Forums - General Discussion - Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Thread

You concerned yet?

Yes 92 49.46%
 
No, but I will be followi... 50 26.88%
 
No, its being overblown 44 23.66%
 
Total:186

3/31: US-Italy Charts and others.

The US had a nasty increase in both new cases and deaths.  24,000 new cases.  For reference, we had 24,000 cases total just 10 days ago.  748 deaths. For reference, we had 780 deaths total just 1 weeks ago. Even more worrisome is that NYC only account for 1/3rd where in they typically have accounted for half (or more).  That means it is escalating elsewhere. Every state now has more than 100 cases.

Italy basically mirrored Monday which is still good news for them. New cases were the same.  Deaths were up very slightly.

Spain: News cases stayed about the same but deaths were lower from 913 to 748.  Perhaps they are moving into the same phase Italy has been in lately.  That would be great news.

France: Their new cases doubled.  Deaths were up too which has now moved them past China.

The Philippines saw 1/4th of all their new cases yesterday.  Nearly a 5x leap from the cases from the previous day.  Thankfully, deaths did not replicate that pattern.



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SpokenTruth said:

3/31: US-Italy Charts and others.

The US had a nasty increase in both new cases and deaths.  24,000 new cases.  For reference, we had 24,000 cases total just 10 days ago.  748 deaths. For reference, we had 780 deaths total just 1 weeks ago. Even more worrisome is that NYC only account for 1/3rd where in they typically have accounted for half (or more).  That means it is escalating elsewhere. Every state now has more than 100 cases.

Italy basically mirrored Monday which is still good news for them. New cases were the same.  Deaths were up very slightly.

Spain: News cases stayed about the same but deaths were lower from 913 to 748.  Perhaps they are moving into the same phase Italy has been in lately.  That would be great news.

France: Their new cases doubled.  Deaths were up too which has now moved them past China.

The Philippines saw 1/4th of all their new cases yesterday.  Nearly a 5x leap from the cases from the previous day.  Thankfully, deaths did not replicate that pattern.

You probably meant NYS (state) instead of NYC (city)

Whats really concerning is that the number of cases today was much higher than the last two previous days while testing a fewer amount of people. Could mean that the virus is spreading more than previously thought especially in states like Florida (1st day with over 1k cases) that don't have a stay at home order. 



chakkra said:
vivster said:

I assume those numbers are based on confirmed cases. If we consider that especially among younger people there are way more unreported cases those numbers really are laughable for anyone under 40. Also not included in those stats are additional health issues like smoking, obesity asthma etc. Which brings down the hospitalization rate for young and healthy people down even further and the fatality rate close to zero. So pretty much what is expected.

I'm well aware of the ramifications of this virus and I wouldn't recommend to any young person to leave their house for any non essential reason. I just don't like the increased dramatization of "OH LOOK, THERE IS A SICK YOUNG PERSON! THAT MEANS THE VIRUS WILL KILL EVERYONE!" when that's incredibly far from the truth.

I think everybody KNOWS that the virus will not actually kill everybody, especially if you are young and healthy, BUT almost everybody have people on their lives that they care about that might be in a higher danger than them, and they don't want to be the ones who take the sickness into their families.

And you have been downplaying this since the very beginning, like when you said: "Just checked and in 2017 in the US alone 55000 people died from Influenza and Pneumonia. Haven't seen any panic about that anywhere." and "It's some kind of virus that spreads fast and has comparably mild symptoms. If I was worried about that I shouldn't be able to even leave my home because flu and cold season is coming and that shit also spreads fast and kills people. But this virus is new and sexy and a novelty, which is why so many bored privileged people are suddenly "concerned" about it." back in January 26th.

If the world had listened to you back then, we would had been in a much, MUCH, worse state right now.

I kinda still stand by what I said because it was based on solid data. Also I never suggested to not take measures against it, that was just inferred by my lack of care. I applaud governments who took steps against it and shaking my head at those who didn't. The fact is, by that time the world actually listened to me because they had the same numbers to look at. And looks like it still turned out better than all the doom sayers were preaching. We're still far away from the worst case scenario that I imagined and we'll never reach it at this point be cause the virus simply isn't strong enough.

What I do admit is that I definitely overestimated the health systems of other countries. Thinking that other developed countries had a similarly well prepared health system as Germany was a mistake. I should've known better since I'm always the one saying that Germany is the best place in the world to live a healthy and safe life. Thanks to the virus I actually got that confirmation now.

I'm still not scared about the virus and I do not expect any significant lasting effects from it long term. I have a robust trust in my country and the world as a whole to recover quickly from this special inconvenience. I would consider myself a realist, but in a time where everyone is a pessimist I guess I'll take on the role of the unshakable optimist.

Preventable deaths aren't a good thing, but it would be a bold faced lie if I said I really care. Every year millions of people die from preventable deaths and I didn't care then either and neither did anyone who cares now. I'm probably also gonna die some day of a preventable cause and it's gonna suck. But if I went that way looking at my life I might as well kill myself now because that is no way of living.

When I look at the death numbers I don't think of the lives lost or the pain of their loved ones. It's impossible to take all of that in. Instead I think of freed up ICUs to save more people and I think of a slightly lower death rate in the coming years. On a global levels those "scary" numbers are still not scary to me because they dwarf against the people who are unaffected. You might say that I'm cold or a sociopath and that is probably true, but I know that me being sad or scared in this situation is helping exactly no one. I'm just doing my job and so should everyone else.

And you know what's gonna be the real fun? After all of this is over, people like you will just go back to not caring again and we'll still have preventable diseases spread like wildfires. People will look at influenza deaths and laugh about them, refusing to wear face masks, not wash their hands and go sick to work. And people whose lives were saved by vaccines will do campaigns about not trusting vaccines. And people will continue to smoke and drink and kill other people in the process. And you won't care and neither will anyone else. But at least for once in your life you can have the moral high ground over some random guy on the internet because of a temporary global pandemic. Now go and pad yourself on the back, you sure showed me. 

Last edited by vivster - on 01 April 2020

If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

It's hilarious to see people focus their anger on China right now. Ignoring the fact that each country could've prevented their own epidemic it's comical to see people suddenly care about that China may not be the coolest country to deal with and that their countless human rights abuses might not be a great thing. China has been a shithole for decades and has grown more dangerous not only to their own people but everyone else on earth every year. But now that they brought the sniffles to the world it's suddenly too much.

I would say it's a great thing that people finally start to notice China if I wasn't so god damn sure that everything will go back to status quo after each country dealt with their own problem.



If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

vivster said:

It's hilarious to see people focus their anger on China right now. Ignoring the fact that each country could've prevented their own epidemic it's comical to see people suddenly care about that China may not be the coolest country to deal with and that their countless human rights abuses might not be a great thing. China has been a shithole for decades and has grown more dangerous not only to their own people but everyone else on earth every year. But now that they brought the sniffles to the world it's suddenly too much.

I would say it's a great thing that people finally start to notice China if I wasn't so god damn sure that everything will go back to status quo after each country dealt with their own problem.

But what if someone already recognized the Chinese ruling party for what it was well before the outbreak? Would they have your permission to show indignance towards the Chinese government for their role in being the catalyst in the Tik Tok black death? Asking for friend.

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COKTOE said:
vivster said:

It's hilarious to see people focus their anger on China right now. Ignoring the fact that each country could've prevented their own epidemic it's comical to see people suddenly care about that China may not be the coolest country to deal with and that their countless human rights abuses might not be a great thing. China has been a shithole for decades and has grown more dangerous not only to their own people but everyone else on earth every year. But now that they brought the sniffles to the world it's suddenly too much.

I would say it's a great thing that people finally start to notice China if I wasn't so god damn sure that everything will go back to status quo after each country dealt with their own problem.

But what if someone already recognized the Chinese ruling party for what it was well before the outbreak? Would they have your permission to show indignance towards the Chinese government for their role in being the catalyst in the Tik Tok black death? Asking for friend.

Yes. But the outrage shan't be virus specific. That I will allow.



If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

vivster said:

I would say it's a great thing that people finally start to notice China if I wasn't so god damn sure that everything will go back to status quo after each country dealt with their own problem.

True. The real madness here is how the West put their economies in China's hands. But hey, gotta keep the economy going, so we're ready to close our eyes and pretend we don't see what happens there.

This whole crisis may have originated in China and China may have hidden the real danger of this virus to protect its economy, but all countries are responsible for the current situation, especially those countries that where still downplaying the issue when hundreds were dying in Italy and even Italy was too slow and only acted when it was obvious that this thing has the potential to kill hundreds of thousands of people if left unchecked.



last92 said:
vivster said:

I would say it's a great thing that people finally start to notice China if I wasn't so god damn sure that everything will go back to status quo after each country dealt with their own problem.

True. The real madness here is how the West put their economies in China's hands. But hey, gotta keep the economy going, so we're ready to close our eyes and pretend we don't see what happens there.

This whole crisis may have originated in China and China may have hidden the real danger of this virus to protect its economy, but all countries are responsible for the current situation, especially those countries that where still downplaying the issue when hundreds were dying in Italy and even Italy was too slow and only acted when it was obvious that this thing has the potential to kill hundreds of thousands of people if left unchecked.

What if I told you that there are still people downplaying the issue? Makes it really tough to blame it on China now.



If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

vivster said:

What if I told you that there are still people downplaying the issue? Makes it really tough to blame it on China now.

Feeble-minded people that can't accept they were wrong and don't want to change their official stance even if deep down they know they were being unreasonable. 

And I still blame China. They're the main culprit here, let's not kid ourselves. They knew everything and stayed quiet because of money and reputation. They're just not the only culprit. After all, other advanced countries acted late for the same reasons.



vivster said:
chakkra said:

I think everybody KNOWS that the virus will not actually kill everybody, especially if you are young and healthy, BUT almost everybody have people on their lives that they care about that might be in a higher danger than them, and they don't want to be the ones who take the sickness into their families.

And you have been downplaying this since the very beginning, like when you said: "Just checked and in 2017 in the US alone 55000 people died from Influenza and Pneumonia. Haven't seen any panic about that anywhere." and "It's some kind of virus that spreads fast and has comparably mild symptoms. If I was worried about that I shouldn't be able to even leave my home because flu and cold season is coming and that shit also spreads fast and kills people. But this virus is new and sexy and a novelty, which is why so many bored privileged people are suddenly "concerned" about it." back in January 26th.

If the world had listened to you back then, we would had been in a much, MUCH, worse state right now.

I kinda still stand by what I said because it was based on solid data. Also I never suggested to not take measures against it, that was just inferred by my lack of care. I applaud governments who took steps against it and shaking my head at those who didn't. The fact is, by that time the world actually listened to me because they had the same numbers to look at. And looks like it still turned out better than all the doom sayers were preaching. We're still far away from the worst case scenario that I imagined and we'll never reach it at this point be cause the virus simply isn't strong enough.

What I do admit is that I definitely overestimated the health systems of other countries. Thinking that other developed countries had a similarly well prepared health system as Germany was a mistake. I should've known better since I'm always the one saying that Germany is the best place in the world to live a healthy and safe life. Thanks to the virus I actually got that confirmation now.

I'm still not scared about the virus and I do not expect any significant lasting effects from it long term. I have a robust trust in my country and the world as a whole to recover quickly from this special inconvenience. I would consider myself a realist, but in a time where everyone is a pessimist I guess I'll take on the role of the unshakable optimist.

Preventable deaths aren't a good thing, but it would be a bold faced lie if I said I really care. Every year millions of people die from preventable deaths and I didn't care then either and neither did anyone who cares now. I'm probably also gonna die some day of a preventable cause and it's gonna suck. But if I went that way looking at my life I might as well kill myself now because that is no way of living.

When I look at the death numbers I don't think of the lives lost or the pain of their loved ones. It's impossible to take all of that in. Instead I think of freed up ICUs to save more people and I think of a slightly lower death rate in the coming years. On a global levels those "scary" numbers are still not scary to me because they dwarf against the people who are unaffected. You might say that I'm cold or a sociopath and that is probably true, but I know that me being sad or scared in this situation is helping exactly no one. I'm just doing my job and so should everyone else.

And you know what's gonna be the real fun? After all of this is over, people like you will just go back to not caring again and we'll still have preventable diseases spread like wildfires. People will look at influenza deaths and laugh about them, refusing to wear face masks, not wash their hands and go sick to work. And people whose lives were saved by vaccines will do campaigns about not trusting vaccines. And people will continue to smoke and drink and kill other people in the process. And you won't care and neither will anyone else. But at least for once in your life you can have the moral high ground over some random guy on the internet because of a temporary global pandemic. Now go and pad yourself on the back, you sure showed me. 

Great post in general, but I have to comment on the bolded portion. Germany has the laxest laws on meat production, so it's home to the lowest quality meat in Europe. A consequence of the mass production of meat is that there's a lot of poo from the animals which is then spread on the fields in excess because nobody knows where to go with it; the result is that water quality has begun to suffer in Germany, and water is the most essential thing for human life.

So no, Germany is definitely not the best place to live a healthy and safe life, because your country is literally full of shit.



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