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Forums - Gaming - How microsoft plan to stealthily bring back Always Online

Puppyroach said:
Well, isn't PS Now Sonys first step into this as well? Or do people actually think they don't want this future as well? Personally, I hope both companies go this route sooner rather than later.

There is a big difference.  You need internet to buy ps now from psn.  You dont need internet to buy a game on a disc.  If it enhances the game and is completely voluntarily without any new limitations to the consumer who wont take a leap of faith then im all for it but this is the same company that said mandatory ceck ins every 24 hours or you console would stop working.. 

 

In a more general way think of it like this.  Even if you dont buy movies at retail,  wouldnt it be concerning if tomorrow you could only stream movies? If you didnt have the option at least and had to just hope noone would utilize digital monopoly to keep prices as high as possible. 

 

This is coming from someone who only buys games digitally and the only tv im watching is netflix so im well aware of the positives to an all digital future.  In the end the best thing for consumers is choice



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gergroy said:
Dr.Henry_Killinger said:
gergroy said:

Did you even look at what i was referencing?  Or is your mind just completely set in pessimistic mode on this subject?

Read your own article, they say it "could be" not it is Crackdown tech. Not to mention that demo was done interally, with a direct connection to MS's server farm.

You said they could use it to offload things for cool purposes, I refuted that doing that over the Cloud is ridiculously impractical. You respond with how offloading could still be done over some kind of networking, semantics aside. I counter that with how the only things that could be offloaded without a performance hit that makes it counterproductive, so its not substaintial. No pessimism here. Just realism.

"Read your own article, they say "could be" not is Crackdown tech."

huh?  Did you skip this part?

Yes,”Spencer said, “build demo was early Crackdown work.” 

Now, obviously that doesnt mean that the final game will have this tech in it, but it is from crackdown.  So they are obviously playing around with the idea. 

This whole argument, and your attitude on the subject, just seem silly to me.  We are sitting here looking at video proof of how this kind of technology can be utilized and you are still saying it isnt possible. 

Correction

Yes,” Spencer said, “build demo was early Crackdown work.” The demo was shown at Microsoft's developer-centric Build conference in San Francisco, and was presented as a new prototype for PC.

Is what he said, didn't mention xb1 but you where right it is crack down.

Look, I don't get why your projecting all of things on to me...well I do, but I don't care. I don't have an attitude, I'm just a realist, and anyone with any idea of how networking works knows that this is widly impractical.

I never said it was impossible, mind you, just not very useful.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Internet_connection_speed

The US is 11 right now, that is terrible.

Maybe when connection speeds are better but def not now.




In this day and age, with the Internet, ignorance is a choice! And they're still choosing Ignorance! - Dr. Filthy Frank

Intrinsic said:
gergroy said:

I honestly dont think it is bad for gamers at all.  Whens the last time you traded in a pc game or an indie game?  Does that stop you or millions of others from buying those types of games?  Nope, it doesnt.  All these arguments about always online just strike me as argument for arguments sake.  It isnt and wouldnt be a bid deal for 99.9% of the people making a stink about it.

 

Do you have any idea how many people buy used games? Do you have any idea how many people sell games to allow them purchase new ones? Yet you feel that only 0.1% of every gamer out there would be affected by something like that?

I understand that you are talking about all digital games, but these PC games and indie games you are talking about doesn't cost $60. I will put it like this, go back and watch the sony 2013 E3 conference, go back and look at all the MS policy changes from reveal tt launch of the XB1. What all those things will tell you is how much people care and how big of a deal any kinda always online to play games is. This is just a tactfully better way of doing the same thing they were trying to do in the first place.

Well, 0% of pc gamers buy used games, they dont seem to mind buying new (and yes, pc games can cost $60).  Part of the problem is the x1 was reveal was the way they went about it.  Trying to hide drm and being sneaky about it.  Another problem is that they were the only ones doing it.  I think they expected Sony to have a similar policy and were caught off guard when they didnt. 

However, I fully believe that if sony had come out with drm policies as well, people would have grumbled a little maybe, but mkst people would have just accepted without much of an issue.

My guess, next round of consoles will be always online with integrated drm and nobody will care.  World wasnt ready for it yet, but both sony and microsoft seem to be doing stuff that will prepare people for a always connected future so that it isnt an issue in the next gen.  



Don't worry ... Microsoft aren't that stupid to alienate offline only experiences so give them some more benefit of the doubt.

They'll figure out some way to make the game playable offline so that it doesn't get out of hand.



Intrinsic said:

 

Why is this so hard to understand?????

Streaming a game off the cloud is different from needing the cloud to run the games that you have in your house and have paid for.

PSnow, is a service. You pay $4, $10, $20, monthly or whatever to have access to a game for a certain period of time. You do NOT own this game. You are paying to recieve a video feed of the game while its running off sony's servers. You do NOT need to own a console to even use this service, you can use it off a PS3, PSvita, PS4 or directly from a TV that has the streaming app built into it without the need for a console. Thats it.

What MS is doing, is making it such that games that you OWN. That you go into a store and BUY. That sits on a shelf in YOUR HOUSE. That belongs to YOU. Will not work on your XB1 cause your XB1 technically doesn't have everything it needs to run the game anymore. The game needs the cloud to run some parts of it. So no cloud/internet access. No game. Period.

A literal equivalent will be like saying, you go and buy your copy of (insert a game series you love here) so you can play that game on your (insert whichever console you have here), but when you get home you cannot play the game cause you aren't connected to the internet. And this is a single player game not multiplayer.

There is no need to be upset just because we have different viewpoints in this matter.

What is there to stop Sony from doing exactly what you described on PS Now? Imagine if the next game in Little Big Planet series as to release on PS3 and only o PS Now for sale? Offering a streaming service is the perfect way to have complete control over the consumer. What MS is aying is that more and more games will have usage of the cloud, therefore being constantly online will become a requirement.

You are way to focused on physcal copies of games. DRM expands into the realm of digital only aswell you know.



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S.T.A.G.E. said:

 

Microsoft doesn't fully understand yet how the console realm works. Sony does. They know you have to work in steps and not force things into full on existence. It will bring about ridiculous charges and things of that ilk. Taking steps will save you money and also help the audience move along with you. You can force things onto the PC audeince because with the PC realm no one is created equal. If you dont want it you don't have to use it. If you put it on consoles since everyone is treated equally under a closed OS they could become victimized by said choies. PS Now is ready to release. Sony isn't going anywhere as far as Microsoft is with the cloud. Microsoft is selling a promise they haven't revealed much of anything for just yet.

So what you are saying is that Sony are smarter at screwing customer over than MS? PS+ is actually a good example of that, and the price on PS Now aren´t exactly great as far as I´ve heard.



gergroy said:

Well, 0% of pc gamers buy used games, they dont seem to mind buying new (and yes, pc games can cost $60).  Part of the problem is the x1 was reveal was the way they went about it.  Trying to hide drm and being sneaky about it.  Another problem is that they were the only ones doing it.  I think they expected Sony to have a similar policy and were caught off guard when they didnt. 

However, I fully believe that if sony had come out with drm policies as well, people would have grumbled a little maybe, but mkst people would have just accepted without much of an issue.

My guess, next round of consoles will be always online with integrated drm and nobody will care.  World wasnt ready for it yet, but both sony and microsoft seem to be doing stuff that will prepare people for a always connected future so that it isnt an issue in the next gen.  

The funny thing is, you are completely right with whatyou just said here, the sad thing is that it doesn't maean the practice in of itself is right.

I don't think sony is a saint or that they wouldn't jump on this if given a chance, after all sony charges for online multiplayer now which was free on the PS3 cause MS got away with it. I don't want a gaming future where you have to be connected for your games to work. I think that i scrossing the line.

First we had to be connected to play online. Thats ok, it made sense. Then it was that you had to pay to be able to use your already existing internet connection and play your games online. I hated and still hate this.  But I was already paying for PS+ that had added value to it that had nothing to do with online mutiplayer, so I saw nothing wrong with paying to continue getting games anyway and pretend that i wasn't also paying to play my games online. Gamers dealt with that. Now MS is trying to make us actually require online to even be able to make us play our games???? Naaaaaahhhh... that right there is crossing the line.



fatslob-:O said:
Don't worry ... Microsoft aren't that stupid to alienate offline only experiences so give them some more benefit of the doubt.

They'll figure out some way to make the game playable offline so that it doesn't get out of hand.

I dunno



In this day and age, with the Internet, ignorance is a choice! And they're still choosing Ignorance! - Dr. Filthy Frank

WOW at people equating PS Now, which is an optional and completely seperate platform to PS4, to MS possibly integrating cloud processing as a core component to all their games in the future.

These are two completely different things. Why was PS Now even brought up in this thread. I don't get it?



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gergroy said:
Raziel123 said:
gergroy said:


Why would it have to be ps4 games?  


Then what?


Well, lets trace this subject back to its origin, shall we?  Somebody said what is stopping sony from making a game exclusive to psnow.  Meaning that game would always need to be online in order to play it.  

You said not possible as it is ps3 infrastucture and all ps3 games are available at retail...

however, that does not stop new games from being made that are exclusive to the psnow program.  Just because it is starting out as a service for old ps3 games doesnt mean it will always be that way.  In fact, it is pretty much guaranteed that as time goes on they will upgrade their infrastructure and add more games that havent been on any sony console before.  

One even more likely example would be regional exclusive games being put on psnow.  If somebody doesnt want to pay the huge cost of importing a game, psnow would be their only option.  Which would require that game being always online.

The door is WIDE open for sony to use their cloud service to require online as well. 


Of course there cloud service requires online, because it streams games over the internet.
But the day they use it to process thingymabobs in a native game, we will question and analyse their motives as well.
Right now, all Gaikai is, is for ps now to stream old games to various devices, and stream ps4 games to vita.

nothing more