By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics Discussion - How to Save the American Economy

BradleyJ said:
This is a joke, right? I hope it's a joke...


America has a trade deficit, manufacturing jobs are all but extinct in America, and we have a skyrocketing rise in lower paying jobs, with only a handful of well paying jobs. That's a joke.



Around the Network

1. Cut federal government spending. Preferably by 35-43% (the amount we're borrowing). Do this primarily by cutting HUD, SNAP, both DoE's, and Defense spending. Reform medicare/SS as much as possible to save costs.

2. Enact either a income-based flat tax, or fair tax. Do away with corporate taxes.

3. Sunset Social Security. Allow the younger generation to invest their earnings in something else other than government debt.

4. Adopt a sane monetary policy - one that doesn't simply print money at every turn.

5. Reform and remove government regulations in every area of life. Promote a "regulation holiday" that would allow businesses to invest and invent new technologies without fear of government destroying their inventions.

6. End the war on drugs. Impose a reasonable tax on pot and other drugs.

7. Repeal (and do not replace) Obamacare. Force insurance companies to compete against each other over state lines, and promote freer-market reforms.

Do those 7 things, and we'd be growing faster than China.

 

By the way, tariffs and protectionism do not work. Don't believe me? Ask the Great Depression. Look up Smoot-Hawley and the effect it played on kickstarting the depression. There's a reason the stock market crashed in 1929 - the same exact day Congress took up debate on (actually) approving such an insane bill.



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

kain_kusanagi said:
I want a 10% flat tax with no exceptions. (maybe a bit more... 18%)

I want a huge cut in government costs. That means closing crap like the Department of Education.

I want all foreign aid sent to our enemies to end. If people need our help, we can help them, but we need to stop borrowing money from China to send to Egypt while they hate us.

I want taxes on imports to make outsourcing cost more than running factories in the USA.  no

I want unions to have less power. We have all the worker's rights laws we need, now unions do nothing but costs us all money.

I want term limits for congress. not needed

I want all our fuel resources utilized. That goes for oil, coal, coal to oil, wind, solar and most importantly nuclear.

I want congress to stop stealing money from Social Security.

I want the USA to leave the UN. The security council is a joke. YES!!!

i like... mostly



mrstickball said:

1. Cut federal government spending. Preferably by 35-43% (the amount we're borrowing). Do this primarily by cutting HUD, SNAP, both DoE's, and Defense spending. Reform medicare/SS as much as possible to save costs.

2. Enact either a income-based flat tax, or fair tax. Do away with corporate taxes.

3. Sunset Social Security. Allow the younger generation to invest their earnings in something else other than government debt.

4. Adopt a sane monetary policy - one that doesn't simply print money at every turn.

5. Reform and remove government regulations in every area of life. Promote a "regulation holiday" that would allow businesses to invest and invent new technologies without fear of government destroying their inventions.

6. End the war on drugs. Impose a reasonable tax on pot and other drugs.

7. Repeal (and do not replace) Obamacare. Force insurance companies to compete against each other over state lines, and promote freer-market reforms.

Do those 7 things, and we'd be growing faster than China.

 

By the way, tariffs and protectionism do not work. Don't believe me? Ask the Great Depression. Look up Smoot-Hawley and the effect it played on kickstarting the depression. There's a reason the stock market crashed in 1929 - the same exact day Congress took up debate on (actually) approving such an insane bill.

i like even better.... but i dont like drugs. but i still agree



kain_kusanagi said:
I want a 10% flat tax with no exceptions.
What do you mean flat tax?  Do you mean everyone pays the same income tax rate and that capital gains are also taxed the same way?  All taxes are equal?  Elaborate since this is a bit obscure to me.

 
I want a huge cut in government costs. That means closing crap like the Department of Education.
It's hard to cut things that some people see some value in.  There are benefits in certain things that we keep.  If we do what we say benefits most people, then what we're also saying is that we neglect the minority.


I want all foreign aid sent to our enemies to end. If people need our help, we can help them, but we need to stop borrowing money from China to send to Egypt while they hate us.
I do not know much about this issue, but I do not think that this would help us much in the long term whether we stop it or not.  This could be done solely for publicity.  


I want taxes on imports to make outsourcing cost more than running factories in the USA.
I'm a little tired, but doesn't this result in inflation?


I want unions to have less power. We have all the worker's rights laws we need, now unions do nothing but costs us all money.
I do not know for sure how much power unions have, but working conditions are not consistent and there are a lot of holes in these sorts of things.  A lot of nasty things still happen to factory workers.


I want term limits for congress.
I do not think this will impact much in the end.


I want all our fuel resources utilized. That goes for oil, coal, coal to oil, wind, solar and most importantly nuclear.
This is a debatable issue depending on your views.  There are many conflicting issues on how to use our resources and whether or not we should even care about this.  I'm supporting this view, especially about utilizing nuclear.  However, the people are highly against nuclear due to its "potential" risk if anything were to go wrong, however low those risks may be.


I want congress to stop stealing money from Social Security.
Not sure if I heard about this.  Source?
I want the USA to leave the UN. The security council is a joke.

No comment.





Around the Network
badgenome said:
A three-pronged approach is needed:

1. Get rid of job-destroying technology. I'm talking about dangerous machines like ATMs and self-service airport kiosks and those new fangled telephones that let you directly call the person whom you want to call without going through Eloise first. Machines are not Americans, and they damned sure shouldn't be taking our jobs.

2. More debt. Did you know that the more money the government spends, the higher the GDP? So all we have to do to grow our way out of the debt is to spend infinite money. Yes, this means infinite debt, but it also means an infinite GDP with infinite money in tax revenue, so it all balances out in the end.

3. Hyperinflation. It took a wheelbarrow full of money to buy a loaf of bread in the Weimar Republic. Think about that: all those "poor" Germans had wheelbarrows full of money. That's pretty kick ass.

is that you Mr Khan?



mrstickball said:

1. Cut federal government spending. Preferably by 35-43% (the amount we're borrowing). Do this primarily by cutting HUD, SNAP, both DoE's, and Defense spending. Reform medicare/SS as much as possible to save costs.

2. Enact either a income-based flat tax, or fair tax. Do away with corporate taxes.

3. Sunset Social Security. Allow the younger generation to invest their earnings in something else other than government debt.

4. Adopt a sane monetary policy - one that doesn't simply print money at every turn.

5. Reform and remove government regulations in every area of life. Promote a "regulation holiday" that would allow businesses to invest and invent new technologies without fear of government destroying their inventions.

6. End the war on drugs. Impose a reasonable tax on pot and other drugs.

7. Repeal (and do not replace) Obamacare. Force insurance companies to compete against each other over state lines, and promote freer-market reforms.

Do those 7 things, and we'd be growing faster than China.

 

By the way, tariffs and protectionism do not work. Don't believe me? Ask the Great Depression. Look up Smoot-Hawley and the effect it played on kickstarting the depression. There's a reason the stock market crashed in 1929 - the same exact day Congress took up debate on (actually) approving such an insane bill.


Globalism doesn't work either - well, if you aren't America it does work I guess. If you're America, it doesn't.

And Smoot Hawley had 0 negative effect on America, just more anti-American pro globalist garbage. Remember, Smoot Hawley was passed after Black Tuesday.  However Smoot Hawley was an awful tariff - no doubt about that. And before Smoot-Hawley, the 1929 Trade Surplus was 0.38% of our GDP.

Our GDP fell 46% from 1929-1934. Exports were $5.9 billion in 1929, and had fell down $3.9 billion to $2 billion in 1933. This $3.9 billion decline was roughly 3.8% of the 1929 GDP, which had already fell down 46%. THus, of the negative 46% GDP decline, only 3.8% of it was due to a fall in exports. If we look at imports, the loss is only $0.2 billion - or .5% of the total GDP decline.

Thus, Smoot Hawley caused only 1% of the 46% of the GDP decline.

Then you have to remember the situation is different here - Americans are losing jobs by the MILLIONS (I believe 6 million manufacturing jobs lost since 2000!). This is because they are going to other countries such as India, Haiti, Burma, China, etc. etc. Then we have a trade dedicit. Keep babbling on about Smoot Hawley while more Americans lose jobs and our deficits grow. We have to stop this. Don't complain about unemployment then be against tariffs.

America will not survive a global economy.

Source:

http://www.bea.gov/national/nipaweb/TablePrint.asp?FirstYear=1929&LastYear=1938&Freq=Year&SelectedTable=5&ViewSeries=NO&Java=no&MaxValue=103.6&MaxChars=5&Request3Place=N&3Place=N&FromView=YES&SmallFont=Y&Legal=&Land=



mrstickball said:

1. Cut federal government spending. Preferably by 35-43% (the amount we're borrowing). Do this primarily by cutting HUD, SNAP, both DoE's, and Defense spending. Reform medicare/SS as much as possible to save costs.
I've talked to a lot of people about these issues and I would like if they could cut spending on these certain things.  However, there's actually a lot less that can be cut before you're royally screwing certain people over.  Such as for defense spending, the places that are usually cut are the payrates of soldiers and checks sometimes get sent to veterans for services they have received in the past.  (EDIT): I believe the word I'm looking for was "compensation"

 
2. Enact either a income-based flat tax, or fair tax. Do away with corporate taxes.
A very conservative answer, if I do say so myself.  This would essentially be a form of regressive tax.  A flat tax on income would impose a greater burden on the poor than the rich.  This wouldn't be a very good idea in many cases, unless you don't really mind taking more from those with less.

 
3. Sunset Social Security. Allow the younger generation to invest their earnings in something else other than government debt.
Is this something you want to add to our spending?  If so, this would mean an increase in taxes, right?  Or is this something that replaces our current social security system, which would screw over those who are currently on it for those who are currently paying for it?  Either way, someone has to pay.


4. Adopt a sane monetary policy - one that doesn't simply print money at every turn.
I believe this is a fallacy.


5. Reform and remove government regulations in every area of life. Promote a "regulation holiday" that would allow businesses to invest and invent new technologies without fear of government destroying their inventions.
This is a fallacy as well.  There aren't government regulations on every area of life.  This makes it sound like the government has a tyranny over businesses.  Have you ever heard of Monsanto?


6. End the war on drugs. Impose a reasonable tax on pot and other drugs.
A very controversial topic that could do more harm than good.


7. Repeal (and do not replace) Obamacare. Force insurance companies to compete against each other over state lines, and promote freer-market reforms.
What about "Obamacare" (Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act PPACA) is a problem, specifically?  Our current health care system is broken.  It's obvious by how large a simple hospital bill is, even if you were on insurance. 


Do those 7 things, and we'd be growing faster than China.

I am not so sure about that.

By the way, tariffs and protectionism do not work. Don't believe me? Ask the Great Depression. Look up Smoot-Hawley and the effect it played on kickstarting the depression. There's a reason the stock market crashed in 1929 - the same exact day Congress took up debate on (actually) approving such an insane bill.

I don't know for sure whether or not tariffs or protectionism will work, but this is a different time.  What gives you the impression that doing this now will have the same effects it had a long time ago?





McDonaldsGuy said:
Salnax said:
BradleyJ said:
This is a joke, right? I hope it's a joke...


Isolationism often makes a resurgence when times are bad.


America's greatest times have come from protectionism.

How is Bush's "free trade" idea working out? Just ask Ohio.

We are in a TRADE DEFICIT - did you know that? Probably not. Keep watching CNN or Fox News.

I'm curious. Which times were these?



Love and tolerate.

McDonaldsGuy said:
mrstickball said:

1. Cut federal government spending. Preferably by 35-43% (the amount we're borrowing). Do this primarily by cutting HUD, SNAP, both DoE's, and Defense spending. Reform medicare/SS as much as possible to save costs.

2. Enact either a income-based flat tax, or fair tax. Do away with corporate taxes.

3. Sunset Social Security. Allow the younger generation to invest their earnings in something else other than government debt.

4. Adopt a sane monetary policy - one that doesn't simply print money at every turn.

5. Reform and remove government regulations in every area of life. Promote a "regulation holiday" that would allow businesses to invest and invent new technologies without fear of government destroying their inventions.

6. End the war on drugs. Impose a reasonable tax on pot and other drugs.

7. Repeal (and do not replace) Obamacare. Force insurance companies to compete against each other over state lines, and promote freer-market reforms.

Do those 7 things, and we'd be growing faster than China.

 

By the way, tariffs and protectionism do not work. Don't believe me? Ask the Great Depression. Look up Smoot-Hawley and the effect it played on kickstarting the depression. There's a reason the stock market crashed in 1929 - the same exact day Congress took up debate on (actually) approving such an insane bill.


Globalism doesn't work either - well, if you aren't America it does work I guess. If you're America, it doesn't.

And Smoot Hawley had 0 negative effect on America, just more anti-American pro globalist garbage. Remember, Smoot Hawley was passed after Black Tuesday.  However Smoot Hawley was an awful tariff - no doubt about that. And before Smoot-Hawley, the 1929 Trade Surplus was 0.38% of our GDP.

Our GDP fell 46% from 1929-1934. Exports were $5.9 billion in 1929, and had fell down $3.9 billion to $2 billion in 1933. This $3.9 billion decline was roughly 3.8% of the 1929 GDP, which had already fell down 46%. THus, of the negative 46% GDP decline, only 3.8% of it was due to a fall in exports. If we look at imports, the loss is only $0.2 billion - or .5% of the total GDP decline.

Thus, Smoot Hawley caused only 1% of the 46% of the GDP decline.

Then you have to remember the situation is different here - Americans are losing jobs by the MILLIONS (I believe 6 million manufacturing jobs lost since 2000!). This is because they are going to other countries such as India, Haiti, Burma, China, etc. etc. Then we have a trade dedicit. Keep babbling on about Smoot Hawley while more Americans lose jobs and our deficits grow. We have to stop this. Don't complain about unemployment then be against tariffs.

America will not survive a global economy.

Source:

http://www.bea.gov/national/nipaweb/TablePrint.asp?FirstYear=1929&LastYear=1938&Freq=Year&SelectedTable=5&ViewSeries=NO&Java=no&MaxValue=103.6&MaxChars=5&Request3Place=N&3Place=N&FromView=YES&SmallFont=Y&Legal=&Land=


1. There was a good bit of research done regarding Smoot-Hawley. It did contribute to the loss of GDP during the Great Depression - no less than 10% of all GDP lost during the depression was due to Smoot-Hawley. Why? Because when we add tariffs, so do other countries. Every country we hit with new tariffs hit us back, which was disasterous for many of our industries.

2. Why are we losing jobs? You really don't bother asking, nor answering that question. You simply yell "Tariffs! Tariffs!" in some insane belief that they will fix our problem.

I know people that run manfuacturing in the US. A few, actually, from different disciplines. The problem isn't tariffs. A lot of times, its government regulations. As it stands, tax and environmental regulations add about $15,000 onto every manufacturing job created. That is a huge amount of money, which drives jobs overseas. Reasonable regulations and reforms could drive that cost down, bringing jobs back. Thus the regulatory holiday. Certainly, China is playing an unfair game with currency manipulation, but (again) the response shouldn't be tariffs. It should be a reasonable monetary policy for the US, which would restore the strength of the dollar.



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.