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Forums - Sales Discussion - PS4 VS Switch lifetime sales, which console will sell the most?

 

What do you expect?

NSW will win by a huge margin 53 16.06%
 
NSW will win by a small margin 75 22.73%
 
PS4 will win by a small margin 75 22.73%
 
PS4 will win by a huge margin 117 35.45%
 
Sorry, no troll XB1 option. :P Oh wait... 10 3.03%
 
Total:330
thismeintiel said:
zorg1000 said:

Fair enough on price but your 57.1m figure is shipments and PS4 was very overshipped at the end of 2016, they had 3.7 million on shelves/in transit which is much higher than normal so it's not really the most accurate comparison.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/olliebarder/2017/01/05/the-ps4-has-now-sold-53-4-million-units-worldwide-with-6-2-million-sales-over-the-2016-holidays/#4c22aa6c7b41

NSW shipments should be 54-55 million at the end of March with sell through over 52 million so about a ~1 million difference.

Ah, the old overshipped argument.  The problem with that is if that is the case, then the following slower quarter/s retailers will lower shipments to get rid of the extra stock.  Care to explain to me when that occurred, because:

Q1 2016: 2.3M vs Q1 2017: 2.9M - 600K in 2017's favor, total
Q2 2016: 3.5M vs Q2 2017: 3.3M - 400K in 2017's favor, total
Q3 2016: 3.9M vs Q3 2017: 4.2M - 700K in 2017's favor, total

I guess they just love having mountains of unsold PS4's lying around at all times.  So, yea, like I said, it will be 3M-4M ahead.  And shipment data is the only concrete data we have.  There are no estimates involved.

Interesting how you exclude the holiday quarters.

Q4 2016: 9.7M vs Q4 2017: 9.0M

Both years had total shipments of 19.4M. And contrary to what you say, shipment data isn't the only concrete data we have, because Sony has announced PS4 sell-through at the ends of every calendar year to date.

End of 2015: 35.9M
End of 2016: 53.4M (+17.5M)
End of 2017: 73.6M (+20.2M)

PS4 shipped 1.9M more than it sold during 2016, and it shipped 0.8M fewer than it sold during 2017. Your data reflects the fact that PS4 had faster sell-through in 2017 than it had in 2016. It doesn't rule out over-shipping during 2016.

Last edited by StarDoor - on 15 December 2019

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Using VGC sell-through numbers.

1 YEAR
Wii - 15,192,774
NSW - 15,099,220
3DS - 14,361,871
PS4 - 14,238,195

2 YEARS
Wii - 36,568,200
NSW - 32,064,084
PS4 - 29,821,874
3DS - 27,693,898

3 YEARS
Wii - 56,161,505
NSW - 52.5 million~ (projected)
PS4 - 46,748,703
3DS - 41,339,315

The gap between PS4/Switch is growing.



thismeintiel said:
zorg1000 said:

Fair enough on price but your 57.1m figure is shipments and PS4 was very overshipped at the end of 2016, they had 3.7 million on shelves/in transit which is much higher than normal so it's not really the most accurate comparison.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/olliebarder/2017/01/05/the-ps4-has-now-sold-53-4-million-units-worldwide-with-6-2-million-sales-over-the-2016-holidays/#4c22aa6c7b41

NSW shipments should be 54-55 million at the end of March with sell through over 52 million so about a ~1 million difference.

Ah, the old overshipped argument.  The problem with that is if that is the case, then the following slower quarter/s retailers will lower shipments to get rid of the extra stock.  Care to explain to me when that occurred, because:

Q1 2016: 2.3M vs Q1 2017: 2.9M - 600K in 2017's favor, total
Q2 2016: 3.5M vs Q2 2017: 3.3M - 400K in 2017's favor, total
Q3 2016: 3.9M vs Q3 2017: 4.2M - 700K in 2017's favor, total

I guess they just love having mountains of unsold PS4's lying around at all times.  So, yea, like I said, it will be 3M-4M ahead.  And shipment data is the only concrete data we have.  There are no estimates involved.

Like Stardoor already said, the sold more units than they shipped in 2017 according to Sony.

Here are calendar year sales vs shipments

2013-4.2m sold vs 4.5m shipped

2014-14.3m sold vs 15.4m shipped

2015-17.4m sold vs 17.8m shipped

2016-17.5m sold vs 19.4m shipped

2017-20.2m sold vs 19.4m shipped

2018-18.0m sold vs 17.7m shipped

There is no guesswork because Sony has given sell-through data at the end of each year so we know it was overshipped at the end of 2016.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

VideoGameAccountant said:
The_Liquid_Laser said:

We are talking about strategy here.  Strategy is about planning things out in the future.  That is why Iwata had nothing to do with Gamecube's strategy even though he became CEO while Gamecube was on the market.  It was already too late to make an overall strategy at that point.  On the other hand Iwata put a lot of focus and energy into consolidating all of Nintendo's software development onto one system.  The Switch was first and foremost his strategy.

Also, you said in a previous post that Iwata was a bad strategist, because he got his ideas from books.  What kind of weird logic is this?  Reading books on strategy makes one a better strategist, not a worse one.

Lastly, you are starting to turn the argument from strategy to execution.  Perhaps he isn't the best at execution?  But when he comes to gaming strategy he is unparalleled.  The DS, Wii and Switch were all big risks, because they were so different from what came before.  They were successful because the fundamental strategy behind these systems is solid.  And none of these systems would have existed if Iwata wasn't the CEO.

Your point about the Gamecube is not the same as the Switch wasn't out or even close to out when Iwata passed. Again, Iwata passed in July 2015 but the Switch didn't launch until another 21 months. They may have had an overall strategy or idea for the system at that time but a lot can change in roughly 2 years time. What you and others are assuming is that nothing changed from the inception to Iwata's depth and Kimishima did absolutely nothing but follow the plan. The actual launch and the solftware line-up is what you have to give credit to Kimishima for as he was president at the time. But you all don't want to give him that credit because he's not a sacred cow.

When I say he's a bad strategist unless he uses a book, what I mean is Iwata can't run a business unless he's using someone else's gameplan. The minute he goes off script the company goes off a cliff and has some of their worst loses. Iwata had to rely on those books because he had no business sense of his own. The success of the Wii and DS shows that 1)Those business books are good and 2)Nintendo makes good games. However, it doesn't really prove Iwata was skilled at what he did as, again, those were the only successes he had. When you consider that, it's clear that the books carried him, rather than Iwata's keen business sense leading the company to success. 

Iwata was someone who should never have been moved into the position he was in. He was a programmer without parallel and that's where he probably should have been. As a CEO, his results are mixed. I'll end on this. When Nintendo becomes incredibly successful after someone takes Iwata's job, it's hard to say he was a good businessman. 

The reason why we are debating is because you are not using the word strategy correctly.  Strategy is the overall, big picture plan.  The Wii's strategy was "playing together" (Wii = We) which means a focus on local multiplayer.  Wii's strategy was also a "small, cheap console with a simple, intuitive controller".  These describe the overall plan which is why those things are strategy.  On the other hand execution is something like "bundling in Wii Sports at launch".  That is execution.  Nintendo of America did it and Nintendo of Japan did not.  So, maybe Iwata is not the best at execution?  I'll concede that.  I don't think he was the best at execution.  I think he was the best at strategy.

Switch's strategy was to consolidate home and handheld onto one system.  That is 100% Iwata's idea.  He gets credit for the strategy.  I also think he was trying to follow a disruptive strategy again from "those books", but that part still remains to be seen.  But as for Switch's launch, that is execution and that was all Kimishima.



StarDoor said:
thismeintiel said:

Ah, the old overshipped argument.  The problem with that is if that is the case, then the following slower quarter/s retailers will lower shipments to get rid of the extra stock.  Care to explain to me when that occurred, because:

Q1 2016: 2.3M vs Q1 2017: 2.9M - 600K in 2017's favor, total
Q2 2016: 3.5M vs Q2 2017: 3.3M - 400K in 2017's favor, total
Q3 2016: 3.9M vs Q3 2017: 4.2M - 700K in 2017's favor, total

I guess they just love having mountains of unsold PS4's lying around at all times.  So, yea, like I said, it will be 3M-4M ahead.  And shipment data is the only concrete data we have.  There are no estimates involved.

Interesting how you exclude the holiday quarters.

Q4 2016: 9.7M vs Q4 2017: 9.0M

Both years had total shipments of 19.4M. And contrary to what you say, shipment data isn't the only concrete data we have, because Sony has announced PS4 sell-through at the ends of every calendar year to date.

End of 2015: 35.9M
End of 2016: 53.4M (+17.5M)
End of 2017: 73.6M (+20.2M)

PS4 shipped 1.9M more than it sold during 2016, and it shipped 0.8M fewer than it sold during 2017. Your data reflects the fact that PS4 had faster sell-through in 2017 than it had in 2016. It doesn't rule out over-shipping during 2016.

I excluded it because there is no way retailers would allow there to be that much stock sitting on shelves an in warehouses if the PS4 was overshipped that much 3-9 months prior.  They would have decreased shipments much sooner than 9 months later.  Still, it doesn't really matter because those units were sold by Sony, so count as sales.  You can try to explain it away why they don't count by using estimates of sell-through, but shipment numbers are what we we have and always will use to compare where consoles ended up. 

And in the end, Switch will have to sell another ~75M-85M (they should be at 50M-51M at the end of this year) to catch the PS4, which should end at ~125M-135M.



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Imagine thinking Final Fantasy VII Remake won't make PS4 sell 300M units.



Keiji said:
Imagine thinking Final Fantasy VII Remake won't make PS4 sell 300M units.

I know you're not being serious because of the ridiculous number but I imagine FFVII:R is gonna have a short-time marginal boost for PS4 hardware.



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TruckOSaurus said:
Keiji said:
Imagine thinking Final Fantasy VII Remake won't make PS4 sell 300M units.

I know you're not being serious because of the ridiculous number but I imagine FFVII:R is gonna have a short-time marginal boost for PS4 hardware.

My thoughts exactly. You nailed it.



Correct me if this is outdated info, but as I recall PS4 has the advantage of being available in a lot of developing markets where the Switch is not? If so, that's something Nintendo need to work on, broadening their reach.





Switch is leading right now.