Forums - Politics Discussion - Half the Venezuelan economy has disappeared

Socialism is no bueno.



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Let's clarify a couple things;

The control of the economy by the Venezuelan government was both excessive, and most of all, extremely poorly implemented, by people who clearly knew (or cared) very little about running a country. This is not helped by highly frequent corruption.

In essence, the whole thing should have collapsed long ago. However, they struck oil. For some time, thanks to the OPEC cartel, this served as a source of income sufficiently large and easy to obtain that even with all the leaks in the system, the government managed to keep the country afloat.

This source of easy revenue evaporated, so the Venezuelan industrial output returns to its natural value - fuck all. 

 

This was fairly predictable, as a whole. 



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Gamer147 said:
Socialism is no bueno.

Now this is a tricky comment. One, Venezuella is not a prime example of working socialism, that would be a country like Norway. Second, there were plenty of destabilizing factors directed by certain... ahem... political entities, against that country. The fact that the US wants to create yet another South Maerican puppet state is not a secret.



JRPGfan said:
RolStoppable said:
I suppose this is the consequence of socialism.

or its just its a a dictator that took power, and doesnt know how to run a country?

Its kind of both really.The guy is an idiot, but it also serves to point out that the idealistic notion of socialism, which is what he is trying to do, simply dosent work.

No country that tried to do a socialist regime ever worked, or at the very least isnt socialist anymore.China is an example of that.



My (locked) thread about how difficulty should be a decision for the developers, not the gamers.

https://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=241866&page=1

hunter_alien said:
Gamer147 said:
Socialism is no bueno.

Now this is a tricky comment. One, Venezuella is not a prime example of working socialism, that would be a country like Norway. Second, there were plenty of destabilizing factors directed by certain... ahem... political entities, against that country. The fact that the US wants to create yet another South Maerican puppet state is not a secret.

So the means of production are all state owned in Norway now? It is more accurate to say Norway is capitalist in economic terms, but they also heavily tax and provide a large welfare state ... not exactly pure socialism if you ask me; more a mixed social democracy concoction. 

Destabilizing factors ruined Venezuela? I know US relations with them have been crap for a long time but that is one hell of a reach to pin the blame on the US while ignoring the dictator and the whole state run economy society-destroying socialism they embraced. 



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Whoosh, and it's gone.



hunter_alien said:
Gamer147 said:
Socialism is no bueno.

Now this is a tricky comment. One, Venezuella is not a prime example of working socialism, that would be a country like Norway. Second, there were plenty of destabilizing factors directed by certain... ahem... political entities, against that country. The fact that the US wants to create yet another South Maerican puppet state is not a secret.

It's an unsustainable system though. Those who pursue wealth will flee the country, leaving the unproductive behind. Then they too will be dependent on oil exports, leaving Norway vulnerable to the same issues Venezuela is facing. Norwegians have a much higher average IQ than those in Venezuela though, so the brain drain will take a lot longer to eventuate.

Of course Norway may reject massive wealth redistribution and save themselves, but it's never happened before. The closest thing I've seen is the election of Trump, but America was never that far gone.



DarthVolod said:
hunter_alien said:

Now this is a tricky comment. One, Venezuella is not a prime example of working socialism, that would be a country like Norway. Second, there were plenty of destabilizing factors directed by certain... ahem... political entities, against that country. The fact that the US wants to create yet another South Maerican puppet state is not a secret.

So the means of production are all state owned in Norway now? It is more accurate to say Norway is capitalist in economic terms, but they also heavily tax and provide a large welfare state ... not exactly pure socialism if you ask me; more a mixed social democracy concoction. 

Destabilizing factors ruined Venezuela? I know US relations with them have been crap for a long time but that is one hell of a reach to pin the blame on the US while ignoring the dictator and the whole state run economy society-destroying socialism they embraced. 

How can Venezuela be socialist if it has a private sector? Where do you draw the line between Norway and Venezuela.



Locknuts said:
hunter_alien said:

Now this is a tricky comment. One, Venezuella is not a prime example of working socialism, that would be a country like Norway. Second, there were plenty of destabilizing factors directed by certain... ahem... political entities, against that country. The fact that the US wants to create yet another South Maerican puppet state is not a secret.

It's an unsustainable system though. Those who pursue wealth will flee the country, leaving the unproductive behind. Then they too will be dependent on oil exports, leaving Norway vulnerable to the same issues Venezuela is facing. Norwegians have a much higher average IQ than those in Venezuela though, so the brain drain will take a lot longer to eventuate.

Of course Norway may reject massive wealth redistribution and save themselves, but it's never happened before. The closest thing I've seen is the election of Trump, but America was never that far gone.

Which would beg the question of the effects of high wealth distribution, if handled uniformly on a global scale...

 

For a modern context, Sweden would probably be a better example of functional social capitalism. Or Germany/Japan, for something intermediate.

Last edited by palou - on 25 January 2018

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That's quite a legacy Chavez has left his people!

I suspect their voters are experiencing some voter's remorse... Hopefully they're able to overthrow that asshat Maduro, but the damage will take ages to undo even in good circumstances.