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Forums - Politics - Official 2020 US Election: Democratic Party Discussion

Jumpin said:

Anyway, on further thoughts, I think the three Elders were solidified: Sanders, Warren, and Biden. There were attacks against them, but they were all weak and inconsequential, mostly brushed off because they were either not accurate or not significant. I only think Sanders, Warren, or Biden affect each other at this point, the others aren't necessary at this point. I hope that the next debate focuses on these three without the rest of the noise.

I'm not saying the others did poorly in the given format. I thought many came off great. But the issue is that there's nothing new.

Nothing moves except Beto, who I felt came off amateurish - he lacked the convictions he had the last time. So he's back down to where he was after the first debate. Buttigieg, again, came off inauthentic and imprecise, shifting subjects to fit his talking points even if they were blatantly off-topic.

Steyer is the only one who I felt I learned anything new about. I didn't make a huge splash, but he came off competent, but he reminds me of an imitation brand Inslee. I think he's too little too late.

If there's anyone on the stage who I wish was polling better, it would be Booker, Castro, and Yang. I feel they're underachieving, but at the same time, Yang is a newbie, so it's expected for him to be where he is. I hardly can wait to see where these three go in the future. I think Booker is right that the winning candidate needs to be able to inspire. I also agree, strongly, with him that the petty attacks are a waste of time and counter-productive.

Well, the top 3 accounts for around 70% in the RCP-averages, so that means the other candidates are still worth 30% all together. Which means they still have importance - if they drop out and decide to endorse one of the top 3.



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Rising sees Bernie Sanders as big winner overall, not only the debate:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0RQDVrcZF0

Last edited by Mnementh - on 16 October 2019

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Ipsos Research for FiveThirtyEight on share of respondents who are considering voting for each candidate:

Well, I called it, didn't I? The moderates and Lizzie with her pro-gamer strats did the best.



 

 

 

 

 

haxxiy said:

Good performances from Klobuchar and Buttigieg, some good statements from Biden and Booker. Overall a good night for moderates.

Meanwhile Tootsie does her Russia thing, and Bernie and McMeme defend more taxes. Which, obviously, the suburban folk who carried Dems to victory in 2018 will love, and finally prove rural Whites are actually closet socialists waiting to vote for something that isn't rampant racism. At least Warren was smart enough not to give Trump and the Republicans this soundbite.

Waiting for our friends at VGC again to give their expert analysis on how the debate will move the polls this time ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Good lord.. I guess this stupid bullshit conspiracy theory is never going to stop is it? 

I suppose I should just make peace with it. If it honestly makes Neolibs feel better (not sure why it would..?) then whatever, no skin off my back.

The power of the media on people's opinions is utterly frightening to me.

Some people here have clearly made up their minds on Tulsi no matter how baseless these views are. But I may have to stop coming to this thread. Legitimate criticisms is one thing but I'm completely sick of the stupid Russian/Assad conspiracy theories. It honestly pisses me off. And frankly I see enough of that garbage on twitter. I don't come to this website to get annoyed or angry, twitter does that for me enough as is XD

Last edited by DarthMetalliCube - on 16 October 2019

 

"We hold these truths to be self-evident - all men and women created by the, go-you know.. you know the thing!" - Joe Biden

DarthMetalliCube said:
haxxiy said:

Good performances from Klobuchar and Buttigieg, some good statements from Biden and Booker. Overall a good night for moderates.

Meanwhile Tootsie does her Russia thing, and Bernie and McMeme defend more taxes. Which, obviously, the suburban folk who carried Dems to victory in 2018 will love, and finally prove rural Whites are actually closet socialists waiting to vote for something that isn't rampant racism. At least Warren was smart enough not to give Trump and the Republicans this soundbite.

Waiting for our friends at VGC again to give their expert analysis on how the debate will move the polls this time ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Good lord.. I guess this stupid bullshit conspiracy theory is never going to stop is it? 

I suppose I should just make peace with it. If it honestly makes Neolibs feel better (not sure why it would..?) then whatever, no skin off my back.

The power of the media on people's opinions is utterly frightening to me.

Some people here have clearly made up their minds on Tulsi no matter how baseless these views are. But I may have to stop coming to this thread. Legitimate criticisms is one thing but I'm completely sick of the stupid Russian/Assad conspiracy theories. It honestly pisses me off. And frankly I see enough of that garbage on twitter. I don't come to this website to get annoyed or angry, twitter does that for me enough as is XD

Welp, for your sanity as a Tulsi supporter I wouldn't be stopping by here often as you'd have to be correcting most every second and even when you provide articles and facts and statements to back up your claims you'll still end up with the smears and such coming around and around. Its Tough to support Tulsi. She's getting it the hardest from the establishment.

But don't worry, even though she failed to have it translate completely during the debate, she did make Pete admit that if he was president he would continue the endless wars, even if he tried to talk out of both sides of his mouth all his explanation came down to was "yes I will keep our troops in and not remove them" aka endless war. (also cheap plug but follow me on twitter, I'm the yoshi and squirtle guy).

But Yes, you're not the only one sick of the Assad apologist and Russia thing. We conveniently forget that she spoke to both Assad and the opposition, and the same when it comes to Modi and we also seem to forget that for diplomacy to take place and for peace to be a thing we need to not only talk to allies but enemies as well. But hey, apparently talking to "enemies" gets you labelled a traitor even though its your job as a member of congress on the foreign affairs committee right?



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uran10 said:
DarthMetalliCube said:

Good lord.. I guess this stupid bullshit conspiracy theory is never going to stop is it? 

I suppose I should just make peace with it. If it honestly makes Neolibs feel better (not sure why it would..?) then whatever, no skin off my back.

The power of the media on people's opinions is utterly frightening to me.

Some people here have clearly made up their minds on Tulsi no matter how baseless these views are. But I may have to stop coming to this thread. Legitimate criticisms is one thing but I'm completely sick of the stupid Russian/Assad conspiracy theories. It honestly pisses me off. And frankly I see enough of that garbage on twitter. I don't come to this website to get annoyed or angry, twitter does that for me enough as is XD

Welp, for your sanity as a Tulsi supporter I wouldn't be stopping by here often as you'd have to be correcting most every second and even when you provide articles and facts and statements to back up your claims you'll still end up with the smears and such coming around and around. Its Tough to support Tulsi. She's getting it the hardest from the establishment.

But don't worry, even though she failed to have it translate completely during the debate, she did make Pete admit that if he was president he would continue the endless wars, even if he tried to talk out of both sides of his mouth all his explanation came down to was "yes I will keep our troops in and not remove them" aka endless war. (also cheap plug but follow me on twitter, I'm the yoshi and squirtle guy).

But Yes, you're not the only one sick of the Assad apologist and Russia thing. We conveniently forget that she spoke to both Assad and the opposition, and the same when it comes to Modi and we also seem to forget that for diplomacy to take place and for peace to be a thing we need to not only talk to allies but enemies as well. But hey, apparently talking to "enemies" gets you labelled a traitor even though its your job as a member of congress on the foreign affairs committee right?

I mean of course she's not perfect and I welcome criticisms and discussion based on that, but 90% of the negative stuff I see about Gabbard in this thread is baseless, unfair smears about her and how her, odd digs at her supporters as "weird cultists" or something.. and grand conspiracy theories about how "she's a Russian plant." Yeah a gd Major in the US National Guard who has served for 16 years and currently serving US congresswoman from Hawaii is a Kremlin plant. Like my god.. The denseness of this actually hurts my brain lol. 

I mean there's legitimate discussion/critiques and there's this misinformed character assassination bullshit and that's where I draw the line. I hear enough of this slander from twitter and the media.

Can't seem to find ya there - feel free to drop me a line



 

"We hold these truths to be self-evident - all men and women created by the, go-you know.. you know the thing!" - Joe Biden

Just felt like I should drop this here. Please take your time to watch the full video past the endorsement talk.



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I just want highlight the fact that Biden didn't need to be yelling like half the time he was speaking, especially that one exchange with Warren, he sounded like a stereotypical mad old man. Sanders was more light-hearted and smiled a lot more than usual when it comes to debates. Warren was Warren, calm and collected; didn't really yell but wasn't really light-hearted.



 

morenoingrato said:

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/democratic-debate-october-poll/

Thanks for that link. The favorability got updated in the meanwhile:

Biden gained minimally, both in favorability and unfavorability, leaving him virtually unchanged.

Sanders, on the other hand, gained a bit of favorability, but his unfavorability dropped also bit, making him come dangerously close to Biden

Warren gained a nice chunk of favorability, just enough to overtake Sanders in the process in that regard, all while being the candidate apart from Buttigieg with the lowest unfavorability, giving her the best ratio by a long shot.

Harris gained twice as much unfavorability as she gained favorability, overtaking Sanders in that regard. But she didn't botch up as much as Beto did, who not only gained over 5% in unfavorability, but also is the only candidate who lost favorability. Gabbard gained more unfavorability than him, but also gained some favorability, hence making Beto and Tulsi the big losers of the evening. Castro is o the third spot with these dishonors, as his unfavorability rose quite a bit while his favorability stayed almost unchanged.

Cory Booker is also one of the losers. He gained more unfavorability than he got favors. However, this should help him overtake O'Rourke.

Finally, Klobuchar and Buttigieg stood out, and it shows: Klobuchar won 5% of favorability, while Buttigieg won almost 4%. Those two were the winning duo of the evening, trio if we add Warren, who showed she doesn't falter under a slew of attacks (imperative if going against Trump), which is probably why she rose as well as she did.



Jaicee said:

-snip-

(Seriously, do you really think Donald Trump won rural America so big in 2016 because of fucking IMMIGRATION? Really? Only rich people care about immigration! People here would LOVE to have more people move in, if only so maybe we'd have a tax base to fund public services with again! No, he did better than Republicans usually do in rural America because he made a frequent habit of visiting smaller communities and talking about doing something, however contrived, about the flow of drugs, not just pledging to throw some money at the crisis from major metropolitan parts of New York and California like Hillary Clinton. I mean resources directed toward rehabilitation certainly help and everything, but what people REALLY want are the root causes of this problem addressed. And they don't connect to expressions like "We're going to put a lot of coal miners out of work." Trump hasn't delivered much in regards to the drug problem, which is probably part of why his level of support among low-income white Americans has fallen off since election day. There is an opening there. The Democrats would do well to take advantage of that opening. Sorry for the sermon.)

Regime change war.

Plenty of poor people do care about immigration,too. The reason for this is mostly that they are jobless or not earning enough to sustain themselves and then somebody comes along and saying that immigrants took the job that person ought to have. Rural regions tend to have much less immigrants and thus are more susceptible for this kind of scaremongering, even though with some logic thinking it would be clear that this can't be true (how could immigrants stole their jobs if there are none around?).

This is why in Europe, poor people were by far the most adamant against the immigration waves from Syria and northern Africa and along farmers the main source of voters for the populist and eurosceptic parties, especially the Front National (now Rassemblement National) in France, the AFD in Germany, UKIP and Brexit party in the UK, Lega and Five Star Movement in Italy... (The list goes on and on)

I do agree about all the rest, including the part that you cut, but saying that only rich people care about immigration is just not true.