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Forums - Microsoft - Microsoft Kinect: Why it failed to do what it was supposed to do even though it was successful

oniyide on 27 October 2012
phenom08 said:
oniyide said:
 

you live in your own world as usual, SOny didnt put anywhere near the ads that mS did for Kinect thats not pushing, by that logic. When all those games flop we should just stop blaming companies as not pushing them and sending them out to die. Since that seems to be a popular excuse when a game someone like doenst do well. SOny already stated they made profit off of every Move equipment sold. so fail on your part. No Resort could have been made without it, it just would have sucked cause there would have been crappy accuracy. 

When you can show me an ounce of proof Sony didn't "push it" then you will have an arguement. Until then no, Move failed and Sony tried. If they didn't try it would have not been created. Sony making profit is irrelevant (they have been losing money all gen so good job on making profit on that).

P.S. Since this is offtopic, I wont be replying after this.

you were the one that brought it up, genuis. No proof of the nonsense you say, so you retreat as usual.



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sales2099 on 29 October 2012
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
The Kinect was a media darling but a concrete failure on pushing gaming. To anyone who denies the Kinect cut into the casual attention span they did, how much is truly the question. Microsoft had everybody in the American media under their thumb in 2010. 2011 the Wii's sales dropped drastically, especially in America. Its obvioius their focus changed because Americas purchasing habits on a casual end are media driven. Microsoft has shown the world that top notch marketing trumps being able to back up your cause.

It pushed gaming.....in the casual space. That may not benefit people like us, but hey when you get popular you expand into different audiences.

I get the feeling your trying to say how marketing has saved the Xbox brand, or at least kinect from being ignored by the public. Marketing can only do so much, the products have to deliever to keep those sales trends going long term. And they have, for both 360 and Kinect.

It didnt push anything the Wii or Move couldnt do better from a concrete and sheer control perspective. Sony knew it couldnt do shit because last gen it didnt work for them and the Natal team contacted them first with the Kinect prototype and they still turned it down before it even got into Microsofts hands. Marketing can only do so much? The Kinect and The Eye Toy served the same purpose (they were just in two different gens) and Sony did not shut down time square, they did not go on Jay Leno or any news broadcast. They had the same types of games the Kinect offered as well. People acted like they never saw Kinect-type tech before in America. This is called great marketing vs shitty timid marketing. I would love to see the percentage of Wii or Kinect activity in peoples houses today. I ask because I am sure after the first year it plummeted for the majority of people  (including the Move). More aggressive consumers have been conditioned by cellphone companies to purchase a new phone every two years. The mass audience loves a well marketed novelty.

Sony KNEW the Eyetoy was limited therefore they knew the Kinect was limited but they still tried it and still deemed it limited tech even though it had more powerful parts. R&D knew they had to add something to make the tracking more precise and fluid. The Wii helped in the hybrid concept because Sony saw it as more of a competent tech that could help evolve the tracking in even a way the Wii couldnt do itself without a camera. It could control depth. I bet next gen Microsoft will come up with a peripheral device to complement the Kinect much like the Move compliments the PSEye and it will still outsell it. It will control the 3D space exactly the same as the Move. Microsoft will show Sony how to  market such a product. After that, tell me it isnt marketing. Your name is Sales for crying out loud, you should know this better than anyone.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoJ1ZNYODUg

Sony and Microsoft do business different. Sony spends more money making games than marketing them, Microsoft does the opposite. 

Given the lack of success with Move, I think your critique that Sony turned down Kinect tech shows they lost their touch in business. Marketing and the buzz of a new product only lasts about a year. Kinect is still selling today. If all else, its great for navigating the menus, voice command marketplace, and nice party games, skype, and it enhances internet explorer. That is something in itself.



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

sales2099 on 29 October 2012
S.T.A.G.E. said:
phenom08 said:
oniyide said:
 

you live in your own world as usual, SOny didnt put anywhere near the ads that mS did for Kinect thats not pushing, by that logic. When all those games flop we should just stop blaming companies as not pushing them and sending them out to die. Since that seems to be a popular excuse when a game someone like doenst do well. SOny already stated they made profit off of every Move equipment sold. so fail on your part. No Resort could have been made without it, it just would have sucked cause there would have been crappy accuracy. 

When you can show me an ounce of proof Sony didn't "push it" then you will have an arguement. Until then no, Move failed and Sony tried. If they didn't try it would have not been created. Sony making profit is irrelevant (they have been losing money all gen so good job on making profit on that).

P.S. Since this is offtopic, I wont be replying after this.


I've never seen an ad for the Sony Eyetoy last gen, and I've only seen a couple ads for the  Move. I can truly say I cannot count how many Microsoft ad's I've seen for Modern Warfare, Gears of War, Halo, Kinect or even the Xbox 360. Anytime a Microsoft product comes out they run American television. I've seen more Gamestop ads than Sony ads. A lot of journalists have been asking whether Sony has been sending these peripherals out to die or something.

So what is the point to your stance?

Jealously that MS overshadows Sony in media? Frustration that Sony doesnt care enough? Anger that because of lack of marketing that Sony sends out great ideas to die?



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

S.T.A.G.E. on 29 October 2012
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
The Kinect was a media darling but a concrete failure on pushing gaming. To anyone who denies the Kinect cut into the casual attention span they did, how much is truly the question. Microsoft had everybody in the American media under their thumb in 2010. 2011 the Wii's sales dropped drastically, especially in America. Its obvioius their focus changed because Americas purchasing habits on a casual end are media driven. Microsoft has shown the world that top notch marketing trumps being able to back up your cause.

It pushed gaming.....in the casual space. That may not benefit people like us, but hey when you get popular you expand into different audiences.

I get the feeling your trying to say how marketing has saved the Xbox brand, or at least kinect from being ignored by the public. Marketing can only do so much, the products have to deliever to keep those sales trends going long term. And they have, for both 360 and Kinect.

It didnt push anything the Wii or Move couldnt do better from a concrete and sheer control perspective. Sony knew it couldnt do shit because last gen it didnt work for them and the Natal team contacted them first with the Kinect prototype and they still turned it down before it even got into Microsofts hands. Marketing can only do so much? The Kinect and The Eye Toy served the same purpose (they were just in two different gens) and Sony did not shut down time square, they did not go on Jay Leno or any news broadcast. They had the same types of games the Kinect offered as well. People acted like they never saw Kinect-type tech before in America. This is called great marketing vs shitty timid marketing. I would love to see the percentage of Wii or Kinect activity in peoples houses today. I ask because I am sure after the first year it plummeted for the majority of people  (including the Move). More aggressive consumers have been conditioned by cellphone companies to purchase a new phone every two years. The mass audience loves a well marketed novelty.

Sony KNEW the Eyetoy was limited therefore they knew the Kinect was limited but they still tried it and still deemed it limited tech even though it had more powerful parts. R&D knew they had to add something to make the tracking more precise and fluid. The Wii helped in the hybrid concept because Sony saw it as more of a competent tech that could help evolve the tracking in even a way the Wii couldnt do itself without a camera. It could control depth. I bet next gen Microsoft will come up with a peripheral device to complement the Kinect much like the Move compliments the PSEye and it will still outsell it. It will control the 3D space exactly the same as the Move. Microsoft will show Sony how to  market such a product. After that, tell me it isnt marketing. Your name is Sales for crying out loud, you should know this better than anyone.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoJ1ZNYODUg

Sony and Microsoft do business different. Sony spends more money making games than marketing them, Microsoft does the opposite. 

Given the lack of success with Move, I think your critique that Sony turned down Kinect tech shows they lost their touch in business. Marketing and the buzz of a new product only lasts about a year. Kinect is still selling today. If all else, its great for navigating the menus, voice command marketplace, and nice party games, skype, and it enhances internet explorer. That is something in itself.

Stay focused on the games, not the casual navigating. Sony was STILL right about that, which is why they deemed the Eyetoy and Kinect pointless with out a peripheral device to control depth in league with the camera. Yes, their marketing sucks and they did not saturate American television like Microsoft did. I am not talking about navigation because that is irrelevant. 



S.T.A.G.E. on 29 October 2012
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
phenom08 said:
oniyide said:
 

you live in your own world as usual, SOny didnt put anywhere near the ads that mS did for Kinect thats not pushing, by that logic. When all those games flop we should just stop blaming companies as not pushing them and sending them out to die. Since that seems to be a popular excuse when a game someone like doenst do well. SOny already stated they made profit off of every Move equipment sold. so fail on your part. No Resort could have been made without it, it just would have sucked cause there would have been crappy accuracy. 

When you can show me an ounce of proof Sony didn't "push it" then you will have an arguement. Until then no, Move failed and Sony tried. If they didn't try it would have not been created. Sony making profit is irrelevant (they have been losing money all gen so good job on making profit on that).

P.S. Since this is offtopic, I wont be replying after this.


I've never seen an ad for the Sony Eyetoy last gen, and I've only seen a couple ads for the  Move. I can truly say I cannot count how many Microsoft ad's I've seen for Modern Warfare, Gears of War, Halo, Kinect or even the Xbox 360. Anytime a Microsoft product comes out they run American television. I've seen more Gamestop ads than Sony ads. A lot of journalists have been asking whether Sony has been sending these peripherals out to die or something.

So what is the point to your stance?

Jealously that MS overshadows Sony in media? Frustration that Sony doesnt care enough? Anger that because of lack of masucrketing that Sony sends out great ideas to die?


Why would I be frustrated about a company that spends more money on making games than ads? As anyone can guess their marketing sucks and that is half the reason why their relations have been off with customers this gen. That needs to change. There is no jealousy for me in this, I just focus on companies that make games. 



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S.T.A.G.E. on 29 October 2012
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
phenom08 said:
oniyide said:
 

you live in your own world as usual, SOny didnt put anywhere near the ads that mS did for Kinect thats not pushing, by that logic. When all those games flop we should just stop blaming companies as not pushing them and sending them out to die. Since that seems to be a popular excuse when a game someone like doenst do well. SOny already stated they made profit off of every Move equipment sold. so fail on your part. No Resort could have been made without it, it just would have sucked cause there would have been crappy accuracy. 

When you can show me an ounce of proof Sony didn't "push it" then you will have an arguement. Until then no, Move failed and Sony tried. If they didn't try it would have not been created. Sony making profit is irrelevant (they have been losing money all gen so good job on making profit on that).

P.S. Since this is offtopic, I wont be replying after this.


I've never seen an ad for the Sony Eyetoy last gen, and I've only seen a couple ads for the  Move. I can truly say I cannot count how many Microsoft ad's I've seen for Modern Warfare, Gears of War, Halo, Kinect or even the Xbox 360. Anytime a Microsoft product comes out they run American television. I've seen more Gamestop ads than Sony ads. A lot of journalists have been asking whether Sony has been sending these peripherals out to die or something.

So what is the point to your stance?

Jealously that MS overshadows Sony in media? Frustration that Sony doesnt care enough? Anger that because of lack of masucrketing that Sony sends out great ideas to die?


Why would I be frustrated about a company that spends more money on making games than ads? As anyone can guess their marketing sucks and that is half the reason why their relations have been off with customers this gen. That needs to change. There is no jealousy for me in this, I just focus on companies that make games. If Sony stopped making games, it wouldnt hurt me I'd just continue in getting the Wii U and buying a top of the line PC. Simple.



sales2099 on 29 October 2012
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
The Kinect was a media darling but a concrete failure on pushing gaming. To anyone who denies the Kinect cut into the casual attention span they did, how much is truly the question. Microsoft had everybody in the American media under their thumb in 2010. 2011 the Wii's sales dropped drastically, especially in America. Its obvioius their focus changed because Americas purchasing habits on a casual end are media driven. Microsoft has shown the world that top notch marketing trumps being able to back up your cause.

It pushed gaming.....in the casual space. That may not benefit people like us, but hey when you get popular you expand into different audiences.

I get the feeling your trying to say how marketing has saved the Xbox brand, or at least kinect from being ignored by the public. Marketing can only do so much, the products have to deliever to keep those sales trends going long term. And they have, for both 360 and Kinect.

It didnt push anything the Wii or Move couldnt do better from a concrete and sheer control perspective. Sony knew it couldnt do shit because last gen it didnt work for them and the Natal team contacted them first with the Kinect prototype and they still turned it down before it even got into Microsofts hands. Marketing can only do so much? The Kinect and The Eye Toy served the same purpose (they were just in two different gens) and Sony did not shut down time square, they did not go on Jay Leno or any news broadcast. They had the same types of games the Kinect offered as well. People acted like they never saw Kinect-type tech before in America. This is called great marketing vs shitty timid marketing. I would love to see the percentage of Wii or Kinect activity in peoples houses today. I ask because I am sure after the first year it plummeted for the majority of people  (including the Move). More aggressive consumers have been conditioned by cellphone companies to purchase a new phone every two years. The mass audience loves a well marketed novelty.

Sony KNEW the Eyetoy was limited therefore they knew the Kinect was limited but they still tried it and still deemed it limited tech even though it had more powerful parts. R&D knew they had to add something to make the tracking more precise and fluid. The Wii helped in the hybrid concept because Sony saw it as more of a competent tech that could help evolve the tracking in even a way the Wii couldnt do itself without a camera. It could control depth. I bet next gen Microsoft will come up with a peripheral device to complement the Kinect much like the Move compliments the PSEye and it will still outsell it. It will control the 3D space exactly the same as the Move. Microsoft will show Sony how to  market such a product. After that, tell me it isnt marketing. Your name is Sales for crying out loud, you should know this better than anyone.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoJ1ZNYODUg

Sony and Microsoft do business different. Sony spends more money making games than marketing them, Microsoft does the opposite. 

Given the lack of success with Move, I think your critique that Sony turned down Kinect tech shows they lost their touch in business. Marketing and the buzz of a new product only lasts about a year. Kinect is still selling today. If all else, its great for navigating the menus, voice command marketplace, and nice party games, skype, and it enhances internet explorer. That is something in itself.

Stay focused on the games, not the casual navigating. Sony was STILL right about that, which is why they deemed the Eyetoy and Kinect pointless with out a peripheral device to control depth in league with the camera. Yes, their marketing sucks and they did not saturate American television like Microsoft did. I am not talking about navigation because that is irrelevant. 

There in lies the problem. Your selfish in your thinking. Move may have failed so PS3 is still a primarily core gamers console, but Kinect succeeded where it failed and now we 360 gamers gotta share with casuals. Kinect did push 360 is casual gaming and media navigating, as it enhances the 360 as a media hub, which is what MS wants to do.

I think you are in no position at all to say what Sony thinks is right given their state and their missteps in gaming this gen.



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

S.T.A.G.E. on 29 October 2012
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
The Kinect was a media darling but a concrete failure on pushing gaming. To anyone who denies the Kinect cut into the casual attention span they did, how much is truly the question. Microsoft had everybody in the American media under their thumb in 2010. 2011 the Wii's sales dropped drastically, especially in America. Its obvioius their focus changed because Americas purchasing habits on a casual end are media driven. Microsoft has shown the world that top notch marketing trumps being able to back up your cause.

It pushed gaming.....in the casual space. That may not benefit people like us, but hey when you get popular you expand into different audiences.

I get the feeling your trying to say how marketing has saved the Xbox brand, or at least kinect from being ignored by the public. Marketing can only do so much, the products have to deliever to keep those sales trends going long term. And they have, for both 360 and Kinect.

It didnt push anything the Wii or Move couldnt do better from a concrete and sheer control perspective. Sony knew it couldnt do shit because last gen it didnt work for them and the Natal team contacted them first with the Kinect prototype and they still turned it down before it even got into Microsofts hands. Marketing can only do so much? The Kinect and The Eye Toy served the same purpose (they were just in two different gens) and Sony did not shut down time square, they did not go on Jay Leno or any news broadcast. They had the same types of games the Kinect offered as well. People acted like they never saw Kinect-type tech before in America. This is called great marketing vs shitty timid marketing. I would love to see the percentage of Wii or Kinect activity in peoples houses today. I ask because I am sure after the first year it plummeted for the majority of people  (including the Move). More aggressive consumers have been conditioned by cellphone companies to purchase a new phone every two years. The mass audience loves a well marketed novelty.

Sony KNEW the Eyetoy was limited therefore they knew the Kinect was limited but they still tried it and still deemed it limited tech even though it had more powerful parts. R&D knew they had to add something to make the tracking more precise and fluid. The Wii helped in the hybrid concept because Sony saw it as more of a competent tech that could help evolve the tracking in even a way the Wii couldnt do itself without a camera. It could control depth. I bet next gen Microsoft will come up with a peripheral device to complement the Kinect much like the Move compliments the PSEye and it will still outsell it. It will control the 3D space exactly the same as the Move. Microsoft will show Sony how to  market such a product. After that, tell me it isnt marketing. Your name is Sales for crying out loud, you should know this better than anyone.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoJ1ZNYODUg

Sony and Microsoft do business different. Sony spends more money making games than marketing them, Microsoft does the opposite. 

Given the lack of success with Move, I think your critique that Sony turned down Kinect tech shows they lost their touch in business. Marketing and the buzz of a new product only lasts about a year. Kinect is still selling today. If all else, its great for navigating the menus, voice command marketplace, and nice party games, skype, and it enhances internet explorer. That is something in itself.

Stay focused on the games, not the casual navigating. Sony was STILL right about that, which is why they deemed the Eyetoy and Kinect pointless with out a peripheral device to control depth in league with the camera. Yes, their marketing sucks and they did not saturate American television like Microsoft did. I am not talking about navigation because that is irrelevant. 

There in lies the problem. Your selfish in your thinking. Move may have failed so PS3 is still a primarily core gamers console, but Kinect succeeded where it failed and now we 360 gamers gotta share with casuals. Kinect did push 360 is casual gaming and media navigating, as it enhances the 360 as a media hub, which is what MS wants to do.

I think you are in no position at all to say what Sony thinks is right given their state and their missteps in gaming this gen.


Ok. So you're trying to prove a point to me by boasting about Microsoft 1uped Sony by turning their console into a cable box? Sure bro. Sony made a lot of missteps this gen, but navigation isn't one of them. Sure, thats a creative and secondary decision, but its not important. This is called the games industry. The Wii was the highest selling casual device this gen and yet still got the least use behind the 360 and PS3. More people are STILL using Netflix on the PS3 because not only does it have a Blu Ray player but it also doesn't block you from using your subscriptions to Netflix and Hulu. If it is condoned to slow down game production and beef up the secondary aspects of a console and make them primary then the gaming industry is going in a direction that will not benefit gaming and it will continue to get worse. 



sales2099 on 29 October 2012
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

There in lies the problem. Your selfish in your thinking. Move may have failed so PS3 is still a primarily core gamers console, but Kinect succeeded where it failed and now we 360 gamers gotta share with casuals. Kinect did push 360 is casual gaming and media navigating, as it enhances the 360 as a media hub, which is what MS wants to do.

I think you are in no position at all to say what Sony thinks is right given their state and their missteps in gaming this gen


Ok. So you're trying to prove a point to me by boasting about Microsoft 1uped Sony by turning their console into a cable box? Sure bro. Sony made a lot of missteps this gen, but navigation isn't one of them. Sure, thats a creative and secondary decision, but its not important. This is called the games industry. The Wii was the highest selling casual device this gen and yet still got the least use behind the 360 and PS3. More people are STILL using Netflix on the PS3 because not only does it have a Blu Ray player but it also doesn't block you from using your subscriptions to Netflix and Hulu. If it is condoned to slow down game production and beef up the secondary aspects of a console and make them primary then the gaming industry is going in a direction that will not benefit gaming and it will continue to get worse. 

Yes, MS seriously 1uped Sony this gen in regards to expanding the audience to casuals while retaining the core fans. For gaming to get out of "the mothers basement" you have to get gaming to a true mass market awareness. Core games will always be a integral part, but now it has evolved to a point where we gotta share with casuals.

It sucks that theres gamers like you that want gaming back in the old days, where games were catered solely to the core.  gaming You either adapt to change or you get left B3hind

"If it is condoned to slow down game production and beef up the secondary aspect"

This isn't Sony......MS actually has money to do both. They have created many studios in the past year, they still get game deals especially with XBLA. They dont make them in house but they are 360 games that PS3 doesnt get. Same result. And Kinect has pushed Xbox into mass market status. Check yourself.



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

S.T.A.G.E. on 29 October 2012
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
sales2099 said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

There in lies the problem. Your selfish in your thinking. Move may have failed so PS3 is still a primarily core gamers console, but Kinect succeeded where it failed and now we 360 gamers gotta share with casuals. Kinect did push 360 is casual gaming and media navigating, as it enhances the 360 as a media hub, which is what MS wants to do.

I think you are in no position at all to say what Sony thinks is right given their state and their missteps in gaming this gen


Ok. So you're trying to prove a point to me by boasting about Microsoft 1uped Sony by turning their console into a cable box? Sure bro. Sony made a lot of missteps this gen, but navigation isn't one of them. Sure, thats a creative and secondary decision, but its not important. This is called the games industry. The Wii was the highest selling casual device this gen and yet still got the least use behind the 360 and PS3. More people are STILL using Netflix on the PS3 because not only does it have a Blu Ray player but it also doesn't block you from using your subscriptions to Netflix and Hulu. If it is condoned to slow down game production and beef up the secondary aspects of a console and make them primary then the gaming industry is going in a direction that will not benefit gaming and it will continue to get worse. 

Yes, MS seriously 1uped Sony this gen in regards to expanding the audience to casuals while retaining the core fans. For gaming to get out of "the mothers basement" you have to get gaming to a true mass market awareness. Core games will always be a integral part, but now it has evolved to a point where we gotta share with casuals.

It sucks that theres gamers like you that want gaming back in the old days, where games were catered solely to the core.  gaming You either adapt to change or you get left B3hind

"If it is condoned to slow down game production and beef up the secondary aspect"

This isn't Sony......MS actually has money to do both. They have created many studios in the past year, they still get game deals especially with XBLA. They dont make them in house but they are 360 games that PS3 doesnt get. Same result. And Kinect has pushed Xbox into mass market status. Check yourself.


No Microsoft didnt expand anything, Nintendo did that and Microsoft rode on its wave (Remember when Nintendo went casual and Sony and Microsoft expressed pessimism earlier and then Microsoft jumped on the bandwagon? Sony was always on it but their marketing sucked then and it still sucks now). Sony had expanded the Playstation product to casuals two gens before the both of them increasing game use and upgrading the multimedia value. The PS2 and PS1 have still on the one and two spot for highest selling consoles of all time. Literally the only two products that had something for everyone. I don't want to bring games back to the old days, but I also do not want proper games to take a back seat because a company doesn't give two shits about them. Microsoft is investing in games because they have to, but everyone knows they came to the industry because they want to own the living room (and saw Sony gobbling up multimedia marketshare, which is why they went after Apple as well and failed), not just for gaming, but for everything. Sony wants multimedia, but they do NOT want it to trump its truer purpose. 

Microsoft has created many studios, but either they haven't come up with much, are working on Halo and Forza or are focusing on next gen. Sonys teams have been focused on games this gen and beyond. Lets keep this concrete on facts, thats how it IS if you've been paying attention. How many games did Microsoft put out last year that wasnt low budget and for the core? How about this year? How about next year? Exactly, there is no argument about that. Microsoft even admitted that making games is risky and made excuses for low game production when journalists pressed them as to why their production level is so low.

Kinect is a mass market product, but unless they follow Sony and come up with a peripheral device for it (Which I believe they will), it wont push anything pertaining to gaming like the PROMISED AND CAMPAIGNED FOR. Their selling point to be taken seriously was to make real games for the Kinect, unless they go on Sonys path and show Sony how to properly market, this is not happening.