By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Sony Discussion - Linus - I’ve Disappointed and Embarrassed Myself (re: PS5 SSD)

ArchangelMadzz on 06 June 2020
Pemalite said:

Good on Linus.

In saying that... He wasn't wrong in asserting that the PC has faster SSD's the Playstation 5. - It's just that wasn't Tim's original assertion and there is more to the SSD than just sequential reads/writes. (Which the PC undoubtedly wins in.)

Just like there is more to performance than teraflops.

Hopefully this puts the boring circular arguments to bed, the real winners are gamers in the end... And like I have said many times, Xbox Series X or Playstation 5, you are getting solid pieces of hardware either way... But welcome to 2020, when finally all platforms are solid state.

True. But him showing 4 SSD's in RAID amd saying it's faster than a Single SSD is kind of redundant. We know the fastest single SSD out right now is 5GB/s.



There's only 2 races: White and 'Political Agenda'
2 Genders: Male and 'Political Agenda'
2 Hairstyles for female characters: Long and 'Political Agenda'
2 Sexualities: Straight and 'Political Agenda'

Around the Network
Dallinor on 06 June 2020
Pemalite said:

Good on Linus.

In saying that... He wasn't wrong in asserting that the PC has faster SSD's the Playstation 5. - It's just that wasn't Tim's original assertion and there is more to the SSD than just sequential reads/writes. (Which the PC undoubtedly wins in.)

Just like there is more to performance than teraflops.

Hopefully this puts the boring circular arguments to bed, the real winners are gamers in the end... And like I have said many times, Xbox Series X or Playstation 5, you are getting solid pieces of hardware either way... But welcome to 2020, when finally all platforms are solid state.

If you mean as standard, plenty of PC's don't have SSD's including the PC I'm typing this message on, which is only 2 months old.



 

vivster on 06 June 2020

No reason to apologize for running with a statement that was intentionally vague and basically had no value in the way it was phrased.



If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

DonFerrari on 06 June 2020
KBG29 said:
Zoombael said:

To some it remains a secret. 

It's possible to upgrade console HDDs to SSDs since the 7th generation. Just FYI.

This is true, but as Mark Cerny discussed in the Road to PS5 talk, putting an SSD into a PS3 and PS4 had very little in the way of performance gains. I had SSD's in my PS3 and PS4, it did help streaming textures, and cut the load times in specific titles, but it was very limited.

With next gen, developers will be able to program to the baseline of every console having an SSD, and take advanatge of the fixed function hardware in the I/O of each console to truly get the most out of those SSD's.

This is something I was glad to see Linus talk about in this video. I have been watching his videos on and off for a long time, and it is always extremely frusterating when he would do a video on a new multi-core CPU or SSDs, and then claim that there is no point in more cores and faster SSDs. It always comes down to the program, if the program is not build to take advanatage of the hardware, then the hardware is not going to be utilized. 

Next gen is going to blow people away, I just hope we can get through this mess going on right now, and get to the positive advanacements that are happening.

Well it is kinda important to inform customers that there isn't much use for the expensive stuff they want to buy because developers aren't putting it to use.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Oneeee-Chan!!! on 06 June 2020



Around the Network
Pemalite on 06 June 2020
Zoombael said:

It's possible to upgrade console HDDs to SSDs since the 7th generation. Just FYI.

Not with the Xbox 360 initially.
It wasn't until Microsoft implemented external USB drive support that USB storage of up to 2TB could be used back in 2015.
https://www.windowscentral.com/xbox-360-software-update-adds-support-2tb-external-hard-drives

And in 2010 USB Flash Drive support was added with a max formatted capacity of 16GB (Or two drives for a total of 32GB).
https://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/118771/Xbox_360_Update_Adding_USB_Flash_Drive_Support_In_April.php

So whilst technically you could run an SSD in a USB enclosure and format it into two 16Gb partitions... It was hardly ideal.
An SSD limited to 35MB/s is going to be slower than the Xbox 360's internal mechanical drive, especially the 500gb drive model which should sit at around 50-60MB/s.

KBG29 said:

This is true, but as Mark Cerny discussed in the Road to PS5 talk, putting an SSD into a PS3 and PS4 had very little in the way of performance gains. I had SSD's in my PS3 and PS4, it did help streaming textures, and cut the load times in specific titles, but it was very limited.

With next gen, developers will be able to program to the baseline of every console having an SSD, and take advanatge of the fixed function hardware in the I/O of each console to truly get the most out of those SSD's.

This is something I was glad to see Linus talk about in this video. I have been watching his videos on and off for a long time, and it is always extremely frusterating when he would do a video on a new multi-core CPU or SSDs, and then claim that there is no point in more cores and faster SSDs. It always comes down to the program, if the program is not build to take advanatage of the hardware, then the hardware is not going to be utilized. 

Next gen is going to blow people away, I just hope we can get through this mess going on right now, and get to the positive advanacements that are happening.

Yeah the I/O was the bottleneck on the Playstation 3 and Xbox 360, which is why SSD's didn't provide much in the way of tangible benefits, that bottleneck has been rectified next-gen, which is what Tim's messaging is all about, removing bottlenecks.

The PC still has the fastest CPU, GPU, Ram and SSD's, but the Playstation 5 doesn't have any points of restriction essentially.

ArchangelMadzz said:

True. But him showing 4 SSD's in RAID amd saying it's faster than a Single SSD is kind of redundant. We know the fastest single SSD out right now is 5GB/s.

You can buy single SSD's with 10GB/s on PC.
https://www.anandtech.com/show/10125/seagate-announces-pcie-x16-ssd-capable-of-10gbs
or
https://www.anandtech.com/show/15537/kioxia-releases-first-pcie-40-ssds-cm6-cd6

The PC has the fastest SSD's money can buy, yes RAID is one way to achieve such throughput's, no... That isn't the only kind of SSD that is available.

The fastest single SSD is on PC, was always on PC, will always be on PC. -Why?
The PC isn't limited by cost, power consumption, form factor or interface.

But that isn't the messaging that Tim is trying to put across, there is so much behind the SSD that is going on with the Playstation 5 that the raw "GB/s" numbers don't tell us.
It's like people clinging to "teraflops" to assert that a platform is 50% superior than another one which couldn't be further from the truth... Or how a 32bit console is faster than a 64bit one. - Bits tells us bugger all.

Dallinor said:

If you mean as standard, plenty of PC's don't have SSD's including the PC I'm typing this message on, which is only 2 months old.

If you buy a PC today... In 2020 that came with a mechanical hard drive... Then you made the wrong purchase decision, even netbooks have SSD's today.

I haven't seen a PC for sale in a few years that came with spinning rust unless it was a secondary storage drive, but that is Australia, things might be different in other parts of the world.




--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

HollyGamer on 07 June 2020

The video got trending on Youtube LOL. Sony and EPIC just got free marketing LMAO.



DonFerrari on 07 June 2020
HollyGamer said:
The video got trending on Youtube LOL. Sony and EPIC just got free marketing LMAO.

As they say there is no bad publicity, and sometimes it turns out real good.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

LurkerJ on 07 June 2020
vivster said:
No reason to apologize for running with a statement that was intentionally vague and basically had no value in the way it was phrased.

He is mainly apologized for personally attacking Tim and saying Tim must have received trucks of cash from SONY to hype up their SSD. Worse yet, he has one of the biggest and most watched YT Tech channels out there, you'd surely could see why mischaracterizing Sweeny the way he did deserves an apology?

"No reason to apologize" is baffling to say.



OneTime on 07 June 2020

To be honest, I never rated Linus' technical knowledge very highly. He seems like someone who knows his way around the a few websites to order computer parts, but does he even have a computer science degree? Has he worked as a software developer? Does he work on Linux in his spare time or something?

That he was wrong about something highly technical does not surprise me. That he thought he could talk authoritatively about something he has never used or seen the specs of... doesn't surprise me either...