By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Gaming Discussion - Why are the Castlevania games considered good?

Azuren said:
kljesta64 said:
super castlevania is a perfect action platformer there are no stiff controls or unfair challenges like in other games its 99% your skills and you can even moonwalk..

symphony of the night is overrated with unnecessary rpg elements and every time you die it takes forever to respawn.

long story short super castlevania is great every other castlevania game is flawed in more than one way.

So the Castlevania on SNES that broke the necessity of items is better than a literal genre definer?

 

It is perfect at what it tries to do. Balanced and 100% requisite on skill. Replayable as hell.

Castlevania hasn't been enjoyable since metroidvania and its unneccesary backtracking and leveling gubbins. Why people place SOTN over Castlevania IV is beyond me.



Around the Network
Xen said:
Azuren said:

So the Castlevania on SNES that broke the necessity of items is better than a literal genre definer?

 

It is perfect at what it tries to do. Balanced and 100% requisite on skill. Replayable as hell.

Castlevania hasn't been enjoyable since metroidvania and its unneccesary backtracking and leveling gubbins. Why people place SOTN over Castlevania IV is beyond me.

The whole point of many items and their diversity in early games was due to the whip's limited range of attack. Allowing the player to attack in any direction rendered items practically useless.

 

And people say SotN is the best because it is.



Watch me stream games and hunt trophies on my Twitch channel!

Check out my Twitch Channel!:

www.twitch.tv/AzurenGames

Azuren said:
Xen said:

It is perfect at what it tries to do. Balanced and 100% requisite on skill. Replayable as hell.

Castlevania hasn't been enjoyable since metroidvania and its unneccesary backtracking and leveling gubbins. Why people place SOTN over Castlevania IV is beyond me.

The whole point of many items and their diversity in early games was due to the whip's limited range of attack. Allowing the player to attack in any direction rendered items practically useless.

 

And people say SotN is the best because it is.

Well, I am glad to have that cleared up!



Xen said:
Azuren said:

The whole point of many items and their diversity in early games was due to the whip's limited range of attack. Allowing the player to attack in any direction rendered items practically useless.

 

And people say SotN is the best because it is.

Well, I am glad to have that cleared up!

Not really much to clear up.



Watch me stream games and hunt trophies on my Twitch channel!

Check out my Twitch Channel!:

www.twitch.tv/AzurenGames

I'm going to just focus on the original NES/Famicom game for this reply. Just because out of the non-Metroidesque entries, it's the one I'm most familiar with.

Castlevania's controls are stiff and unforgiving. Your attacks have a brief delay to them and your jumps lack the level of control that you'd normally expect. However, they are very consistent. This means that once you get used to the controls, you can plan out all of your actions accurately.

The word "planning" is an important one. Castlevania is designed to encourage caution and deliberation over quick reflexes. It's not like Konami couldn't make games with more fluid controls; they made Contra less than a year later. Castlevania is designed so that players will have to carefully look ahead and react to what's coming next.It's hard, but the game is surprisingly fair for an action game of its era in some ways. Enemy placements aren't randomized, and new types of obstacles are sorted in order of difficulty. This means that even if you lose a life, you will be able to know what's coming up ahead on your next attempt. And unlike many games of this era, losing lives or getting a Game Over isn't the end. You get ent back to the stage or set of three stages, but once you clear a boss, you are good to go. It's about mastering one section at a time.

For example, look at the opening stage of the game. You start outside of the Castle, and are given a bit of time to walk inside. This is meant to give the player enough time to figure out what all of the buttons do and how long actions take in a risk-free environment. Once you get inside, your first enemies are these easily hit zombie things. You can kill them with no problem, but since they come in groups, you'll have to mash the attack button, which helps reinforce the timing and range of the whip in your mind. Elements such as stairs are introduced in waves, first as an option for evading zombies and eventually as a requirement in the second area. The watery area down below is where you'll first die from falling into a pit, but at least the checkpoint is only about ten seconds back. And at the end, the Giant Bat boss is a nuisance, but it teaches both how to do jumping attacks and how to manage your special items, skills that remain important the entire game. And if you get a Game Over on the Giant Bat, it takes only a couple of minutes to get back, and you can prepare your arsenal with drops along the way.

Etc

  • Your HP and Boss HP are both clearly labeled, and it's easy to tell at a glance how much damage can be taken by certain types of attacks
  • Each of the different special items has different uses, both based on how they work and how many hearts they require
    • However, you can beat any section of the game without them
  • Bits of the environment hide items like Pot Roasts. These reward players for knowing the level, but are never required, thus keeping the action going.
  • Once you've met an enemy once, you will know exactly how they work, and their design is distinct enough to quickly recognize.
    • Which works greaat with the whole "deliberation" thing mentioned above
  • The six different bosses are fairly distinct. The Giant Bat is fairly basic, but will fly around a lot more than other bosses, meaning they're an especially good use for the Axe. Likewise, the two mummies take loads of hits, but are very slow, making them a good choice for the Holy Water. They all taste similar basic skills, but you can use them in different ways.
  • The game makes sure to reward progress with new settings and music. This is a platforming staple, but what's interesting here is that Castlevania does this without chaning the orange and blue color scheme. Meaning that even in new territory, it's easy to recognize enemies and obstacles.

TLDR - Level Design



Love and tolerate.

Around the Network
AngryLittleAlchemist said:
Spindel said:

All of the Castlevania games I’ve played, I have loved and still find good being able to pick up and play from time to time (even Simons Quest which takes way to much flak imo). 

Then why are you asking?

Bevause, as I tried to explain in my first post, I shouldn’t like them. I should find them frustrating and infuriating. 



Azuren said:
Like Hiku said, a big part of it is Symphony of the Night. It helped lay the groundwork for the Metroidvania genre.

Outside of that, I recommend watching this video:
https://youtu.be/V_xWHcb_AH

You might be to young to remember but Castlevania was considered an essential classic before Symphony of the night was released. 



Spindel said:

I was sittning here contemplating and it just hit me: Why are the Castelvania games good?

Because when I think Castlevania the first thing that pops into my head stiff movement controls, which as a result of this are pretty unforgiving (let us admit it: the controls of 1-3 on NES where really crap). This is normally something that would doom most of games back in the days. But somehow Castlevania managed to presist and become a classic franchise. 

Sure the controls got better later, but some of the stiffness has always persistent in all the ones I’ve played. 

All of the Castlevania games I’ve played, I have loved and still find good being able to pick up and play from time to time (even Simons Quest which takes way to much flak imo). 

Of course I’ve not played all of them so I’ve missed out on som bad ones. But I haven’t played Symphony of the Night either, which seems to be considered the best. 

The ones I’ve played (that I can think of now) are:

Castlevania 1-3 (NES)

Castlevania 4 (SNES)

 Bloodlines (Megadrive)

Dawn of Sorrow (DS)

Portrait of Ruin (DS)

 

Of and ”Bloody Tears” is the best video game song ever made (thats maybe why I like Simons Quest so much).  

The very best Castlvania games are the three that were released on the GBA which, according to your list, you never played. Try those and see if you still have the same opinion.



AlfredoTurkey said:
Spindel said:

I was sittning here contemplating and it just hit me: Why are the Castelvania games good?

Because when I think Castlevania the first thing that pops into my head stiff movement controls, which as a result of this are pretty unforgiving (let us admit it: the controls of 1-3 on NES where really crap). This is normally something that would doom most of games back in the days. But somehow Castlevania managed to presist and become a classic franchise. 

Sure the controls got better later, but some of the stiffness has always persistent in all the ones I’ve played. 

All of the Castlevania games I’ve played, I have loved and still find good being able to pick up and play from time to time (even Simons Quest which takes way to much flak imo). 

Of course I’ve not played all of them so I’ve missed out on som bad ones. But I haven’t played Symphony of the Night either, which seems to be considered the best. 

The ones I’ve played (that I can think of now) are:

Castlevania 1-3 (NES)

Castlevania 4 (SNES)

 Bloodlines (Megadrive)

Dawn of Sorrow (DS)

Portrait of Ruin (DS)

 

Of and ”Bloody Tears” is the best video game song ever made (thats maybe why I like Simons Quest so much).  

The very best Castlvania games are the three that were released on the GBA which, according to your list, you never played. Try those and see if you still have the same opinion.

I’ve allready stated that I do like the 7 (!) games in the franchise that I can remember playing. The thing is I shouldn’t, neither should most people because of the wonky controls (which are still present to some degree in the newer entries). 

 

And I don’t fully agree with Salnax analysis. 

The delayed attack I have no problems with becasue the that atleast has a animation. 

But the movement is inconsequent. Walking/running has has no (or almost no) inertia. But as soon as you are airborn it’s 100 % inertia and you can do shit about it. This is more true for the order entries but is still present to some degree in the newer ones I,ve played. Also the jump you make when taking damage can make you go berserk. 



If you played NES games, you should know why classic Castlevania stuck out from the pack. They changed the formula with Simon's Quest and core gameplay with Super 4, but always reverted back to original old-timey whip mechanics & stage structure. People love the series, warts, stairs, medusa heads and all.

"Modern" 2D Castlevania (aka metroidvania) is looser and much more forgiving. People love a good open Metroid-style map, and they come out so sparingly that more are always welcomed.