They gave an actor a chance and the Berlan Wall fell.  That's all I'm saying.  So he's rude, vulgar, misogynistic, impulsive.  You act like there has never been a president like that in the history of America.  Look at roosevelt who hunted, drank, smoked, and good lord knows what else he's done, yet we know him as FDR and we all know him just by those 3 letters.  



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KungKras said:
If you want change there is only one thing you can do. Vote for people who aren't bought by moneyed interests.

I want a change, not David blaine to perform magic. 



Ouroboros24 said:
bunchanumbers said:

You realize that Bernie fought to the end of the primaries. Even went so far as to have the delegates counted state by state at the convention. You realize that Trump has run before? Back then he wasn't flying off the handle and still demanding to fight even if he lost. And of course he couldn't deny the loopholes. But he is still denying all the sexual assault allegations even though he even told people how he does it.

Again you're right. He isn't a good candidate. But Politics isn't supposed to be entertainment. Its the direction of the country being laid out by the people. Like you said, if you are more interested in entertainment, then maybe you should pursue that interest more. Smackdown is awesome. Hang out and watch Smackdown instead.

Oh, sure Bernie fought for the seat, you always have to fight for the seat.  But when that was taken away from him, he fell back in line with everyone else and by default, he has to back hillary.  His party expect that of him.  In that, he becomes another Ted Cruz where he must back the nominee.  All that made him different is no longer there.  When a wreslter loses numer 1 contender, that's it.  But that Wreslter doesn't go out and tell others to cheer for the guy that beat him.  And in that, it's politics as usual, and in that there is no change.  The political system is a farce and a joke and apparently when hillary wins, they cycle continues.  And whatever party takes over after her, the same cycle.  At least trump is a wild card.  It's the devil we know and the devil we don't know. 

What does sexual assault allegations have to do with this?  Bill went up and down the white house touching tail all day.  None relevent.  And so what Trump ran before.  It was with a 3rd party that couldn't get their shit together.  Maybe change didn't occur back then, but now he has it.  Matt Hardy didn't have it until this year after he got broken.  None relevant. What changes occur when you mention any of that?  Every other candidate is still nothing but a polititican wholly grasping on to keeping this old archaic system that's not worked for a long time. 

And no, Smackdown is not awesome.  It's just better than raw and most of the time it only wins by default because of 2 hour format.  And please, don't dismiss my interest as nothing but for entertaiment.  It is a concern I have that we not repeat the same old ways of doing things that clearly has not worked.  With Hillary it's the same old stuff repackaged this time in her.  Great, Roman reigns again.

But there's a difference. If you have Matt Hardy being broken that's fine. Its just him trying to save a floundering promotion. Trump gets in and its pretty much the end of civilization. This election you're pretty much voting for the fate of the world. Its great you're looking for change and all, but this isn't exactly change that will benefit mankind. As crazy as it sounds, I'm expecting much better politicians in 4 years. This year voters have shown their disdain for the system. Next election, we'll get actual politicians that can affect real change in a real way.

And yes. Smackdown is awesome. I've enjoyed it ever since the brand split. Its no Ring of Honor, but its still awesome.



bunchanumbers said:
Ouroboros24 said:

Oh, sure Bernie fought for the seat, you always have to fight for the seat.  But when that was taken away from him, he fell back in line with everyone else and by default, he has to back hillary.  His party expect that of him.  In that, he becomes another Ted Cruz where he must back the nominee.  All that made him different is no longer there.  When a wreslter loses numer 1 contender, that's it.  But that Wreslter doesn't go out and tell others to cheer for the guy that beat him.  And in that, it's politics as usual, and in that there is no change.  The political system is a farce and a joke and apparently when hillary wins, they cycle continues.  And whatever party takes over after her, the same cycle.  At least trump is a wild card.  It's the devil we know and the devil we don't know. 

What does sexual assault allegations have to do with this?  Bill went up and down the white house touching tail all day.  None relevent.  And so what Trump ran before.  It was with a 3rd party that couldn't get their shit together.  Maybe change didn't occur back then, but now he has it.  Matt Hardy didn't have it until this year after he got broken.  None relevant. What changes occur when you mention any of that?  Every other candidate is still nothing but a polititican wholly grasping on to keeping this old archaic system that's not worked for a long time. 

And no, Smackdown is not awesome.  It's just better than raw and most of the time it only wins by default because of 2 hour format.  And please, don't dismiss my interest as nothing but for entertaiment.  It is a concern I have that we not repeat the same old ways of doing things that clearly has not worked.  With Hillary it's the same old stuff repackaged this time in her.  Great, Roman reigns again.

But there's a difference. If you have Matt Hardy being broken that's fine. Its just him trying to save a floundering promotion. Trump gets in and its pretty much the end of civilization. This election you're pretty much voting for the fate of the world. Its great you're looking for change and all, but this isn't exactly change that will benefit mankind. As crazy as it sounds, I'm expecting much better politicians in 4 years. This year voters have shown their disdain for the system. Next election, we'll get actual politicians that can affect real change in a real way.

And yes. Smackdown is awesome. I've enjoyed it ever since the brand split. Its no Ring of Honor, but its still awesome.

"Trump gets in and its pretty much the end of civilization."

Oh my Gosh, dude, that's hella assumption and speculation and you know it.  And we're going to wait another 4 years for a possible change when it's starring us in the face right now.  What, don't tell me you're holding out for Jesse Ventura.  Because have you seen the people running this year?  Bernie is done, btw.  Too old. I'm not saying we're going to get change with trump, but he's the better experiment than Hillary.  She's been wanting to run since Gore.  So she loses to Obama, but then 8 years later she's ready and better at it?  She's better at smiling, better at her words, better from being grilled on all her pass darken clouds.  Common, bro.

And no, rating would speak volumes about smackdown and raw.  No, not awesome.  After the brand split, it's a jumper cable, that's all.  Don't give them an excuse to keep being mediocre. 



Ouroboros24 said:
bunchanumbers said:

But there's a difference. If you have Matt Hardy being broken that's fine. Its just him trying to save a floundering promotion. Trump gets in and its pretty much the end of civilization. This election you're pretty much voting for the fate of the world. Its great you're looking for change and all, but this isn't exactly change that will benefit mankind. As crazy as it sounds, I'm expecting much better politicians in 4 years. This year voters have shown their disdain for the system. Next election, we'll get actual politicians that can affect real change in a real way.

And yes. Smackdown is awesome. I've enjoyed it ever since the brand split. Its no Ring of Honor, but its still awesome.

"Trump gets in and its pretty much the end of civilization."

Oh my Gosh, dude, that's hella assumption and speculation and you know it.  And we're going to wait another 4 years for a possible change when it's starring us in the face right now.  What, don't tell me you're holding out for Jesse Ventura.  Because have you seen the people running this year?  Bernie is done, btw.  Too old. I'm not saying we're going to get change with trump, but he's the better experiment than Hillary.  She's been wanting to run since Gore.  So she loses to Obama, but then 8 years later she's ready and better at it?  She's better at smiling, better at her words, better from being grilled on all her pass darken clouds.  Common, bro.

And no, rating would speak volumes about smackdown and raw.  No, not awesome.  After the brand split, it's a jumper cable, that's all.  Don't give them an excuse to keep being mediocre. 

But change isn't really staring us in the face. Its one guy. This one guy isn't going to change the entire system. He will need the support of congress and the senate. Pretty much all those guys he turned on and insulted during his campaign. They will not support any of his ideas or policies. If you thought the republican congress and senate against Obama was bad, this is going to be even worse. The one thing he will have control over will be the nuclear codes and executive orders. He'll end up using those against everyone who ever wronged him in his own mind and it will not be pretty.

Not to mention Supreme court justices. He'll end up dragging the country back 75 years with his choices.

And no. Ratings don't speak anything about how awesome a product is. There are smaller promotions that have lower ratings and are awesome.



bunchanumbers said:
Ouroboros24 said:

"Trump gets in and its pretty much the end of civilization."

Oh my Gosh, dude, that's hella assumption and speculation and you know it.  And we're going to wait another 4 years for a possible change when it's starring us in the face right now.  What, don't tell me you're holding out for Jesse Ventura.  Because have you seen the people running this year?  Bernie is done, btw.  Too old. I'm not saying we're going to get change with trump, but he's the better experiment than Hillary.  She's been wanting to run since Gore.  So she loses to Obama, but then 8 years later she's ready and better at it?  She's better at smiling, better at her words, better from being grilled on all her pass darken clouds.  Common, bro.

And no, rating would speak volumes about smackdown and raw.  No, not awesome.  After the brand split, it's a jumper cable, that's all.  Don't give them an excuse to keep being mediocre. 

But change isn't really staring us in the face. Its one guy. This one guy isn't going to change the entire system. He will need the support of congress and the senate. Pretty much all those guys he turned on and insulted during his campaign. They will not support any of his ideas or policies. If you thought the republican congress and senate against Obama was bad, this is going to be even worse. The one thing he will have control over will be the nuclear codes and executive orders. He'll end up using those against everyone who ever wronged him in his own mind and it will not be pretty.

Not to mention Supreme court justices. He'll end up dragging the country back 75 years with his choices.

And no. Ratings don't speak anything about how awesome a product is. There are smaller promotions that have lower ratings and are awesome.

I didn't say he was going to change the entire system, I simply argue that he is a change in the machine.  With another politician, history tells us it's more of the same.  Hillary is up there right now because she played the best politician out of everyone one else.  And who knows if Trump can't get the support he needs to do what needs to be done?  I'm not saying he will.  I'm saying, there is a shot because we're not repeating history.   As for all the guys he's upset, so what.  Seems to me you're giving him little credit.  So now Hillary is going to be the great unify?  Again speculations.  We don't know.  I'm not giving out any certainties here.  I'm arguing that it's a change from what we've been doing.  That's all. 

Nuclear codes and executive orders.  Speculations.  You act like this guy killed someone before.  He's a rich kid from new york, but I don't think he's ever killed anyone.  And you know what, I think he could have if he wanted to, he's rich enough.  He has family here.  He's not the monster everyone paints him to be.  Bro, you're telling me he's going to get upset one day, head straight for the button and push?  He's not going to have advisors, generals, his vice president, his family, his friends, etc to guide him on not pushing?  Let's not fear monger this strictly on speculation. 

Ratings speak volumes, but they don't tell the whole story.  I'll give you that.  But when you're watching smackdown live and your champion is wrestling a nobody for the main event, albeit a comedic role for your former champion, that does not make it awesome.  Dean Ambrose is faltering.  He used to be hot(at least as hot as the product gets in modern), right now he's resting on his laurels.  No one else other than the Miz and Ziggler making any noise.  Fruit roll-ups as finishers?  No, not awesome.  mediocre.