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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - The switch is Generation Three : Pocketconsole

Mnementh said:
Conina said:

Civilization VI, Civilization Revolution 1 + 2, X-COM: Enemy Within, Rome: Total War, Tropico, Baldur's Gate 1 + 2, Icewind Dale, Planescape: Torment, Knights of the Old Republic, Jade Empire, Final Fantasy XV Pocket Edition, Titan Quest, Bastion, Fortnite, GTA III, GTA Vice City, GTA San Andreas, GTA Liberty City Stories, Max Payne, Rayman Jungle/Fiesta Run, Oddmar, Life is Strange, Life is Strange: Before the Storm, The Room series, République, Ace Attorney 1 - 6 (best versions of these games), Ace Attorney Investigations, Professor Layton 1 HD, Layton's Mystery Journey, Ghost Trick HD, Hitman GO, Lara Croft GO, Deus Ex GO, Gorogoa, Oxenfree, Framed 1 + 2, Monument Valley 1 + 2, over 50 Telltale Games episodes, hundreds of good Point'n'Click adventures...

Most of these games without micotransactions, well suited for touchscreen input and profiting from the big (compared to Switch) and highres display.

So fine, now we have a basis. Quite some of these games are on the Switch too, ...

... but most of them aren't (yet).

no Civilization Revolution 1 + 2 (but with Civ 6... who cares), no X-COM, no Rome: Total War, no Tropico, no Baldur's Gate 1 + 2, no Icewind Dale, no Planescape: Torment, no Knights of the Old Republic, no Jade Empire, no GTA games at all (I still hope for a GTA collection on Switch), no Max Payne, no Rayman Jungle/Fiesta Run (but Rayman Legends!), no Oddmar, Life is Strange games (would be a good fit), only The Room 1 (where are the other 3 games?), no République, no Ace Attorney or Layton games (seriously Capcom + Level-5...why?), no Ghost Trick,  no Hitman/Lara Croft/Deus Ex GO, no Monument Valley 1 + 2, only Batman + MineCraft Story Mode, only a fraction of good Point'n'Click adventures...



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Conina said:
Mnementh said:

So fine, now we have a basis. Quite some of these games are on the Switch too, and while you make screen comparisons, the Switch always has a bigger and better screen available.

The Switch always has a bigger screen available? My Switch doesn't, it ONLY has a bigger screen available at home and in a hotel room on vacation (hotel TVs tend to be pretty shitty, even in five-star-hotels). Every other time it has to depend on its 6.2''-display with 1280x720 resolution and 60 Hertz.

My iPad Pro on the other hand has a 222% larger screen area for input and output, which is very convenient for most games:

 

The Switch always has a better screen available? Even at home on an expensive TV, I really doubt that. The Switch can't benefit from the higher resolution of 4K-TVs, so it is stuck with a 1920x1080 resolution, the iPad Pro models have resolutions from 2048x1536 to 2732x2048 and sweet native 120Hz displays.

For the image quality:

 

 

 

You completely miss my point, which is: inhowfar create the specs a better experience.

And do your comparison pics have JPEG-compression for the Switch-pictures? Because, look at the Hammer Head logo, it is quite round, no loss through resolution, but around the borders are typical artifacts for lower quality jpegs. So it seems the loss of quality is because of the compression of the screenshot, not because of resolution. Let's tests it. I took the original resolution ipad screenshot, resaved it as a lower quality JPG and zoomed in. It looks like this:

Comparison pics should be uncompressed screenshots, not something taken from the internet and blame the loss of quality on the hardware, if it didn't happen in reality. Something to remember: JPEG artifacts are typically good visible near edges of areas of different colors/brightness. The edge itself might be relatively sharp, but around it you see 'dirty patches' of chaotic pixels.

Here is by the way a screenshot from the Switch version of FFXV Pocket, which apparently isn't compressed to death. You can zoom in and look how the artifacts present in the above images are missing there.

Conina said:
Mnementh said:

So fine, now we have a basis. Quite some of these games are on the Switch too, ...

... but most of them aren't (yet).

no Civilization Revolution 1 + 2 (but with Civ 6... who cares), no X-COM, no Rome: Total War, no Tropico, no Baldur's Gate 1 + 2, no Icewind Dale, no Planescape: Torment, no Knights of the Old Republic, no Jade Empire, no GTA games at all (I still hope for a GTA collection on Switch), no Max Payne, no Rayman Jungle/Fiesta Run (but Rayman Legends!), no Oddmar, Life is Strange games (would be a good fit), only The Room 1 (where are the other 3 games?), no République, no Ace Attorney or Layton games (seriously Capcom + Level-5...why?), no Ghost Trick,  no Hitman/Lara Croft/Deus Ex GO, no Monument Valley 1 + 2, only Batman + MineCraft Story Mode, only a fraction of good Point'n'Click adventures...

And? Most of Switch games aren't on iPad either. This point really holds no strength. So no Breath of the Wild, Octopath Traveler, Dragon Quest Builders, Xenoblade Chronicles and more on ipad. The better specs really don't help here.

Don't misunderstand me, I don't want to reduce the importance the iPad or other mobile devices as game devices. But their advantage is not possible better specs in comparison to the Switch. Because these specs always have to materialize in games before it has any advantage to the players. The advantage are possibilities of usage beyond pure gaming.



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [peak year], [1], [2], [3], [4]

Mnementh said:

You completely miss my point, which is: inhowfar create the specs a better experience.

You didn't only have one point, you made several points. And I answered the most faulty ones.

Mnementh said:

And do your comparison pics have JPEG-compression for the Switch-pictures? Because, look at the Hammer Head logo, it is quite round, no loss through resolution, but around the borders are typical artifacts for lower quality jpegs. So it seems the loss of quality is because of the compression of the screenshot, not because of resolution. Let's tests it. I took the original resolution ipad screenshot, resaved it as a lower quality JPG and zoomed in. It looks like this:

Comparison pics should be uncompressed screenshots, not something taken from the internet and blame the loss of quality on the hardware, if it didn't happen in reality. Something to remember: JPEG artifacts are typically good visible near edges of areas of different colors/brightness. The edge itself might be relatively sharp, but around it you see 'dirty patches' of chaotic pixels.

The pictures weren't taken from the internet, they were taken with the Switches own screenshot function (both in docked and undocked mode). So don't blame the loss of quality on the internet but on Nintendo's stupid decision not to allow uncompressed PNG-files instead of heavily compressed JPEG-files via the options menu:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/189706-nintendo-switch/75217027

Nintendo ain't in the JPEG-boat alone, I also hated it on the Vita when taking screenshots.

But even ignoring the JPG-artifacts you have to be blind to not see the other differences (less jaggies, more details) due to the much higher resolution... unless you don't WANT to see the differences.

Mnementh said:

Comparison pics should be uncompressed screenshots, not something taken from the internet and blame the loss of quality on the hardware, if it didn't happen in reality. Something to remember: JPEG artifacts are typically good visible near edges of areas of different colors/brightness. The edge itself might be relatively sharp, but around it you see 'dirty patches' of chaotic pixels.

Here is by the way a screenshot from the Switch version of FFXV Pocket, which apparently isn't compressed to death. You can zoom in and look how the artifacts present in the above images are missing there.

You realize that your screenshot is also a JPEG (and probably taken from the internet), not an uncompressed screenshot?

But as requested I zoomed in:

 

Mnementh said:
Conina said:

... but most of them aren't (yet).

no Civilization Revolution 1 + 2 (but with Civ 6... who cares), no X-COM, no Rome: Total War, no Tropico, no Baldur's Gate 1 + 2, no Icewind Dale, no Planescape: Torment, no Knights of the Old Republic, no Jade Empire, no GTA games at all (I still hope for a GTA collection on Switch), no Max Payne, no Rayman Jungle/Fiesta Run (but Rayman Legends!), no Oddmar, Life is Strange games (would be a good fit), only The Room 1 (where are the other 3 games?), no République, no Ace Attorney or Layton games (seriously Capcom + Level-5...why?), no Ghost Trick,  no Hitman/Lara Croft/Deus Ex GO, no Monument Valley 1 + 2, only Batman + MineCraft Story Mode, only a fraction of good Point'n'Click adventures...

And? Most of Switch games aren't on iPad either. This point really holds no strength.

Of course the Switch has many games that aren't on iOS or Android, nobody questioned that.

You asked  "which games does it offer? Play Hearthstone with less power drain on the hardware?" and I answered with a lot of better iOS games than Hearthstone without Free2Play mechanics.

Last edited by Conina - on 20 January 2019

Conina said:
Mnementh said:

You completely miss my point, which is: inhowfar create the specs a better experience.

You didn't only have one point, you made several points. And I answered the most faulty ones.

OK, I see I communicated my point badly. My point was always, that the pure specs are unimportant, for the gamer it is important what influence does this have on games. This was badly said in my comment about Hearthstone: that the versions of Hearthstone (or other games) really do not profit from the better specs, because the game stays the same. Maybe you have less drain on the battery, as the hardware isn't in much demand.

Conina said:
Mnementh said:

And do your comparison pics have JPEG-compression for the Switch-pictures? Because, look at the Hammer Head logo, it is quite round, no loss through resolution, but around the borders are typical artifacts for lower quality jpegs. So it seems the loss of quality is because of the compression of the screenshot, not because of resolution. Let's tests it. I took the original resolution ipad screenshot, resaved it as a lower quality JPG and zoomed in. It looks like this:

Comparison pics should be uncompressed screenshots, not something taken from the internet and blame the loss of quality on the hardware, if it didn't happen in reality. Something to remember: JPEG artifacts are typically good visible near edges of areas of different colors/brightness. The edge itself might be relatively sharp, but around it you see 'dirty patches' of chaotic pixels.

The pictures weren't taken from the internet, they were taken with the Switches own screenshot function (both in docked and undocked mode). So don't blame the loss of quality on the internet but on Nintendo's stupid decision not to allow uncompressed PNG-files instead of heavily compressed JPEG-files via the options menu:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/189706-nintendo-switch/75217027

Nintendo ain't in the JPEG-boat alone, I also hated it on the Vita when taking screenshots.

But even ignoring the JPG-artifacts you have to be blind to not see the other differences (less jaggies, more details) due to the much higher resolution... unless you don't WANT to see the differences.

Sure, so the Nintendo screenshot function is bad. Still the pictures strongly disrepresenting the graphics quality on Switch so your comparison was flawed. I am aware, that I took the image myself from the internet (as I don't have FF XV pocket and no equipment to take screencaps from HDMI-signals) and that it is still a JPEG, but as you should've noticed it missed the compression artifacts, it was already in much higher quality.

In the end I don't want to say that there aren't minor differences between the iOS version of FFXV Pocket and the Switch-version, all I am saying is you images were grossly disrepresenting the differences.

Conina said:
Mnementh said:

And? Most of Switch games aren't on iPad either. This point really holds no strength.

Of course the Switch has many games that aren't on iOS or Android, nobody questioned that.

You asked  "which games does it offer? Play Hearthstone with less power drain on the hardware?" and I answered with a lot of better iOS games than Hearthstone without Free2Play mechanics.

What? You say I moved goalposts? I never argued your list of games, I picked the ones that were on Switch too and pointed out there are not much differences. Then you suddenly moved the goalposts and talked about games that aren't on Switch. On this goalpost-moved point I answered by pointing out this works the other way around as well.



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [peak year], [1], [2], [3], [4]

Dulfite said:
super_etecoon said:
My Switch does not fit in my pocket. I carry it around in a carrying case. It is a portable console. It is a hybrid. I even listed that as one of the options in the thread I made a while back. I'll go with hybrid...but not with this "pocketconsole" term you're trying to coin. Maybe when Nintendo releases a Switch mini...but even then it would belong to the hybrid family.

I can fit the switch in my pockets and often do.

Front pocket? Back pocket? Cargo pants?  I mean seriously, what's your secret?  And do you feel the Switch is safe when doing so, especially with the joysticks sticking out?



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super_etecoon said:
Dulfite said:

I can fit the switch in my pockets and often do.

Front pocket? Back pocket? Cargo pants?  I mean seriously, what's your secret?  And do you feel the Switch is safe when doing so, especially with the joysticks sticking out?

The inside pockets of all my coats and jackets are big enough for the Switch. So except of the summer time it's no problem at all.



super_etecoon said:
Dulfite said:

I can fit the switch in my pockets and often do.

Front pocket? Back pocket? Cargo pants?  I mean seriously, what's your secret?  And do you feel the Switch is safe when doing so, especially with the joysticks sticking out?

Front pocket on most of my pants, haven't tried any others, and I don't do cargo pants. However no, I do not feel it is safe, but I have done it many times nonetheless lol.



zorg1000 said:
Pyro as Bill said:

What's the difference between a 'portable home console' and a 'handheld'?

If I had a 'portable home console' and 'mixed' it with a handheld, how would it be any different to a portable home console?

I have no clue what you're asking

People think Switch is something new.

Terms like 'hybrid' are thrown around.

Truth is, Switch is a 'hybrid' of a puppy and a dog.

A portable console is just a portable console, it's not some new hybrid-beast.

Nintendo has had the golden goose all along but ignored it due to ''profits''. Profits that quickly evaporated when they screw up.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!