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Forums - Sony Discussion - The Absolutely Worst Thing Sony Can Do in the Upcoming Console Gen is Release a Moderately Powerful Console

I'm predicting big config for PS4.

+ AMD next A10 APU (Steamroller)
+ AMD HD8770 or superior dedicaded
+ 4 GB GDDR5 at 192GB/sec
+ 28nm
+ APU + GPU < 400mm^2
+  2-2.5 TFLOPS
+ < 200 TDP



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The worst thing they could possibly do would be releasing an overly powerful console. It would be DOA... They need to release at a similar level to what the X720 will be if they want to have any chance at survival in the console market



EdHieron said:

The Absolutely Worst Thing Sony Can Do in the Upcoming Console Gen is Release a Moderately Powerful Console

Reports and rumours keep coming in that Sony is only going to release a moderately powerful console next genwhile Microsoft is going to release a much more powerful console.

In my honest opinion, that is the absolutely worst move that Sony can make.  Why?  The Playstation 3 became ( or will become) the Second Bestselling console of the 7th Gen by delivering far superior third party content to Wii that was on a par with the 360 while at the same time delivery breathtaking exclusives like "Uncharted", "Metal Gear Solid IV",  and the upcoming "The Last of of Us" and "Beyond Two Souls" that were graphically and technologically far superior to anything that had ever been released on consoles before. 

If Sony only delivers a moderately power console next gen and Microsoft releases a significantly more powerful console next gen, then expect all of those gamers that picked up the PS3 to have experiences like those mentioned above to favor the significantly more powerful console next time and move to Microsoft's next console.  Also, don't expect Sony to get anywhere near the third party support it did this gen as most Western console gaming deelopment would be geared toward the only console actually on the bleeding edge of technology next gen ( if Sony goes the moderate route) the Nextbox.

And on the other hand, since the Wii U will be cheaper and has a lineup of gaming content aimed at more casual consumers that are less interested in being on the cutting edge of technology ( than the types of gamers that fueled the Playstation 3's success ie. fans of games like "Uncharted", "God of War",  "Beyond Two Souls", "MGS4", "GT5", and acceptable versions of cutting edge third party games) a Plystation 4 that was only halfway between WiiU and Nextbox in specs simply wouldn't fare that well against either Wii U or 720.

I sincerely think the worst move Sony can make is to only release a new console that is only moderately powerful rather than going all out and releasing a console as powerful as the next Microsoft console  is rumored to be.  They would lose most of the audience that the PS3 had to 720 (due to exclusives that wouldn't be able to run on hardware that would wow like PS3 exlusives and the loss of third party support to the more powerful Nextbox) if they did that and the type of gamers that make up the typical Sony audience and the exclusive games that make up the typical gaming experiences on Sony consoles just aren't the same types of exclusive games that appeal to the typical Nintendo audience that usually tend to do well for Nintendo regardless of technical specifications and versus a significantly lower priced Wii U.

What do you think?

It's simple.  release a console that is what 360 is to PS3.  That is, less powerful but still gets the 3rd party support.  Sony and third parties have a good relationship and they won't ignore a Playstation (home console anyway).  They won't bother to take advantage of nextbox's power much like PS3 hasn't been taken advantage of other than by first parties.  People forget it's been 6 years.  Even if they release a console that has moderate specs by todays gaming PC standards, it'll still be miles ahead of what PS3 was and the RAM issue will most definitely be resolved.  Not to mention ND, SSM, Sucker Punch, MM, and all the other top notch first party studios will deliver fantastic exclusives that will wow people graphically.  I mean Halo 4 was wowing people and that was on a less powerful system.  Expect the next Uncharted to look stunning even if the hardware isn't as good as nextbox.




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look at it this way, many 3rd party developer's  stated  the  PS3  Has been a nightmare to develop for, so for one their game engines were not designed for the PS3's system design anyway. this time is if Sony does make use of 3rd Party Game engine friendly Hardware, will it really matter if Microsoft put's out a more powerful system than say the new PS4? or what ever their going to call it. for one Do you think Microsoft will get really anymore 3rd party exclusives based on it's hardware, and Not some deal with a contract, just like sony and Nintendo also do. without some deal the 3rd pary is going to put their software on as many platforms as they can to make profit off of investment. which is getting more expensive anyway. these platforms are mainly made for inhouse teams pretty much anyway. because it's the 1st party that defines your platform, unless the 3rd party makes an exclusive or you pay to have one made. with the cost's that are now, and the increased cost's for next generation 3rd party exclusives will no longer really be that viable unless your company pay's for them.

Thus, investment into your own 3rd party will give you that ability to define your platform even if it's not the most robust platform out there, with digital downloaded content being a very console centric function this generation, would you see many just letting that content go to waste next generation, if the consumer like's the series if a new part of the series get's released on the next platform as an exclusive.

Well to tell you what, Microsoft has done a Fantastic job in advancing the xbox as a platform. Not saying other wise, but this is not all a "every thing is all rose's" Kinda picture also. 

The larger Problem for Microsoft is not so much Sony or Nintendo, it's going to be it's own fanbase. 

This is not against the xbox360 fanbase as a negative, because my family owns one, what I am talking about, is what to expect from the fanbase moving forward with support of more than one xbox platform on the market at the very same time. 

Now that does not mean that the xbox360 will not still be used, No what i am talking about, is when the next xbox 720 or what ever Microsoft call's it. what happens to Microsoft's xbox360 in the market in 
North America? 

Both Sony and Nintendo have already proven that they can support more than one playstation and more than one Nintendo console in the market at the same time, Microsoft has yet to prove such a daunting Task. 

The fact that Microsoft will have it's new xbox on the market in a year or two, the Question to ask is what's Microsoft's attempt on support for the xbox360 will be when the next xbox get's released? 

if Halo is the main stay , along with Forza, and Gear's, and other ip's, will Microsoft keep putting in a real effort for the xbox360 even though the next xbox will be out, not just one year but multiple year's for the xbox360 or will microsoft Move on if the install base move's to the next xbox "720" or what ever they are going to call it. would many xbox360 current user's look at the next Halo being only a "720" exclusive what about the xbox360 Halo "spin off than"? 

will the install base keep the xbox360 as much as a viable option for Microsoft as much as they would for the next xbox? 

truth be told, deep down, I do not think so. While Microsoft has great games, i just do not think the xbox fanbase will support TWO xbox platforms at the same time, and i think Microsoft know's this. So i think that Microsoft may regulate the xbox360 as the go "to" casual box for Microsoft, while the next xbox is for the core mainly. but the point is would the instal base of core xbox platform player's support this move. once again i doubt it. 

that is a problem Microsoft has that Nintendo and Sony do not in my opinion

that's what I think is the real Question, can Microsoft's install base keep two xbox platform console's viable at the same time?

its less about power and more about the install base of each platform , the question would the PS3 user's move on to next xbox for no other reason other than "its the most robust in it's hardware" or go with the platform's iP's they like the most!

Is it more about Power for the Playstation  install base?, or is it more about the game's for the Playstation install base?. 



I AM BOLO

100% lover "nothing else matter's" after that...

ps:

Proud psOne/2/3/p owner.  I survived Aplcalyps3 and all I got was this lousy Signature.

Desertghost said:
"Sales" only interest fanboys for bragging.

I'm pretty sure that sales are a lot more important in Sony's view than power.

More importantly, I'm pretty sure the thing that Sony cares most about is profit. Since the consumer doesn't want to pay massive amounts for a console, for Sony to make a console with a lot of power, they would have to take a significant loss per console for the first few years. We saw this with the PS3 - Sony still hasn't made back the money lost in the first four years. That it's now starting to make a profit is good for Sony, it's one of the few parts of the company that is in the black right now.

And that's precisely WHY Sony can't possibly go for a highly powerful console in the next generation. Six years ago, Sony could afford to put a lot of money into the PS3. They don't have that money to spend any more, and they can't borrow it, either, due to their credit rating issue. They necessarily have to keep their gaming division in the black over the next few years. Even launching a new console is going to be difficult for them, as new consoles typically produce a net loss for at least one year, unless their price is above the manufacturing cost by a reasonable amount (as Nintendo has done with most previous consoles, the Wii U being a slight deviation from their usual approach).

We know that the Wii U is only somewhat more powerful than the 360 and PS3 (in total - I'm aware that the CPU is slower, but the GPGPU makes up for that). We can be pretty certain that MS, who have lots of money to play with and who are comfortably in the black even without factoring in their gaming division, will be going for the very powerful approach, and will likely be taking a significant loss on their new console for a couple of years, at least. Sony simply doesn't have a chance to have the most powerful console on the market, unless they try to wait until, say, 2016 (at which point, they might be able to edge past MS's 2013-2014 console without taking too big a hit).

Assuming that Sony does release no later than 2014, they have two choices, as a result of this, as management would immediately be fired if they put out a system that they knew would produce massive losses in their current circumstances.

Anyone who suggests that this is so long that they didn't read it is an idiot.

Option 1 is to release a powerful console, that is somewhat less powerful than the Xbox Successor (XS). This puts them in a tough situation - a console noticeably less powerful than the XS, at a comparable price (as MS can afford to take a much bigger loss), without the sort of brand recognition that the PS3 got to enjoy (the Wii now holds the brand recognition benefit, not PS), and with fewer exclusives outside of Japan. The only region that might keep them from completely folding would be Japan, and many Japanese developers seem to be supporting the Wii U quite strongly. Furthermore, due to MS's direction with Kinect, etc, many XS titles will make use of Kinect, and Sony only has the technically inferior Eye to keep them from losing functionality entirely.

Option 2 is to release a console that is somewhat more powerful than the Wii U, but well behind the XS. With Move being the more technically capable controller (although not yet used as well as the Wiimote has been), Sony would be able to attract superior versions of Wii U titles more often (touch being the one thing that Sony needs to provide some option for). With the one year delay and the lack of a full UPad to have to pay for, Sony would be able to afford to have a more powerful system for a lower manufacturing cost than the Wii U's launch price, resulting in the ability to potentially match the launch price with a visible improvement in power, while breaking even on every console sold.

Furthermore, Sony and MS first-party exclusives bear a lot more resemblance to one another than Sony's first-party exclusives do to Nintendo's. By focusing their attention on Nintendo, Sony ensures brand differentiation from both competitors, better diversity of games than the XS, mostly better-quality multiplatform games than the Wii U, and a greater chance of keeping their Japanese development support. Meanwhile, developers will be forced to support the Wii U and Sony's new console, because the XS won't be outselling both combined from the beginning, and dev costs for XS games will be higher. Without the broader base created by having multiple platforms, developers will only put their biggest franchises or their shovelware on XS, as other titles won't make enough money.

Will so-called "hardcore" gamers choose the XS? Probably. But just as so many of them bought a Wii to make "PSWii" or "Wii60", as the old meme went, so too will they choose one of the lower power consoles to complete their gaming experience. If they go with Option 1, the "hardcore" will almost certainly choose the XS and then the Wii U as their second console, as Sony's console will get mostly the same games. If they go with Option 2, they'll probably choose Sony's new console over the Wii U as the second console, as it will be seen by them as the "superior" lower-power system, rather than the "inferior" higher-power system.

Note that I'm not saying that Sony will "win" if they do this. The net result of Option 2 isn't immediately obvious, unlike the net result of Option 1, which is not good for Sony. But it does give them a real chance to return to financial strength in the gaming industry - the ability to make a net profit from early in the generation, as they achieved with both the PS1 and PS2 (which were both the weakest systems of their gen, or close to it). Indeed, I would argue that this is the only way that Sony manages to retain ownership of the "PlayStation" brand and product - otherwise, they would likely find themselves in such a financial hole, they'd have to sell off their gaming division in order to stem the financial bleeding.

In fact, if I were in Sony's position, I'd consider looking at MS's idea of allowing tablets to connect with the 360, and adapt the idea... by having smartphones connect with their new console, as well as the Vita. While only a relative few own Vitas, and Tablets, while gaining in popularity, are still far less common than smartphones, smartphones themselves are almost ubiquitous. This would allow Sony to further improve the feature symmetry with the Wii U, to enable better multiplatform development with the Wii U, and thus help Sony to further appear as the best option to many people.



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PS3 has the worst exclusives. Look at the sales. Halo 4 sold easly 7m units while all recent games from Sony flopped hard (battle royale, ratchet all 4 one, modnation racer, little bit planet karting, starhawk, twisted metal etc..).

PS3 design is horrible, awful CPU, awful ram, awful GPU. Thats why all multiplatforms are working so bad on this console. And now Sony is also ruining established franchise like Ratcher and Little Big Planet with awful games.

 

-this post was moderated by amp316



Mario_pana said:
The Japanese don't care about graphics as much as the American PC nerds. Sony is going less powerful like the PS2 it will still sell more than anything Microsoft makes in the Console market.


True, also, doesn´t even matter if it sells more, what matter is if it TURNS A PROFIT. I say make whatever console you can make with a 50 dollars proffit margin.



My grammar errors are justified by the fact that I am a brazilian living in Brazil. I am also very stupid.

Piernik said:
PS3 has the worst exclusives. Look at the sales. Halo 4 sold easly 7m units while all recent games from Sony flopped hard (battle royale, ratchet all 4 one, modnation racer, little bit planet karting, starhawk, twisted metal etc..).

PS3 design is horrible, awful CPU, awful ram, awful GPU. Thats why all multiplatforms are working so bad on this console. And now Sony is also ruining established franchise like Ratcher and Little Big Planet with awful games.


Lies. However, what it really means is : "I only have money for a Xbox360, I am too lazy to work and buy all the consoles."

I have them all and, let me tell you, no problems with 3rd party games, also, my PS3 works just fine.

 

PS: Except for WiiU, but I will buy it when the exclusives arrive.

 

In topic, I see your point in saying PS3 hurt Sony, because it was sold at loss for so long. I say make a console that can turn a profit, period. The objective is NOT TO GO BANKRUPT, of course they can´t beat microsoft, the company farts money, but Sony can still survive.



My grammar errors are justified by the fact that I am a brazilian living in Brazil. I am also very stupid.

Sony would be smart to go back to their winning roots of releasing weaker hardware and winning via mass market price points.

But Sony seems dead set on high end stuff (relative to competition), and the PS3 graphic nuts would have a meltdown if Xbox had superior graphics :P....Sony has to keep those interests at heart lol



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

sales2099 said:
Sony would be smart to go back to their winning roots of releasing weaker hardware and winning via mass market price points.

But Sony seems dead set on high end stuff (relative to competition), and the PS3 graphic nuts would have a meltdown if Xbox had superior graphics :P....Sony has to keep those interests at heart lol


True... I imagine the good people at Sony think about these issues everyday, no one knows for sure what will work, and they are at such a dread situation, mistakes could be letal now...



My grammar errors are justified by the fact that I am a brazilian living in Brazil. I am also very stupid.