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Forums - Gaming Discussion - New iPad and PS Vita specs

superchunk said:

That only really leaves controls. Its already happening. OnLive provides dedicated console gaming with proper controls right now to iOS and Android with virtual controls or a bluetooth dedicated controller. Do you really think Apple and Google are so inept that they can't write SDK with this in mind? Hell, I know for a fact it already exists in Android since 2.3.


Dedicated controller is the answer to Vita? Sure, sounds great. You need to carry that big tablet or a smartphone and the controller, very convenient.

The best games on those powerful smartphones and tablets, maybe apart from a handful of games, are even inferior to PSP games in nearly every way possible.



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michael_stutzer said:
superchunk said:

That only really leaves controls. Its already happening. OnLive provides dedicated console gaming with proper controls right now to iOS and Android with virtual controls or a bluetooth dedicated controller. Do you really think Apple and Google are so inept that they can't write SDK with this in mind? Hell, I know for a fact it already exists in Android since 2.3.


Dedicated controller is the answer to Vita? Sure, sounds great. You need to carry that big tablet or a smartphone and the controller, very convenient.

The best games on those powerful smartphones and tablets, maybe apart from a handful of games, are even inferior to PSP games in nearly every way possible.

Why do people focus on the little things ignoring the larger discussion?

I said that you could use a dedicatd controller but that was not a 'answer' to Vita. Also, think future my friend not now.

3 years ago mobile gaming was dot matrix style stuff from the 70's.

2 years ago it was 90's era java applet games... if not worse.

1 year ago it was today's/current flash games.

Now its last gen DS/PSP games in most sense.

Next year it will be PS360 games.

Sony should have capitalized on this with a full Vita dedicated gaming-smartphone.



Add the Asus Transformer Infinity to that OP. What a tablet !

http://blog.gsmarena.com/tablet-wars-reloaded-apple-ipad-3-vs-samsung-galaxy-note-10-1-vs-asus-transformer-pad-infinity-tf700t/



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leo-j said:

 if sony won't survive thn nintendo won't either.... the 3DS is almost two generations behind vita hardware..... vita is capable of prudicing visuals on par with early ps3 titles.... besides graphics isn't the only thing going fr vta 

I also think in that way. If Sony's dedicated portable console business would fall because of smartphones/tablets, Nintendo's one will be the next. But due to their strong 1st party franchises and differentiation from "core" market they will stand much longer. And later, who knows, maybe both Sony and Nin will compete on "console/phone" market... Only time will show. Like I said before in another thread, future of dedicated portable consoles isn't seems to be predictable for now.




 

General public:

Psv 300$? that's way too much.
Ipad: 500$? Fair Enough.



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TomaTito said:

Add the Asus Transformer Infinity to that OP. What a tablet !

http://blog.gsmarena.com/tablet-wars-reloaded-apple-ipad-3-vs-samsung-galaxy-note-10-1-vs-asus-transformer-pad-infinity-tf700t/


Yeah I saw that comparison a few hours ago. I didn't add it or others as the iPad has a more direct comparison due to the exact same CPU/GPU tech being utilized. But yes it does further illustrate my point. Personally I really like that tablet myself.



superchunk said:
brendude13 said:

I see what you mean, but I just don't think dedicated gaming handheld are going to vanish into thin air. There is too much competition in the smart phone industry for the PS Vita to succeed as a smart phone, especially if its design doesn't drastically changes. There are still plenty of people out there who will still buy dedicated gaming handhelds, like the 3DS sales are showing. Adding the smartphone capabilities will just make it a more attractive purchase and they could be the decider for somebody who is on the fence about buying a smartphone, or a dedicated gaming handheld, and want something in the middle.

3DS is selling because it lowered its price to well below new high-end smartphones and Nintendo software released. That is why Nintendo will continue to succeed.

Sony can't do either with Vita.

SONY definitely have headroom to lower the price of the Vita, as for the games, SONY's 1st party games have never really blown me away and I don't think they will be big on handhelds. 3rd party support is there though, Call of Duty, Final Fantasy, Assassin's Creed, you name it, they will help drive the Vita.



Chevinator123 said:
General public:

Psv 300$? that's way too much.
Ipad: 500$? Fair Enough.

lol, but there is a difference.

General Public:

PSV: just games
iPad: camera and video and movies and games and laptop and .... blah blah

Percieved value is far higher. Kinda part of why I'm pushing the idea of Vita should be a smartphone/tablet.



superchunk said:
NYANKS said:
Won't the iPad not be optimized for game playing though? I thought even though the specs are almost as good as Vita, that it's actual ability would show a definite difference, since all of Vita's horsepower is focused on one thing, games.


My point isn't that the new iPad is a games console, just that these devices are already passing Vita and by end of this year will be superior in all technical ways (less controls of course).

This is why I'm pushing the idea that Vita should have just been a phone/tablet to actually match all of their benefits as well as provide the superior controls. Then even with that business model, Sony could easily afford to put out a new Vita every other or less, like phone companies, to stay ahead of the curve.

It would be very difficult to sell a bulky phone with buttons that only has a 5-7 hour battery life, not to mention it would cost $500+ dollars and there are a lot of potential customers that would be unwilling to give up their Iphone or Android phone. Also many of those who would be willing are probably already locked into a long term contract, like most people are now days, so it would take a year or so before they even get a chance to consider buying the device. 

Though it would be convenient to be able to use your Vita to make phone calls on occasions or not having to carry around two devices, having vita as a separate gaming device allows people to leave it in the car or toss it in your back pack or GF's purse and forget about it, as well as leave it at home all together. As with a phone, most people generally want to have it on them at all times, where ever they go. Because of this much smaller phones are more desirable than something the size of a Vita(And probably why Tablets don't bother getting into the phone market). It would be hard to convince someone to carry around a vita in their pocket on a regular basis. 

Sony's bread and butter is selling to gamers and people willing to purchase $30 and $40 dollar gaming experiences atleast a few times a year. If they tried to reach into the Ipad/Iphone/Android market, where games generally cost a few dollars or are even free(That make money on advertisement) they would get very little residual in terms of selling PS VIta games to those people. It's a completely different gaming market. Though I think Sony can sell to those customers it would not be using the Vita as it brings no real value to the majority of those people. 

If Sony wanted to sell a gaming device to the casual audience they would have to make games that are designed to play well with no sound, can be picked up and put down in a short period of time without loss of enjoyment, can be played with friends anywhere, doesn't require a big learning curve or lots of buttons to learn, doesn't have long cut scenes or engaging storylines, among other things I can't think of at the moment. In essence it would be designing a device and games that are exactly the opposite of what the Vita is. 

I do believe it is possible to sell a sucessful gaming phone, but it would have to be completely different from the PS VIta experience. It would be more along the lines of marketing a phone that happens to do games, not a gaming device that does phone calls. The Xperia was a step in the right direction, but it's a hard sell. One of the biggest challanges is convincing people that they are not buying a gaming device, but still selling them on the perks of their games. As cool as it is in theory to the average person to have a gaming phone, only gaming nerds(I mean that as a badge of honor) or children would want to purchase a phone that is a gaming device because of social reasons. A big portion of Apple's sales alone are because of this social positioning in people's minds. People want to be in the Apple club, it's trendy. Pulling out a gaming phone in many situations such as a first date or a board meeting or interview could make many people feel very self conscious. The fact that the Experia looks like a regular Smart phone when closed helps, but having features that can also sell an Experia as a great phone outside of the gaming would be important. Maybe having an amazing camera, or an extremely long battery life, having NFC or whatever new technology is coming out at the time, etc., would help. I don't believe turing the Vita into a phone would solve any of these problems, and would only take away from what it was intended to be. A gaming device that can sell $30 and $40 gaming experiences to gamers.  



superchunk said:
Andrespetmonkey said:

Maybe in 5 years VITA will be dying, but for the next 3 years at least, there is no better altenative for non-casual handheld gaming. (apart from maybe the other handheld that was released recently but that's down to preference).

Right. But will the system be dedicated and optimized for gaming? Will most games be core games? Will most games take advantage of the hardware? Will we see regular releases of big budget AAA games? Will all phone manufacturers AND developers support this hypothetical bluetooth controller? (Apple, one of the biggest players, certainly won't) No, no, no, no and no.

Today Google announced that by next year they will have a solid, seamless, and integrated gaming platform within their market for Android, Google TV, and Chrome. (all really being combined as same thing right now with Android 4)

Apple already has done that with iTunes and continues to progress with pushing its products as gaming platforms.

Over the last year 3rd parties have increased their support of iOS and to a lesser extent Android by a huge margin. Most AAA games have ports already for mobile and with far more powerful hardware here now and coming, expect these ports to be more and more like, if not identical, to their dedicated gaming cousins.

That only really leaves controls. Its already happening. OnLive provides dedicated console gaming with proper controls right now to iOS and Android with virtual controls or a bluetooth dedicated controller. Do you really think Apple and Google are so inept that they can't write SDK with this in mind? Hell, I know for a fact it already exists in Android since 2.3.

Also, why do you think MS never made a portable console? What do you think all the integration of Windows8 with Live is for?

I agree with you that handhelds are going out, I just don't think anything other than dedicated handhelds will be the best option for portable gaming for the next 3 years. I don't think IOS/Android and related software will be able to produce the same amount of AAA core games that we will see on VITA or 3DS for a few years. I don't think we'll be getting better control schemes become standard on these devices for quite a few years. I don't think streaming, like onlive will be the standard for quite some time.

"Most AAA games have ports for mobile", now that's simply not true, and most of the franchises that we see on mobile devices aren't anywhere near as good as their console versions. Even GTAIII, a complete port, isn't as good as it was on a console a decade ago. And also, you are ignoring the fact the their dedicated gaming cousins will also be updating their hardware soon, with the next xbox and playstation, so it'll again be another half decade for mobile games to reach that standard. Anyway, this is a tangent, let's stick to VITA.

Like I said, dedicated handhelds are the best option for core portable gaming we have right now. Until Phones/tablets see regular big-budget AAA releases, have improved controls, have more core games and have games regularly look graphically impressive by devs taking advantage of the hardware, dedicated handhelds will remain the best option. I think it'll remain this way for the next few years. Obviously you disagree, but I don't see this discussion going anywhere further, so I'm gonna go to bed and I guess we'll find out who was right in a couple years :)