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Forums - Gaming Discussion - epic games wont ever make games for the wii

superchunk on 20 April 2008
Bodhesatva said:
Legend11 said:
superchunk said:
yeah, right.

So when Wii has near 100m (2009/2010) and are nearing 60% market share. Epic will choose PS360/PC only. hahaha. Not unless they are getting big kicks from MSony.

Does anyone really think the casuals fueling the Wii's growth, you know the ones that are buying it solely for Wii Sports or Wii Fit or Wii Cheerleading or whatever are suddenly going to start buying games like Gears of War? At the end of the day the hardcore gamers on Wii will very likely never even come close to matching that of the PS3/360/PC and those are the gamers that Epic is targeting.

Add to that the fact that Epic is already making money off those systems and finds them extremely lucrative especially with licensing of their game engine to many developers on those platforms. It would be the same as basically saying that Blizzard will be forced to make Wii games because of the Wii's future installed base, even though they're already doing very well with their current platform.


I don't think "hardcore gamer" is the right term here, Legend, because I think there are a ton of "hardcore" gamers that would buy Zelda and Mario but have no interest in Gears of War, just as there are "hardcore" gamers that would buy Gears of War but not Mario or Zelda.

As I already posted, I absolutely agree that Epic is almost the exact opposite of what works on the Wii. That's not a matter of being "hardcore," whatever that term means, it's a specific demographic difference -- I strongly suspect that the audience for a game like Gears of War heavily, heavily tilts towards young males who prefer M titles.

That's it, actually. That's precisely how I'd put it. Enthusiast gamers who prefer M titles will likely greatly prefer the 360 or PS3 over the Wii, and it just so happens that Epic makes M rated titles for the enthusiast gamer. Ergo, I totally agree the PS360 is the better platform for them.


 You put that much better than Legend. However, I still disagree and say that right NOW that is the case because there are really no games that this group likes on Wii. As Wii's userbase grows and these games become as prelavent on Wii as they are on PS360 with sub-graphics and better controls, I'd wager the majority of them will also own a Wii.



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Legend11 on 20 April 2008
Bodhesatva said:
Legend11 said:
superchunk said:
yeah, right.

So when Wii has near 100m (2009/2010) and are nearing 60% market share. Epic will choose PS360/PC only. hahaha. Not unless they are getting big kicks from MSony.

Does anyone really think the casuals fueling the Wii's growth, you know the ones that are buying it solely for Wii Sports or Wii Fit or Wii Cheerleading or whatever are suddenly going to start buying games like Gears of War? At the end of the day the hardcore gamers on Wii will very likely never even come close to matching that of the PS3/360/PC and those are the gamers that Epic is targeting.

Add to that the fact that Epic is already making money off those systems and finds them extremely lucrative especially with licensing of their game engine to many developers on those platforms. It would be the same as basically saying that Blizzard will be forced to make Wii games because of the Wii's future installed base, even though they're already doing very well with their current platform.


I don't think "hardcore gamer" is the right term here, Legend, because I think there are a ton of "hardcore" gamers that would buy Zelda and Mario but have no interest in Gears of War, just as there are "hardcore" gamers that would buy Gears of War but not Mario or Zelda.

As I already posted, I absolutely agree that Epic is almost the exact opposite of what works on the Wii. That's not a matter of being "hardcore," whatever that term means, it's a specific demographic difference -- I strongly suspect that the audience for a game like Gears of War heavily, heavily tilts towards young males who prefer M titles.

That's it, actually. That's precisely how I'd put it. Enthusiast gamers who prefer M titles will likely greatly prefer the 360 or PS3 over the Wii, and it just so happens that Epic makes M rated titles for the enthusiast gamer. Ergo, I totally agree the PS360 is the better platform for them. 


True or call them hardcore shooter fans.



Million on 20 April 2008
superchunk said:
Legend11 said:
superchunk said:
yeah, right.

So when Wii has near 100m (2009/2010) and are nearing 60% market share. Epic will choose PS360/PC only. hahaha. Not unless they are getting big kicks from MSony.

Does anyone really think the casuals fueling the Wii's growth, you know the ones that are buying it solely for Wii Sports or Wii Fit or Wii Cheerleading or whatever are suddenly going to start buying games like Gears of War? At the end of the day the hardcore gamers on Wii will very likely never even come close to matching that of the PS3/360/PC and those are the gamers that Epic is targeting.

Add to that the fact that Epic is already making money off those systems and finds them extremely lucrative especially with licensing of their game engine to many developers on those platforms. It would be the same as basically saying that Blizzard will be forced to make Wii games because of the Wii's future installed base, even though they're already doing very well with their current platform.


When will this little fantasy of PS360 girls and boys end? Wii only has soccor moms and grandparents who only buy Wii Sports/Play/Fit...bah it sucks...bah hardcore, i.e. real, gamers are on ps360's...bah I'm a 15-25 yr old male who can only play shooting games.... bah stupid gay dog he he he.

Seriously, when will that irrational and plain wrong logic end? When the Wii reaches 100m units sold? When the attach rate is higher than all the others? When these 'hardcore' games, i.e. shooters, come out for Wii enmasse and are selling at higher rates than PS360 versions?

 Firstly the logic isn't wrong it just isn't complete , the Wii has effectivley created a bigger market for itself to sell to , it apeals to people who traditionaly never played games as well as casual and hardcore gamers , it's pretty much selling to everyone.

What I won't accept is that the Wii has the same capacity to apeal to the hardcore gamer that the PS3/360 does. Using anecdotal evidence Wii games just aren't apealing to male 17 year olds , I go to college and most of the talk is about PSP , PS3 and XBOX 360 you'll mostly hear "DS" or "Wii" come up in conversations when girls or teachers are involved ,(now for the fact) it's well known males aged 12-30 spend more on games than any other market segment hence Microsoft SW outselling Wii SW in america despite it's lower install base.

Epic is stupid and srtsighted. You don't have to see the hair on your character's chinny chin chin to make a good game. Sure its a nice add-on, but great realistic graphics are just that, ADD-ONS. I really hope Conduit is a AAA title that proves once and for all a ground up Wii 'hardcore' title belongs on Wii as much as Wii Cheer does.

Graphics are far more than an add on , i'd go as far as to say that they are part of the gameplay they help with the realism , immersivness and believability of a game . If Graphics wern't important to the Gamer then we'd still be talking about N64 and PS1. 

What made the PS2 great? Was it Final Fantasy series, GTA series, or the hordes of games similar to mySims. I'd say it was all of them. It will be the same for Wii.

Plain n Simple if the PS2 would have had PS1 graphics i'm absolutley sure it wouldn't have won last gen to the extent it did , the XBOX and GC would have sold 30-50% more. 

 


 




Cheebee on 20 April 2008

Yeah, well I've heard this before... :p



Nintendo Network ID: Cheebee   3DS Code: 2320 - 6113 - 9046

 

Bodhesatva on 20 April 2008
Legend11 said:
Bodhesatva said:
Legend11 said:
superchunk said:
yeah, right.

So when Wii has near 100m (2009/2010) and are nearing 60% market share. Epic will choose PS360/PC only. hahaha. Not unless they are getting big kicks from MSony.

Does anyone really think the casuals fueling the Wii's growth, you know the ones that are buying it solely for Wii Sports or Wii Fit or Wii Cheerleading or whatever are suddenly going to start buying games like Gears of War? At the end of the day the hardcore gamers on Wii will very likely never even come close to matching that of the PS3/360/PC and those are the gamers that Epic is targeting.

Add to that the fact that Epic is already making money off those systems and finds them extremely lucrative especially with licensing of their game engine to many developers on those platforms. It would be the same as basically saying that Blizzard will be forced to make Wii games because of the Wii's future installed base, even though they're already doing very well with their current platform.


I don't think "hardcore gamer" is the right term here, Legend, because I think there are a ton of "hardcore" gamers that would buy Zelda and Mario but have no interest in Gears of War, just as there are "hardcore" gamers that would buy Gears of War but not Mario or Zelda.

As I already posted, I absolutely agree that Epic is almost the exact opposite of what works on the Wii. That's not a matter of being "hardcore," whatever that term means, it's a specific demographic difference -- I strongly suspect that the audience for a game like Gears of War heavily, heavily tilts towards young males who prefer M titles.

That's it, actually. That's precisely how I'd put it. Enthusiast gamers who prefer M titles will likely greatly prefer the 360 or PS3 over the Wii, and it just so happens that Epic makes M rated titles for the enthusiast gamer. Ergo, I totally agree the PS360 is the better platform for them.


True or call them hardcore shooter fans.


 Yep, that's fine too.



http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a324/Arkives/Disccopy.jpg%5B/IMG%5D">http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a324/Arkives/Disccopy.jpg%5B/IMG%5D">

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vanguardian1 on 20 April 2008

I prefer the term coined on NeoGAF, "Hardlycore". :)

Maybe I'm just tired of it (FPS's, been playing them since Wolf-3d), but my perspective just can't help but see a lack of creativity in the FPS market nowadays, it seems that they get excited over minute things and miss the bigger picture. >.<



Nobody is crazy enough to accuse me of being sane.

Naum on 20 April 2008

well its their loss I guess

so go ahead epic do your thing aka kiddie games like FPS'ers ( the majority who play those games are young 15-25 years )



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Bodhesatva on 20 April 2008
vanguardian1 said:
I prefer the term coined on NeoGAF, "Hardlycore". :)

Maybe I'm just tired of it (FPS's, been playing them since Wolf-3d), but my perspective just can't help but see a lack of creativity in the FPS market nowadays, it seems that they get excited over minute things and miss the bigger picture. >.<

 Right right, opinions and all that. 

But there are clearly a lot of people who love Gears, and I'd argue vehemently that it's a good game, whether you personally like it or not.  



http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a324/Arkives/Disccopy.jpg%5B/IMG%5D">http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a324/Arkives/Disccopy.jpg%5B/IMG%5D">

alpha_dk on 20 April 2008
Million said:
superchunk said:
Legend11 said:
*snip*

*snip*

*snip*

 Firstly the logic isn't wrong it just isn't complete , the Wii has effectivley created a bigger market for itself to sell to , it apeals to people who traditionaly never played games as well as casual and hardcore gamers , it's pretty much selling to everyone.

What I won't accept is that the Wii has the same capacity to apeal to the hardcore gamer that the PS3/360 does. Using anecdotal evidence Wii games just aren't apealing to male 17 year olds , I go to college and most of the talk is about PSP , PS3 and XBOX 360 you'll mostly hear "DS" or "Wii" come up in conversations when girls or teachers are involved ,(now for the fact) it's well known males aged 12-30 spend more on games than any other market segment hence Microsoft SW outselling Wii SW in america despite it's lower install base.

*snip*

Graphics are far more than an add on , i'd go as far as to say that they are part of the gameplay they help with the realism , immersivness and believability of a game . If Graphics wern't important to the Gamer then we'd still be talking about N64 and PS1. 

*snip*

Plain n Simple if the PS2 would have had PS1 graphics i'm absolutley sure it wouldn't have won last gen to the extent it did , the XBOX and GC would have sold 30-50% more. 

 


 


 1) I also go to college, and empirically (a study some psych major did with random sampling, etc - much more scientific than your friends), the Wii won among BOTH genders.  It was less strong among males, but it still won. There was a slight difference between Freshmen and sophomores-seniors; perhaps because they are still closest to the 13-17yo demographic that the PS3 and 360 are stronger in.

 2) As a college-aged male, most of my conversations are about Wii/DS.  Equally as anecdotal as yours, and equally as meaningless.

 3) With regards to "it's well known males aged 12-30 spend more on games than any other market segment", I think I will let Arrested Development speak for me:

Gob: Did you know that more frozen bananas are sold right here on this boardwalk than anywhere on the OC?

Just because only one market is being served doesn't mean that others won't buy games if they are made.  The Sims, Nintendogs, etc. all prove this; the fact that more young males buy games is more a statement about the games being made than anything about the gamers.

4) In america, MS has a higher install base than the Wii.  It should still sell more software.  The fact is (there's a thread about this somewhere, i am too lazy to provide a link) that the Wii is only being outsold 2-6% on a per-console basis.  It's not like the Wii isn't selling software, or the other consoles are vastly superior w.r.t attach rates.  They are only slightly better, which is erased by Wii's growing userbase (and, IMO, Wii's older, more affluent user base [per NPD] means that they will likely have more disposable income to spend on games, which may lead to vastly superior LTD attach rates by the end of the generation).

5) We do still talk about N64 vs. PS1... or did you mean they would still be the consoles out there?  There are other economic reasons to upgrade consoles cyclicly, such as the fact that as a console ages fewer games will sell large numbers.  The industry will likely remain cyclic until such a time as new consoles don't sell, regardless of graphical increases in the generation.



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vanguardian1 on 20 April 2008

I know it's my opinion, I wouldn't try to state otherwise. But I guess I just find it frustrating that newer games in a genre I enjoyed for years feel so much smaller and emptier than their predecessors.


.....Suddenly I want to install UT again. :)



Nobody is crazy enough to accuse me of being sane.