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Forums - Movies Discussion - The End of Evangelion Movie is trash and makes absolutely zero sense.

 

What did you think of it?

I haven't watched it. 2 11.11%
 
It was cool, but made little sense. 6 33.33%
 
It was cool, and I understood it fine. 6 33.33%
 
I didn't understand it, and it wasn't cool. 4 22.22%
 
Total:18

I feel like this can be said of the ending of most movies. Probably 90% or so.



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To be fair to everyone who watched this movie and not the anime, these are suppose to be expansions to episode 25 and 26. This is not a standalone movie. So calling it trash without understanding this fact is just ignorant to what is marketed itself as.



NightlyPoe said:
sundin13 said:

Asuka was a great character, but Rei will always be best girl.

I'll be honest, I never got the appeal of Rei.  I don't hate her, and am fine with her being the show's mascot, but she felt like more of a piece for the other characters to bounce off of than much of anything herself.  It's not so much that there's nothing to latch onto to analyze and feel emotions about, it's more that I'm not interested in investing in a character that has such relatively little meat.

Oh, one other little bit about Evangelion.  I find myself humming "Komm Süsser Tod" (the "tumbling down" song that plays during instrumentality in End of Evangelion) at work sometimes.  No one's gotten it yet and it amuses me that this happy, upbeat song is about the apocalypse.

 
NightlyPoe said:
sundin13 said:

Asuka was a great character, but Rei will always be best girl.

I'll be honest, I never got the appeal of Rei.  I don't hate her, and am fine with her being the show's mascot, but she felt like more of a piece for the other characters to bounce off of than much of anything herself.  It's not so much that there's nothing to latch onto to analyze and feel emotions about, it's more that I'm not interested in investing in a character that has such relatively little meat.

Oh, one other little bit about Evangelion.  I find myself humming "Komm Süsser Tod" (the "tumbling down" song that plays during instrumentality in End of Evangelion) at work sometimes.  No one's gotten it yet and it amuses me that this happy, upbeat song is about the apocalypse.

I liked your comment praising Asuka because I think she gets a lot of hate for no reason as well, but Rei is misunderstood and the best girl meme is an extreme result of people not getting her character. Rei is literally a supernatural being combined with a science experiment. Her arc is defined by her choice for humanity. Rei is not meant to be super relatable because she’s not normal in any sense of the word. Rei is an angel who's soul moves between multiple clones and has a memory and personality of the child body/clone that she is. Rei at first suffers from lack of self worth due to her absurd circumstances and she overcomes this by saving her friends and humanity against what she sees as evil as she grows to find meaning. Crushing the glasses and seemingly forcing the suicide of the mass production units are small pieces of evidence to this puzzle. Rei is choosing the good she sees in Shinji and Asuka and allowing Lilin (humanity) to continue on an unknown path rather than Gendo’s personal god complex path or SEELE’s dogmatic eugenic path for evolution. Rei rejects SEELE without them knowing of each other directly throughout the series because their path crosses once she takes control of instrumentality. Her character is about sacrifice. She was created to be used as a sacrifice for Gendo and she ultimately chooses to sacrifice herself in a way that would help her friends. 

I believe her arc and the story as a whole is meant to display the sort of positive overcome of nihilism that I think Ano probably relates to. (This last sentence is speculation because his interviews are all over the place and ultimately he doesn’t want the meaning to be explained in an on the nose way so he self contradicts himself sometimes, I simply use all the information we are given in the best way I can) Her character in some aspects is similar to Aeris/th from FF7, but an even more depressing set of circumstances and higher level of power over events. They really aren't the same for a variety of reasons, but I'm just using this comparison to help people better understand how Rei fits into the story of Evangelion.

To be fair I never got the Shinji-Rei ships or the best girl meme. It’s so obvious from any point in the series that Shinji and Asuka make better sense together. From their complimentary opposite design to their synchronization scenes. It’s obviously a complex relationship that is messy, but it also reflects their crazy circumstances and youthful understanding of the world and each other. Deep down they both want to be accepted by each other, but Asuka wants acceptance more than Shinji. Shinji is so defeatist through most of the anime it really takes until the last couple episodes and End of Eva - which compliment those same episodes - for his growth to fully realize. Shinji’s relationship with Rei is more of a friendship and doing the right thing by each other. Shinji might have been sexually attracted to her to an extent, but only in a youthful immature way. The scene showing a "naked" version of Rei, Misato, and Asuka was simply there for the angel Leliel to abuse his weaknesses at that point in the anime and doesn't reflect a Harem or something being desired by Shinji. That scene took place in episode 16 far before Shinji developed in these last episodes. 

Almost every character in Evangelion has value so to suggest she's just a piece is kind of downplaying how important that piece is to the overall story.



FormerlyTeamSilent13 said:

To be fair to everyone who watched this movie and not the anime, these are suppose to be expansions to episode 25 and 26. This is not a standalone movie. So calling it trash without understanding this fact is just ignorant to what is marketed itself as.

Well OP watched the anime and still had that opinion.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

FormerlyTeamSilent13 said:
 

I liked your comment praising Asuka because I think she gets a lot of hate for no reason as well, but Rei is misunderstood and the best girl meme is an extreme result of people not getting her character. Rei is literally a supernatural being combined with a science experiment. Her arc is defined by her choice for humanity. Rei is not meant to be super relatable because she’s not normal in any sense of the word. Rei is an angel who's soul moves between multiple clones and has a memory and personality of the child body/clone that she is. Rei at first suffers from lack of self worth due to her absurd circumstances and she overcomes this by saving her friends and humanity against what she sees as evil as she grows to find meaning. Crushing the glasses and seemingly forcing the suicide of the mass production units are small pieces of evidence to this puzzle. Rei is choosing the good she sees in Shinji and Asuka and allowing Lilin (humanity) to continue on an unknown path rather than Gendo’s personal god complex path or SEELE’s dogmatic eugenic path for evolution. Rei rejects SEELE without them knowing of each other directly throughout the series because their path crosses once she takes control of instrumentality. Her character is about sacrifice. She was created to be used as a sacrifice for Gendo and she ultimately chooses to sacrifice herself in a way that would help her friends. 

I believe her arc and the story as a whole is meant to display the sort of positive overcome of nihilism that I think Ano probably relates to. (This last sentence is speculation because his interviews are all over the place and ultimately he doesn’t want the meaning to be explained in an on the nose way so he self contradicts himself sometimes, I simply use all the information we are given in the best way I can) Her character in some aspects is similar to Aeris/th from FF7, but an even more depressing set of circumstances and higher level of power over events. They really aren't the same for a variety of reasons, but I'm just using this comparison to help people better understand how Rei fits into the story of Evangelion.

To be fair I never got the Shinji-Rei ships or the best girl meme. It’s so obvious from any point in the series that Shinji and Asuka make better sense together. From their complimentary opposite design to their synchronization scenes. It’s obviously a complex relationship that is messy, but it also reflects their crazy circumstances and youthful understanding of the world and each other. Deep down they both want to be accepted by each other, but Asuka wants acceptance more than Shinji. Shinji is so defeatist through most of the anime it really takes until the last couple episodes and End of Eva - which compliment those same episodes - for his growth to fully realize. Shinji’s relationship with Rei is more of a friendship and doing the right thing by each other. Shinji might have been sexually attracted to her to an extent, but only in a youthful immature way. The scene showing a "naked" version of Rei, Misato, and Asuka was simply there for the angel Leliel to abuse his weaknesses at that point in the anime and doesn't reflect a Harem or something being desired by Shinji. That scene took place in episode 16 far before Shinji developed in these last episodes. 

Almost every character in Evangelion has value so to suggest she's just a piece is kind of downplaying how important that piece is to the overall story.

Great post.

I just want to clarify that "Rei best girl" to me isn't about shipping at all, but just me saying that she was my favorite character from the show. I don't really think that you should be shipping anyone in NGE. They need to figure their own shit out first before getting into a relationship. I just really enjoy Rei as a character, I find her interactions with the different characters, her unique perspective and her story to be fascinating, and I love her character design.



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FormerlyTeamSilent13 said:
NightlyPoe said:

I'll be honest, I never got the appeal of Rei.  I don't hate her, and am fine with her being the show's mascot, but she felt like more of a piece for the other characters to bounce off of than much of anything herself.  It's not so much that there's nothing to latch onto to analyze and feel emotions about, it's more that I'm not interested in investing in a character that has such relatively little meat.

Oh, one other little bit about Evangelion.  I find myself humming "Komm Süsser Tod" (the "tumbling down" song that plays during instrumentality in End of Evangelion) at work sometimes.  No one's gotten it yet and it amuses me that this happy, upbeat song is about the apocalypse.

 
NightlyPoe said:

I'll be honest, I never got the appeal of Rei.  I don't hate her, and am fine with her being the show's mascot, but she felt like more of a piece for the other characters to bounce off of than much of anything herself.  It's not so much that there's nothing to latch onto to analyze and feel emotions about, it's more that I'm not interested in investing in a character that has such relatively little meat.

Oh, one other little bit about Evangelion.  I find myself humming "Komm Süsser Tod" (the "tumbling down" song that plays during instrumentality in End of Evangelion) at work sometimes.  No one's gotten it yet and it amuses me that this happy, upbeat song is about the apocalypse.

I liked your comment praising Asuka because I think she gets a lot of hate for no reason as well, but Rei is misunderstood and the best girl meme is an extreme result of people not getting her character. Rei is literally a supernatural being combined with a science experiment. Her arc is defined by her choice for humanity. Rei is not meant to be super relatable because she’s not normal in any sense of the word. Rei is an angel who's soul moves between multiple clones and has a memory and personality of the child body/clone that she is. Rei at first suffers from lack of self worth due to her absurd circumstances and she overcomes this by saving her friends and humanity against what she sees as evil as she grows to find meaning. Crushing the glasses and seemingly forcing the suicide of the mass production units are small pieces of evidence to this puzzle. Rei is choosing the good she sees in Shinji and Asuka and allowing Lilin (humanity) to continue on an unknown path rather than Gendo’s personal god complex path or SEELE’s dogmatic eugenic path for evolution. Rei rejects SEELE without them knowing of each other directly throughout the series because their path crosses once she takes control of instrumentality. Her character is about sacrifice. She was created to be used as a sacrifice for Gendo and she ultimately chooses to sacrifice herself in a way that would help her friends. 

I believe her arc and the story as a whole is meant to display the sort of positive overcome of nihilism that I think Ano probably relates to. (This last sentence is speculation because his interviews are all over the place and ultimately he doesn’t want the meaning to be explained in an on the nose way so he self contradicts himself sometimes, I simply use all the information we are given in the best way I can) Her character in some aspects is similar to Aeris/th from FF7, but an even more depressing set of circumstances and higher level of power over events. They really aren't the same for a variety of reasons, but I'm just using this comparison to help people better understand how Rei fits into the story of Evangelion.

To be fair I never got the Shinji-Rei ships or the best girl meme. It’s so obvious from any point in the series that Shinji and Asuka make better sense together. From their complimentary opposite design to their synchronization scenes. It’s obviously a complex relationship that is messy, but it also reflects their crazy circumstances and youthful understanding of the world and each other. Deep down they both want to be accepted by each other, but Asuka wants acceptance more than Shinji. Shinji is so defeatist through most of the anime it really takes until the last couple episodes and End of Eva - which compliment those same episodes - for his growth to fully realize. Shinji’s relationship with Rei is more of a friendship and doing the right thing by each other. Shinji might have been sexually attracted to her to an extent, but only in a youthful immature way. The scene showing a "naked" version of Rei, Misato, and Asuka was simply there for the angel Leliel to abuse his weaknesses at that point in the anime and doesn't reflect a Harem or something being desired by Shinji. That scene took place in episode 16 far before Shinji developed in these last episodes. 

Almost every character in Evangelion has value so to suggest she's just a piece is kind of downplaying how important that piece is to the overall story.

To ship the clone of the mother with Shinji is to otaku for me.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

eva01beserk said:
Jumpin said:

Yeah, that's their background information, and while it is interesting stuff for those who like the franchise, they're trivial details in comparison to the big picture and their roles in the plot. The plot really exists to meander through the various psychologically broken characters and how they're coping in an insane world struggling against the impending apocalypse. There's a lot of background information, both implicit and explicit; and with the way film and TV have been since the 1980s, some people just can't digest the implicit stuff - they'll watch a film like Vertigo or Notorious by Alfred Hitchcock and completely miss all of the sexual stuff and emotional/mental abuse in it; sometimes, especially in older films when implicit details were commonplace, it's an artistic expression to get around the censorship of the era, but other times it's an artistic expression just to pack in a lot for viewers to think about. Neon Genesis is that sort of work.

I think, with Neon Genesis, a lot of what the creator was trying to express (outside the plot) was his sci-fi interpretation of Genesis, biblical apocrypha, Daniel, and revelation. But unpacking this stuff is mainly for the people who love it, not for casual viewers like the guy from the original post. It's kind of like Lord of the Rings, there's the story of Lord of the Rings, but then there's the gigantic world of Middle Earth revealed by Lord of the Rings and its additional work (which is primarily in the Appendix, the Silmarillion/Lost Tales, and the Unfinished Tales of Numenor), there is so much about Middle Earth that can be gleaned by the journey through it, the languages, the cultures, the politics, and where the divisions occur; but then, for the more casual reader, there is Lord of the Rings, the heroic romance of the destruction of the ring of power; but that plot really wasn't Tolkien's main goal for the book, he wanted to express the cultures and history of his created universe which in turn is where his created languages reside; but that's for those who share that interest, the heroic romance part is for the transmission to the hundreds of millions of others who have read it - and occasionally he'll hook a new person into the deeper goal of his writing.

this was one of the first animes to target an older audience. After it there where many who follow its footsteps. But still being the first I'm gona go on a limb and say mostly kids watched this. Like me I was really young when I first saw this. There was no way for me to grasp any of this. 

You'd be surprised.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Jumpin said:
eva01beserk said:

this was one of the first animes to target an older audience. After it there where many who follow its footsteps. But still being the first I'm gona go on a limb and say mostly kids watched this. Like me I was really young when I first saw this. There was no way for me to grasp any of this. 

You'd be surprised.

Barefoot Gen manga is very good, and it talks about something very heavy and direct with the Hiroshima and Nagasaki theme.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

NightlyPoe said:
Jumpin said:

You'd be surprised.

Yeah, you could keep going for awhile if you want.  I think one of the things that westerners don't get about anime is just how diverse it is.

I think the block comes from the west's comic book industry's own lack of diversity.  I think the inflection point was in the 1950s after the whole Comic Code Authority thing happened in the United States and killed off the popular romance, western, horror, and mystery along with many other genres leaving only costumed heroes, a few licensed IPs, and some vestiges like Archie Comics.  This not only capped the diversity, but also the audience.

Japan went in the opposite direction and their manga filled every niche it could find, which broadened the audience and made the whole thing a lot more mainstream.  And, since a lot of anime series and OVA are, to a large degree, glorified advertisements for ongoing manga and its merchandise, anime became diverse as well.

The idea of a diverse comic book industry acting as a feeder for the animation industry in dozens of genres and sub-genres every year is a fairly foreign concept.  Hence, you get attempts from many quarters to pigeon-hole it to one degree of the other using the many tropes that have also piled up over the years.

Sorry if that doesn't quite fit you eva01beserk.  I let myself get on a bit of a tangent.

I don't remember the last time I thought about a theme for a manga and didn't found one that was either on that exact theme or at least touched very near to suffice. Almost everthing have something released on.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

VAMatt said:
I feel like this can be said of the ending of most movies. Probably 90% or so.

I have to say I've always felt like this with movies and games. Endings are usually weak or feel rushed. 



My bet with The_Liquid_Laser: I think the Switch won't surpass the PS2 as the best selling system of all time. If it does, I'll play a game of a list that The_Liquid_Laser will provide, I will have to play it for 50 hours or complete it, whatever comes first.