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Forums - Politics Discussion - Are you OK with games becoming more Politically Correct?

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Is PC ruining gaming?

Yes 19 31.67%
 
No, you're just being silly! Ah 41 68.33%
 
Total:60
Chrkeller said:

It makes as much sense as Drake running through the Gabon rainforest with only a sock over his genitals.  

I'd play that.

Last edited by Mnementh - on 30 March 2020

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Otter said:
sales2099 said:

Mass Effect Andromeda. Loved the trilogy because of the immersive galaxy of diverse aliens and cultures. 

Andromeda felt different from a story perspective and made some overtly left wing changes to the cultures of the aliens. Like I said, these weren’t deal breakers. I played the game and I enjoyed it in its own right. But it certainly didn’t make me feel the same as playing the trilogy...I couldn’t help noticing the changes. The Krogan and Asari changes are a couple off the top of my head.  

Mass Effect has always been liberal leaning though? So have bioware games in general. I'm only like 8hours into Andromeda so I can't really comment on it specifically but I can see its not up to the standard of old trilogy but for now absolutely nothing to do with trying to be PC lol

No I wouldn’t say that. I’d say ME was politically neutral. The best combination, and that was the point with player choice being the main thing. In Andromeda the Krogan culture evaporating overnight because a male led warrior race that used fertile women as bargaining chips isnt PC, despite them being a fictional alien race that doesn’t impact human culture and values at all. Just one example and I’m only scratching the surface. Don’t want to give you a text wall. 

Like I said, this isn’t a deal breaker, but it was noticeable enough to take me out of the immersion. PCing a traditionally non politically correct alien species was noticeable to lore junkies like myself. 



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sundin13 said:
sales2099 said:

I believe far more democrats are more concerned with games being aligned with their beliefs then their desire to actually play them. Look no further then Twitter or Reddit. 

Creatively I don’t believe a democrat is on the same level as someone politically neutral or conservative. Because from the shows I’ve watched with a left wing slant, the bad guy almost always has a combination of: seeing themselves above women, is a racist, homophobe, and oppressing a marginalized group. It’s so predictable. It makes it so painfully obvious they want you to know who the bad guy is.

A proper way to be creative is to make characters with grey area. Nuance. To be willing to offend to make a greater point, especially when it concerns their own beliefs. Those are things left wing creatives just have a harder time doing.

This is truly ridiculous.

There are literally millions of creators on the left creating amazing art of all kinds. Innumerable musicians, authors, directors, actors, etc are creating amazing art every day. Some bring their politics into their work, others don't, but to say that you don't believe a democrat is on the same creative level is fucking bonkers and shows something seriously fucked in your worldview, dude.

And do you have any evidence that either Gears or Halo weren't created by democrats? Like, Cliffy B, the creator of Gears of War is a fucking Democrat. Check your biases...

I’m not talking art or whatever mediums you are saying. I’m specifically talking TV in my previous example, where villian motivations are black and white and lack nuance. 

But to the real point, I’d say Halo and Gears were made with politically neutral intentions. Which is how video games should be. You saying people can’t change their views in a decades time, that’s highly arguable. Also Cliffy went on record with Lawbreakers saying it’s better to make your success on politically neutral content and only then can you be safe enough to push your personal views. I’m paraphrasing of course, but a quick google search of “Cliffy B Lawbreakers interview” you’ll see my context. 



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RolStoppable said:
sales2099 said:

Nice deflection without talking the point I said in any way. Of course those people are bad guys. I’m saying real creativity has other motivations and grey area at play.

Ill use examples of Xbox titles I know. Gears of War was created with all male soldiers. Because women were only required to have babies. Now I believe women can do what they want with their bodies but here’s the kicker, the game lore gives you a grey area. Because the human population is so low women giving birth like an assembly line was necessary to create the next generation, if humanity survived the locust war. Even in Gears 3 we had women soldiers but they were either too old or infertile, because again healthy women were needed to keep the population alive. If that program didn’t happen Gears 4 would have far fewer humans alive. 

Halo, Xbox’s flagship franchise is built off the idea of kidnapped child soldiers. Who are conscripted, cloned to be given back to families, and they were surgically augmented with a 33% mortality rate to do what...kill human terrorists. While morally reprehensible the greater good would be to save the galactic economy from collapsing and the ensuing riots across human space but more importantly save the lives of millions of civilians who would no doubt be caught in the crossfire. 

Thats my point. Grey area. Being offensive to have a greater point. No way a Democrat can write a premise like these, as I said they make things painfully obvious black and white 

Those are grey areas? Humanity being in a war with aliens that demands sacrifices to be made in order to preserve the human species is something that virtually all humans will get behind. That isn't unlike the current real world situation where entire populations make sacrifices to their freedom in order to combat the coronavirus.

Your disdain for democrats inevitably makes me think that you are with republicans and your examples make me think of real world applications like separating parents and children of illegal immigrants in order to teach them a lesson, because while morally reprehensible, it's for the greater good of the US-American people.

The black and white thinking is also something that has to be clearly filed under republican traits in recent years, because Trump has fostered a mentality of "if you aren't with us, you are against us." And going further with this, you have the mentality of choosing a team and getting behind absolutely everything they do; the community here on VGC knows this from countless Xbox vs. anything discussions where you've been involved. So I look at your democrats vs. republicans view as the same thing. Whereas the average person doesn't give any thought to a racist homophobe being the main antagonist in a fictional story, you'd be going around and say that's a story written by a democrat.

Why did you gloss over what I said about Halo? I said the grey area is child kidnapping/conscription and high risk surgery to fight humans. Which no I don’t think the general population can get behind, which is why ONI did it in secret. Which ended up being just what humanity needed when a bigger alien threat emerged. The former is morally wrong but served a greater good, that’s the nuance and grey area I’m talking about. 

No no...don’t bring in real politics into this. How dare you to even insinuate connections like that. Halos story was created in 2001 so please don’t go there. Myself and many others have a right to keep video games politically neutral. Not conservative or left leaning but neutral. Sometimes one game leans to one side over another, but I just want nuance and interpretation, not painfully obvious black and white good vs bad. 

Last edited by sales2099 - on 30 March 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

Dp 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

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SvennoJ said:
I don't see any differences with how it was 20 years ago. Certainly some things have shifted, and the games have shifted along with them. There is just more 'outrage' nowadays because of the internet. Censorship was no different, actually since the rise of indie games, games have been getting away with a lot more stuff than 20 years ago.

I agree to an extent, there is certainly more outrage these days but who are exactly outraged? Mostly people who don't even play videogames that's who, and 20 years ago videogames still had the stigma of being mostly for kids it was slowly moving away from that stigma with Playstation and Xbox entering the gaming scene but many games had to be censored for having religious or nudity content. Nowadays there is absolutely no reason to censor or change stuff when we have the internet to find out about these changes and call the localisers or developers out on their bullshit.

They're just asking for critique from their fans because publishers/localisers prefer to listen to the loud pc audience who, again, doesn't even buy their games in the first place!

Chazore said:
It's not exactly ruining game, but comic books on the other hand...

Comic books have been niche for a very long time and is now slowly dying even more because of the woke writers. Videogames industry makes even more money than Hollywood and has been very difficult to control and spread woke messages but it's slowly starting now.

Zkuq said:
It's troubling but I don't generally mind it. So far, it's only been an issue in my eyes when history was changed because of political correctness. To an extent, here 'history' also includes remakes of existing games (although in remakes, some changes even in e.g. character looks are to be expected).

Yes, it's starting with the Western gaming industry, after some time the Japanese gaming industry will have to adapt and bow down to the bullshit of western social politics if they want to survive in this market.

Hiku said:
Nautilus said:
While there will always be developers that will lift the middle finger to society and make the games they want, anyone saying that it dosen't impact the games, even in a small way, are lying to themselves.The most recent example is Persona 5 royal, in which Atlus seemingly(haven't played the Royal version, so can't vouch for it) censored a scene which a minority deemed as "racist" or "in bad taste".

Even if you are ok with gay people played for laughs in stereotypical fashion, there are young people who take their own life every day because of how society views and treats them.
I'm not personally bothered by that scene. But I understand how it can be harmful to some. Same with the sexual predator aspect. So I'm fine with not having it in Royal.

Sorry but that is just too weak of a reason for outright censoring the whole scene just because some felt offended by fictional homosexual characters.

Why would i or anyone believe all gays behave like sexual predator pedophiles? Not even 4 year olds these days believe that. This is what i mean by western social politics you can't even make jokes anymore meanwhile Japan gets away with it because they can distinguish fiction from reality.

JRPGfan said:

Im not a fan of censoring stuff out of games.
If a dev makes a game a certain way, keep it that way.

Should PC effect gameing? imo no.
The game devs that hire feminists to give them "advice" and then have them purposefully make "ugly" women characters ect.
It think its stupid. Waste of money, and serves no purpose.

Agreed 

Qwark said:
Well in a way it limits the freedom of developers who give a damn about being PC. On the other hand most Japanese games don't seem to be affected all that much. Having said that some scenes do come over 's lot dumber like the censored scenes in DMC V. With the fear of showing some skin, although I blame Sony for that. Also blatant agenda pushing makes scenes dumber imo.

Tokyo Mirage Sessions? DMC V? Fire Emblem Fates? Persona 5 Royal? Senran Kagura?

JRPGfan said:
Chazore said:
It's not exactly ruining game, but comic books on the other hand...



I'll admit that thicc Poison Ivy looks good because i like thicc women in general but i know that's not exactly the WOKE message that edited image is trying to give LOL

OTBWY said:
I am OK with studio and developers making whatever they want and you having the choice as a consumer to play something else.

I can't wait for MK 12 to bomb whenever it releases if it's another MK 11.

Nautilus said:

But it's a game. And in the end, it's up to the developers to do what they want.I played the original, and didn't think that scene to be offensive in the least.I actually thought it to be quite funny.Why? Because it happened to me.I have already been "bothered" by trans standing on the street harrasing me saying "Come have a baby with me" or "Hey there you sexy". Whether what happened in the game and with me is the exception or not, it does happen, while it made me unconfortable, I don't find it offensive.If a game is allowed to portrait harrasment by white or black people, then a game is also allowed to portrait the same topic but with homosexual people.

Thank you!



Snoorlax said:
Zkuq said:
It's troubling but I don't generally mind it. So far, it's only been an issue in my eyes when history was changed because of political correctness. To an extent, here 'history' also includes remakes of existing games (although in remakes, some changes even in e.g. character looks are to be expected).

Yes, it's starting with the Western gaming industry, after some time the Japanese gaming industry will have to adapt and bow down to the bullshit of western social politics if they want to survive in this market.

I don't see how that's at all relevant to what I said, but "thanks" for the preaching, I suppose. Also, like I said, I don't generally mind it, so if it affects Japanese games, I don't generally care.



sales2099 said:

Why did you gloss over what I said about Halo? I said the grey area is child kidnapping/conscription and high risk surgery to fight humans. Which no I don’t think the general population can get behind, which is why ONI did it in secret. Which ended up being just what humanity needed when a bigger alien threat emerged. The former is morally wrong but served a greater good, that’s the nuance and grey area I’m talking about. 

No no...don’t bring in real politics into this. Halos story was created in 2001 so please don’t go there. Myself and many others have a right to keep video games politically neutral. Not conservative or left leaning but neutral. Sometimes one game leans to one side over another, but I just want nuance and interpretation, not painfully obvious black and white good vs bad. 

I am not familiar with that aspect of Halo's story. But if the events occur in the order you describe, then the kidnappers are bad guys and remain bad guys with no grey area. They just happened to luck out that their dirty deeds had a benefit to them. Why do you view that as a grey area? All I can think of as justification for a grey area is that it's okay to do bad things because someday there could be some way in which it is beneficial and might appear to be not as bad, after all.

You don't have a right to keep video games politically neutral. The right you have is to reject products that you don't like.



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Zkuq said:
Snoorlax said:

Yes, it's starting with the Western gaming industry, after some time the Japanese gaming industry will have to adapt and bow down to the bullshit of western social politics if they want to survive in this market.

I don't see how that's at all relevant to what I said, but "thanks" for the preaching, I suppose. Also, like I said, I don't generally mind it, so if it affects Japanese games, I don't generally care.

Well, what do you want me to say? Congratulations?

First you say it's troubling but you generally don't care for it, then you say only if History gets changed then you do care... Oh! and also remakes and stuff BUT you generally don't care it... Okay?

I for one do care, cause i invested lots of time and money in videogame franchises that i liked and those are now slowly being manipulated by an audience who doesn't care for these games in the first place.



sales2099 said:
sundin13 said:

This is truly ridiculous.

There are literally millions of creators on the left creating amazing art of all kinds. Innumerable musicians, authors, directors, actors, etc are creating amazing art every day. Some bring their politics into their work, others don't, but to say that you don't believe a democrat is on the same creative level is fucking bonkers and shows something seriously fucked in your worldview, dude.

And do you have any evidence that either Gears or Halo weren't created by democrats? Like, Cliffy B, the creator of Gears of War is a fucking Democrat. Check your biases...

I’m not talking art or whatever mediums you are saying. I’m specifically talking TV in my previous example, where villian motivations are black and white and lack nuance. 

But to the real point, I’d say Halo and Gears were made with politically neutral intentions. Which is how video games should be. You saying people can’t change their views in a decades time, that’s highly arguable. Also Cliffy went on record with Lawbreakers saying it’s better to make your success on politically neutral content and only then can you be safe enough to push your personal views. I’m paraphrasing of course, but a quick google search of “Cliffy B Lawbreakers interview” you’ll see my context. 

An individual doesn't cease to be a democrat when they create something without a political intent. That individual is still a democrat, creating as such and their political views and worldview influence their creation whether they intend to make a political statement or not. These ways are often subtle and nuanced, which makes me feel as if you have created a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy, where you bravely proclaim "Bad art is bad when it is bad".

Like, wow. Let that brave conclusion sink in for a second.

Sure, art which is badly written is badly written. I accept that. But was it badly written because it was written by a democrat? I mean, clearly not. You have already acknowledged that Democrats can make great art. So then, what is the purpose here? A condemnation of all political art, because some of it is bad? That seems incredibly reductive. Even moreso if you only apply that to democrats. There is no metric in which you can truly make that conclusion, especially when most artists are liberal.

That leaves me largely back where I started. You don't like certain things which challenge your personal worldview, and as such, a bias is created and reinforced which leads you to make incredibly questionable statements such as:

"Creatively I don’t believe a democrat is on the same level as someone politically neutral or conservative."

"No way a Democrat can write a premise like these, as I said they make things painfully obvious black and white"

Not only do these statements reflect massive biases and assumptions in your worldview, but they also demonstrate how the goalposts are silently shifting as you are challenged. First you state that a democrat can't write a premise like this, but then you shift to say that, sure, a democrat can write a premise like this, but only when they aren't actively democrat-ing, whatever that would entail. Fact is, democrats can often write nuance, which shouldn't be a surprise, because someone's political leaning's doesn't determine how good of an artist they are.