By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Nintendo - Capcom: "MHW can't be done on Switch." But might make a Switch specific MH game. (Rumor)

spemanig said:
I mean that's just ridiculous. The idea that anything like MHW can't exist on Switch when BotW does is just silly. The idea that games like Wolfenstein II and Doom could be graphically downgraded to be playable on the Switch but MHW is this impossible task is silly. Dragon's Dogma ran on a 360. Claims like this are just so absurd and phony to me.

I'm being genuine when I ask this: just what exactly is MHW doing computationally that couldn't be done on the Switch or even a 360 with fewer polygons, less detailed textures, and maybe less complex particle effects? Are there physics or ai demands going on here that I'm just not seeing that are integral to the gameplay and simultaneously impossible on weaker hardware? Like literally, what are they even talking about?

When they say it "can't be done" they don't mean "it's impossible". Anything can be ported to pretty much anything with enough time and effort. Sure it might look nothing like the original. play nothing like the original, and render at 5 pfs, but technically, anything can be ported.  What Capcom means is it's not worth the time and effort to port the game to the Switch. They might think the downgrades they'd have to make in order to get it to run at a "playable level" are unacceptable.It's not just as simple as simplifying models, animations rigging, shrinking textures, and simplifying/removing the effects. You might also need to make cuts to AI, physics, number of enemies, and other things that fundamentally changes how the game works.

I'm not sure why they think it's not worth their time and effort to port that. You'd have to do a technical analysis of the game, its engine, how either would act on a switch and compile a general list of the modifications/simplifications that would have to be made, the time and money that would need to be invested, and what the end result would likely look like before they would have made such an assessment. For example, it would do Capcom no good to release a game that looks and plays completely differntly on the Switch just to have that port out there. It would be torn to pieces for being such a lesser port. If their analysis determined that was the kind of game they would expect form a port, "can't be done" would be a fair way to describe your refusal to do so.



Around the Network
John2290 said:
Nautilus said:

The problem I have with this reasoning is that they probably could have ported MHW to the Switch if they really wanted.Yes yes, Im not a developer and yes, Im not that tech savvy, but Wolfenstein II just came out for the Switch, and it looks excellent for a machine that is underpowered.I mean, it looks almost as good as the other versions, even with its obvious shortcommings.

So while MHW is a different kind of game(more open design vs linear design) they really could have made an effort and do a great port that, while not running or looking as good as the other versions, would be more than playable.And it would run even better if the next game is made with the Switch in mind, in addition to the other versions.

I just think that, barring the engine being horribly uncompatible with the NVidia architecture, Switch is powerful enough for all this talk about "The Switch would hold back the game" to be a moot point.Barring games like Red Dead 2 which push graphics and everything to the absolute maximum, I dont think that argument has a place here at all.But hey, thats just my opinion.

Refer to my reply to Aurzen above, I forgot to multi tag you.

Yeah. It may be possible but it could affect the game at its core and hold back a sequel from improving on it..  which is probably already in development with specs agreed upon. Just be thankful switch is getting a new series. 

Aldo, do you think Horizon zero dawn could work pn a ps3 or BpTW on a wii? With graphics downgrade only... of course not. It's impossible.

But the point is, the Switch isnt nearly as weak as the Wii when compared to the other consoles(PS3 and X360).Its simply an unfair comparison.And with thrid parties proving time and time again, Switch can hold its weight around.Much like RE 7(stupid decision of making it a cloud version for the Switch), its more a matter of willingness than specs in my view)

Be thankful that MH is even comming.... lol Im not begging here.Im just saying that Capcom shouldnt be making stupid decisions.



My (locked) thread about how difficulty should be a decision for the developers, not the gamers.

https://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=241866&page=1

That's preposterous. The Switch can certainly run anything. Anything!



John2290 said:
Nautilus said:

But the point is, the Switch isnt nearly as weak as the Wii when compared to the other consoles(PS3 and X360).Its simply an unfair comparison.And with thrid parties proving time and time again, Switch can hold its weight around.Much like RE 7(stupid decision of making it a cloud version for the Switch), its more a matter of willingness than specs in my view)

Be thankful that MH is even comming.... lol Im not begging here.Im just saying that Capcom shouldnt be making stupid decisions.

I'm playing this right now,4 hours in and as its already having frame issues on ps4 with mobs of enemies and there is so much going on on and off screen, especially in co-op the switch downgrade would have to be more than graphics. Unless peolple want a gamr that is half the game MHW is, runs like shit and lacks co-op why eould capcom but themselves in that position of getting backlash from switch owners. Also,I made that comparison as a metaphor,the difference isn't that but it's big for a game that is already struggling with its systems on beefier tech,bad optimization or actually computationally power damnding it ends up in the same place, switch owners would end up playing am incomplete experience that would have to limit itself in the systems the series inteoduced like the open world and dynamic monsters and enviroments and there is no chance in hell co-op would be a thing on switch in portable mode. 

You call it a stupid decision but in reality its a wise decision to uphold the quality and praise of there now most lucrative franchise. That and switch gamers aren't entitled to ports as PS4 and Xbox owners aren't entitled to every PC genre game that is K&M optimized. 

Well maybe, but if I have to apologize because I lost faith in Capcom when Switch is corncerned, I wont.Many developers have made the impossible and ported their games to the Switch.Im not saying that every game can be ported, but Im personally not seeing anything that would be too demanding for the system that some hard work wouldnt fix(downgrading stuff).

Maybe its silly of me, but until someone else that I trust says its impossible, I will not believe Capcom on this one.



My (locked) thread about how difficulty should be a decision for the developers, not the gamers.

https://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=241866&page=1

spemanig said:
I mean that's just ridiculous. The idea that anything like MHW can't exist on Switch when BotW does is just silly. The idea that games like Wolfenstein II and Doom could be graphically downgraded to be playable on the Switch but MHW is this impossible task is silly. Dragon's Dogma ran on a 360. Claims like this are just so absurd and phony to me.

I'm being genuine when I ask this: just what exactly is MHW doing computationally that couldn't be done on the Switch or even a 360 with fewer polygons, less detailed textures, and maybe less complex particle effects? Are there physics or ai demands going on here that I'm just not seeing that are integral to the gameplay and simultaneously impossible on weaker hardware? Like literally, what are they even talking about?

That's not an argument. Literally every game in existence can run on the Switch if the necessary adjustments are taken. It's not a technological issue.Some games are made in a way that their systems are built from the ground up with higher power in mind and adjusting them takes a considerable amount of effort and time to completely rewrite it. When a company says that a game cannot be ported to Switch it means that it cannot be done using a justifiable amount of resources. Games like Doom have been specifically made very flexible and programmed extremely scalable so that porting them wasn't really an effort. Doom in particular runs very well on weaker systems.

Of course you could argue why not all programmers or projects are made that well and scalable. That's up to the individual teams I guess. Of course it would be nice but it's just not the reality. And even though it sucks for Nintendo fans and can't help but chuckle a bit that the most ardent defenders of game exclusivity are now the "port beggars" themselves, calling Capcom liars and arguing for easy portability.

We shouldn't forget that it was Nintendo's choice to design the Switch how they did, so putting all of the blame on developers seems a bit unfair when they are not the ones straying from the norm on purpose and making it deliberately harder for AAA studios to port their games. In the end it's a decision of money and given the big success of the game it might not've been the worst decision to skip a Switch version.



If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

Around the Network
Hynad said:
That's preposterous. The Switch can certainly run anything. Anything!

It still doesn't have a web browser and Youtube...... 



Pocky Lover Boy! 

vivster said:
spemanig said:
I mean that's just ridiculous. The idea that anything like MHW can't exist on Switch when BotW does is just silly. The idea that games like Wolfenstein II and Doom could be graphically downgraded to be playable on the Switch but MHW is this impossible task is silly. Dragon's Dogma ran on a 360. Claims like this are just so absurd and phony to me.

I'm being genuine when I ask this: just what exactly is MHW doing computationally that couldn't be done on the Switch or even a 360 with fewer polygons, less detailed textures, and maybe less complex particle effects? Are there physics or ai demands going on here that I'm just not seeing that are integral to the gameplay and simultaneously impossible on weaker hardware? Like literally, what are they even talking about?

That's not an argument. Literally every game in existence can run on the Switch if the necessary adjustments are taken. It's not a technological issue.Some games are made in a way that their systems are built from the ground up with higher power in mind and adjusting them takes a considerable amount of effort and time to completely rewrite it. When a company says that a game cannot be ported to Switch it means that it cannot be done using a justifiable amount of resources. Games like Doom have been specifically made very flexible and programmed extremely scalable so that porting them wasn't really an effort. Doom in particular runs very well on weaker systems.

Precicely. Thus, it becomes objective. Capcom deems it unworthy of allocating resources to downscale the game to the Switch. That I can accept. "Cannot be done" is another issue though...

[... some other stupid stuff xD ...]

We shouldn't forget that it was Nintendo's choice to design the Switch how they did, so putting all of the blame on developers seems a bit unfair when they are not the ones straying from the norm on purpose and making it deliberately harder for AAA studios to port their games. In the end it's a decision of money and given the big success of the game it might not've been the worst decision to skip a Switch version.

Of course it was the best decision (as a matter of fact the only good recent decision by Capcom), even if most people (me included) thought this would no do that great. A new game with the Switch in mind is obviously the best option, yet I have no faith in Capcom in anything Switch related.

Finally, everyone blames Nintendo for pigeonholing  themselves in the corner and moving out of the arms race, when in fact, they simply cannot compete there anymore. You cannot expect a company like Nintendo to face money spitting giants like Sony or Microsoft. They have to differentiate, or go the third party route. And I think we can all agree that that would be the worst scenario for everyone.

And I cannot justify Capcom supporting the PSVR more than the Switch under no circumstance, sorry. Weak hardware does not justify the pitiful output they've given the system.



I think this will work out for the best. Panic Button could easily port MHW to Switch but Capcom would muck it up badly. They're so awful at optimization.



Retro Tech Select - My Youtube channel. Covers throwback consumer electronics with a focus on "vid'ya games."

Latest Video: Top 12: Best Games on the N64 - Special Features, Episode 7

routsounmanman said:
Azuren said:

1) Congratulations, that's called moving the goalposts. I'm talking about the changes to the game that make it not just MH HD, and instead of admitting you hadn't noticed that, you try and flip it into an argument as to why it couldn't be done on PS3 (and by extension, Switch).

2) And back to your clearly desired subject of why the Switch can't run World: there's too much going on at once with too much on screen. While I'm certain you could dial that back enough to run on the Switch, Capcom has clearly decided that the amount they would have to scale it back to would compromise too much of the gameplay experience.

3) Perhaps instead of complaining, Nintendo Hunters should be grateful the Switch is even getting the promise for its own series. It's more than PlayStation Hunters got when Capcom abandoned them.

1) I'm moving goalposts? Why? And when? From the start, all I'm saying is that MHW is, although a great game, and a surprise, just a MH reskin in HD, with some quality of life improvements, a la Pokemon X and Y to previous generations, NOT the second revelation that you guys make it out to be. I was just playing the game, and I saw the same Rathian stiff 4 angle movement, upwards spin, etc. And it stupidly went up and down, flying, then got tired, got to eat, got really hurt and went to sleep, and I killed it.

Are we really making such a big fuss over the map not being split via loading areas? Or being able to pick up items on the fly? Nice additions, sure, but the same could be done on the Switch, hell even the WiiU, Zelda is a testament to that. Have you seen footage of the new Wolfenstein on Switch? It's an amazing achievement for a tablet, for mobile tech.

2) Now who's moving goalposts? Now all of a sudden the Switch COULD run the game, but compromised? How exactly do you know that? Seriously, just by dialling down the resolution to 720p, lowering textures, shadows and grass, the game could run almost unhampered. 

3) I never said anything contrary about your last point. I was astonished to see Capcom ditch the PSP in favour of  the Wii / 3DS / Nintendo in general. And it was a stab in Sony's back, just as it is now on Nintendo's. That's why I call Capcom stupid. They're all over the place with their decisions, alienating and infuriating their fans back and forth. And it's not about Capcom doing any favours to the Switch, they simply are aware than an exclusive MH for the Switch, even if it only sells in Japan, is a 3m locked. At bare minimum.

1. And I addressed your accusation that World is just MH HD- which it isn't. And your response was to decide that I was saying the differences between old MH and World were the reason why it couldn't be done on Switch, when I made zero claims of that.

 

And you continue to argue in the face of those differences, like changing core aspects of gameplay doesn't mean anything. And you keep drawing back to BotW, seemingly ignorant of what draw distance is. Keep making a fool of yourself, though. Every time you say something, it furthers the thought that you're not a developer (or at least not a competent one), and that you haven't played World with any level of analysis in mind. The level of graphics and activity on a map of that size is clearly too much for Switch to handle when base PS4 struggles. There would likely need to be a massive drop in graphical quality, the pull back on draw distance, and likely drop the number of active monsters on the map. All of those compromises would likely barely hit 720p@30fps while docked, and embarrassing while undocked.

 

2. Can it run World without major compromises that would alter the game heavily? No. Moving goalposts? Please- I'm only being realistic in my responses. Anything can be ported to anything if you're willing to sacrifice enough of the game's identity.

 

3. And there we go- no, it isn't a stab in Nintendo's back, because Nintendo is still getting Monster Hunter. It's own special series, in fact. You know what PlayStation fans got? Portable 3rd was never localized, and PlayStation was occasionally treated in eastern countries to ports. Switch is getting a full western release, and you're in here whining about Capcom deciding that World isn't possible on Switch. Count your blessings and be thankful that Capcom is in a much better place here than it was for PlayStation fans. The only fans they're alienating are the ungrateful ones who would prefer to look a gift horse in the mouth and complain.



Watch me stream games and hunt trophies on my Twitch channel!

Check out my Twitch Channel!:

www.twitch.tv/AzurenGames

John2290 said:
Azuren said:

The biggest thing I can think of that might play a role is the amount of things happening off screen. Up to three large monsters can roam the map, interacting with smaller monsters, the environment, and each other independently of the players' intervention. Combine that with its level of graphics (not amazing, but clearly beyond what the Switch can handle) and you've got a game that is currently far from being able to run on Switch. There would likely need to be a significant amount of pop-in needed to make it work, and it might even have to lower the number of roaming monster on the map down to two to run on Switch.

This indeed and specifically the environment and co-op. They might be able to fix these things and downgrade them in a way that wouldn't impact the experience tooo much and you'd still get a the general gameplay but why would they bother at the expenaive of giving someone a lesser exlerience. Plus we don't know how there optimization went. Perhaps they were struggling enough as is with the X1 and ps4. 

Biggest thing though is portable mode on the switch. They probably would be able to get it to work in docked mode exclusively but definitely not in portable mode. Add in Nintendos online and we don't know how much 4 player co-op adds stress to the system or how that works on the hardware and problems continue to pile on, I just started playing this yesterday and after 2 hours I can see just from the surface why this wouldn't be possible on switch woth a mear graphical downgrade just like Horizon zero dawn wouldn't be possible on ps3 with a graphical downgrade alone.

Thing I don't understand is why people are so mad about this when they know for a fact they wouldn't be getting the full gameplay experience and consessions would have to be made to core gameplay aspects which would probably lead to some frustrating hunts and end up and 360 with FPS dips at the lowest. Even if you're a switch only gamer that makes no sense over getting a fresh switch exclusive optimized for the hardware .

Just be thankful there are two series coming out of this downer and don't bite the hand that feeds. 

They were indeed struggling with base PS4 and XB1. Framerates can dip quite frequently on those platforms.

 

And no, a graphical drop wouldn't be enough to even get it on Docked mode properly (and by that, I mean at least 720p@30fps). They would likely need to eliminate a roaming large monsters from the maybe, maybe even two (and would likely have to remove small monsters for missions that explicitly involve more than one large monster, much in the same way that the game removes small monsters during an Elder encounter). I don't know that multiplayer would stress it too much, though, since every player has their own console to handle his/her own movement and interaction.

 

And I imagine the negative reactions stem from a combination of what looked like abandonment of Nintendo at first and the crow handheld fans had to eat when World destroyed every Capcom precedent.

 

And Switch fans should most definitely be happy they're getting their own title. I remember when Capcom jumped ship from PlayStation, I was left with nothing but PlayAsia for some of the unlocalized ports PS3 got and the fan translation of Portable 3rd on PSP. No official support. I don't think the Nintendo fans realize that they're lucky to even have this bone thrown to them instead of Capcom doubling down on World.



Watch me stream games and hunt trophies on my Twitch channel!

Check out my Twitch Channel!:

www.twitch.tv/AzurenGames